1 Planet, 2 Opposing Warp-Capable Nations

[Arpy]

What would happen? I don't think they could wipe each other out because, heck, we today have Mutually Assured Destruction via our primitive nukes should anyone try anything - let alone with whatever weapons people who've achieved FTL travel might have. So what would happen if on a planet [at least two] opposing nations separately achieve warp technology?

...There's a conceit in how I'm looking at this...that, normally, by the time a people achieve such a level of understanding of how to manipulate the natural world, they've learned also the benefits and possibilities of living in peace and prosperity with all their kin. But say that doesn't happen on some exotic alien world. Who knows, it may not happen on this one. But say on some planet whose natives are still using ancient, entrenched systems of governance, they stumble upon an advanced alien ship and successfully reverse engineer it independently...or by one spying on the other which actually has the ship. ...Such a scenario being necessary or one nation would have succesfully destroyed, conquered, absorbed, or otherwise outmaneuvered the other out of existance. Or say they're a newly free world, previously pre-warp, of a more advanced alien race. Were the Klingons war-capable before the Norman, er, invasion?

How might opposing nations deal with each other? Would they try economic or cold warfare? Would they try fighting it out off-planet? But what happens when one side knows it's losing and threatens it all? Were the Kesprit warp-capable?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Were the Kesprit warp-capable?

We never saw it, but they must have been, otherwise the Federation wouldn't have considered them for membership.

 

[hyzmarca]

There are several possibilities:

UN Federation - The planet's many sates consent to federate, forming a single overgovernment that deals with international and interstellar issues, while the individual states remain as they were.

Unification War - A possible component of over options, one side forms a large alliance that supports unification, and things hit a tipping point, resulting in an all out mostly conventional war between various factions.

Independent space exploration - The warp capable nations explore space, trade, and make treaties independent of each other. They may use their new power to bring smaller ideologically compatible states under their wings. This may include proxy conflicts among smaller states.

Corporate Dominance - In such a situation, it is likely that controls on space travel will be lax, since businesses that wish to exploit space would choose the most lax state to set up their operations in. The result is that most interstellar trade would be controlled by multinational for-profit business entities. Being able to trade across national boarders, either directly or by proxy using offworld allies, and bringing in the majority of the world's GPD by exploiting alien technologies, these entities would become the major political powers on the planet, eventually reducing the states themselves to irrelevance.

 

[Myasishchev]

^A Brief History of the Ferengi?

 

[Gotham Central]

Such a situation would not be sustainable in a galaxy as crowded as Trek's Milkyway. A divided planet is an easily exploited or conquered planet. Its likely that the Federation would have little to do with them and might even take steps to limit their reach beyond their own solar system. If the Federation will not deal with them, that would mean that they could only establish relations with some of the less savory worlds, empires or alliances. Again I say that such a world would not remain independent for very long.

 

[apenpaap]

Earth wasn't united yet when they achieved warp speed (Kobayashi Maru says Earth got united in 2150), and I doubt no country other then America developed warp drive in these 90 years. But of course, there were the Vulcans watching over us and stuff. Also, Earth had just come out of a nuclear holocaust, so I doubt many people really wantd to fight.

OTOH, if say America and the Soviet Union had developed warp drive a century earlier (in the 1960s), then they would probably have used it to find interstellar allies, or to put antimatter nukes on Mars and stuff like that.

 

[Gotham Central]

Earth wasn't united yet when they achieved warp speed (Kobayashi Maru says Earth got united in 2150), and I doubt no country other then America developed warp drive in these 90 years. But of course, there were the Vulcans watching over us and stuff. Also, Earth had just come out of a nuclear holocaust, so I doubt many people really wantd to fight.

OTOH, if say America and the Soviet Union had developed warp drive a century earlier (in the 1960s), then they would probably have used it to find interstellar allies, or to put antimatter nukes on Mars and stuff like that.

You're confusing two separate issues. There did not need to be a formal United Earth government when the Vulcans arrived. All you need is some sort of coordinating body authorised to speak for Earth in interstellar matters. For instance, if Aliens arrived on Earth tomorrow, its a good bet that the United Nations Security Council would act as the collective voice of the world even though it is not a world government.

 

[Myasishchev]

^But since the UN has no sovereign authority, aliens that desired any sort of intercourse beyond "hi, what's up, you're not alone, etc." would have to deal with nations.

I think that Earth's nations might be easily convinced to present a united front to a fantastically advanced alien civilization capable of bombing us out of existence from orbit, however.

 

[Anwar]

I dunno, ever seen the Outer Limits episode "Trial by Fire"? The US and Russia end up getting themselves obliterated.

 

[Myasishchev]

I faintly recall it. Well, it's a possibility.

 

[Sci]

Earth wasn't united yet when they achieved warp speed (Kobayashi Maru says Earth got united in 2150), and I doubt no country other then America developed warp drive in these 90 years. But of course, there were the Vulcans watching over us and stuff. Also, Earth had just come out of a nuclear holocaust, so I doubt many people really wantd to fight.

OTOH, if say America and the Soviet Union had developed warp drive a century earlier (in the 1960s), then they would probably have used it to find interstellar allies, or to put antimatter nukes on Mars and stuff like that.

You're confusing two separate issues. There did not need to be a formal United Earth government when the Vulcans arrived. All you need is some sort of coordinating body authorised to speak for Earth in interstellar matters. For instance, if Aliens arrived on Earth tomorrow, its a good bet that the United Nations Security Council would act as the collective voice of the world even though it is not a world government.

Don't be silly. The United States and the other First World and emerging powers would never allow the UN to monopolize relations with aliens.

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

Earth wasn't united yet when they achieved warp speed (Kobayashi Maru says Earth got united in 2150), and I doubt no country other then America developed warp drive in these 90 years. But of course, there were the Vulcans watching over us and stuff. Also, Earth had just come out of a nuclear holocaust, so I doubt many people really wantd to fight.

OTOH, if say America and the Soviet Union had developed warp drive a century earlier (in the 1960s), then they would probably have used it to find interstellar allies, or to put antimatter nukes on Mars and stuff like that.

I bet the Chinese bought Warp techology.

 

[captcalhoun]

there's a UN protocol governing alien contact. NASA's signed up with it. basically once they're sure any alien radio signal (or possibly a sub-light ship crossing the system) is genuine and not BS, NASA informs the US government and the UN and then they decide whether to contact the aliens or not and if so, what to say.

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

If it's up to the UN then it will be a signal of surrender and offer all the money in the coffers of the US only for the aliens.

 

[JB2005]

^Could be worse..."Let's get the EU involved" (shudders at the thought)

Seemingly though a nation would be free to negotiate with Aliens on its own (as we saw on SG1)

 

[Deranged Nasat]

For instance, if Aliens arrived on Earth tomorrow, its a good bet that the United Nations Security Council would act as the collective voice of the world even though it is not a world government.

Gods help us all...

 

[Deranged Nasat]

Seemingly though a nation would be free to negotiate with Aliens on its own (as we saw on SG1)

Gods help us all...

 

[JB2005]

To be fair though, try suggesting that we set up a body for the sole purpose of representing the planet Earth to the rest of the galaxy...

 

[Deranged Nasat]

To be fair though, try suggesting that we set up a body for the sole purpose of representing the planet Earth to the rest of the galaxy...

Oh, indeed, that would be a disaster. To be honest, I think if I had to suggest a group of people to represent our world to any visiting alien dignitaries, I would probably pick the contributors to the Trek bbs. I'm at least half serious. Trek fans would do a far better job than any politicians or diplomats I can think of.

 

[USS Triumphant]

There are several possibilities:

UN Federation - The planet's many sates consent to federate, forming a single overgovernment that deals with international and interstellar issues, while the individual states remain as they were.

Unification War - A possible component of over options, one side forms a large alliance that supports unification, and things hit a tipping point, resulting in an all out mostly conventional war between various factions.

Independent space exploration - The warp capable nations explore space, trade, and make treaties independent of each other. They may use their new power to bring smaller ideologically compatible states under their wings. This may include proxy conflicts among smaller states.

Corporate Dominance - In such a situation, it is likely that controls on space travel will be lax, since businesses that wish to exploit space would choose the most lax state to set up their operations in. The result is that most interstellar trade would be controlled by multinational for-profit business entities. Being able to trade across national boarders, either directly or by proxy using offworld allies, and bringing in the majority of the world's GPD by exploiting alien technologies, these entities would become the major political powers on the planet, eventually reducing the states themselves to irrelevance.

I like these, and will add -

Warp or Antimatter Tech Related Extinction - Whether from an intentional act of war or an accident resulting from international tensions, don't count out this possibility. It only takes a very small ship impacting your planet at a significant fraction of c to give everyone the Worst Day Evar.

We're Out HERE, Now, Suckas! - The space programs and colonization efforts recruit the best and brightest of each nation, who find they have more in common with each other than with the idgits running "their" nations back on the homeworld. They form an alliance and either conquer their homeworld, use leverage to force it to agree to terms, or just leave it to languish in its own pollution and stupidity.

We Were Lucky "They" Were Vulcans - Early in the warp tests of the various nations, the warp signatures are detected by an alien race. Not Vulcans. The Hur'q. Or the Borg.