Orphan Black - Season 2 Discussion

[Ar-Pharazon]

^ Could be, and with Art still looking at the case, I hope we'll hear more about it.

Also, there's got to be a lot more as to why Beth killed herself. There must have been some serious thing she found out, probably from Maggie Chen, that pushed her over the edge.

 

[tomalak301]

...Cosima is so naive. I do wonder though if that's her character. Alison's the Soccer Mom, Sarah is the paranoid Runner (Like Lola in Run Lola Run) and Cosima is the naive scientist, believing that science will give her all the answers.

Where did society get this bizarre idea that being a scientist makes one naive? It should be just the opposite. Naivete is accepting things without question, and the whole point of the scientific method is to question everything and take nothing for granted. Skepticism is at the very heart of scientific thought. So if Cosima is naive, it's not because she's a scientist.

I don't know but I have seen it as a archetype before. It might also have more to do with her age (She's what, 28? ) too.

 

[Christopher]

I suppose it could be based on the assumption that scientists are socially naive and nerdy, which isn't totally without merit but is an excessive generalization. But a lot of fiction blows it up into this bizarre prejudice that scientists are somehow more blinded to truth than everyone else, even though science is in reality the most powerful tool for devising truth ever conceived, since it's about actually finding out how things work rather than just taking things on faith.

 

[Aldo]

I initially did say I had an issue with Cosima and how she seems to be out for her own agenda. But after looking at how Sarah is acting now (running off with Kira and Felix without any thought to the other clones), and not forgetting Alison signing the agreement last season to get Leekie off her back (or so she thinks). It appears that being out for yourself is a trait among the clones, so it's not something I can really hold against Cosima.

 

[davejames]

Gotta say, as much as I love watching the clones do their thing, I'm still not really feeling this Prolethean conspiracy storyline so far, or whatever it is this cult is up to. Things were already vague and murky enough with the Neolutionists and their agenda, and having this second group in the mix only makes it worse.

I frankly found the more straightforward threats last season to be far more engaging, whether it was the cops investigating Sarah or Helena hunting down and killing the clones.

In fact part of me is starting to wonder if we already saw the most interesting part of this story-- the clones discovering each other for the first time while realizing they're being monitored.

 

[Aldo]

It's only murky because we don't know how it all fits together yet.

I've a feeling the Prolethean's believe in natural evolution and we know the Neolutionists want to be able to force evolution amongst themselves by changing genes within each person. Which I think is what lead to the cloning program (or it could be the other way around). Still, I think the cloning program is being used in some way as a trial run for bigger and better things from the Neolutionist's perspective.

 

[Christopher]

But after looking at how Sarah is acting now (running off with Kira and Felix without any thought to the other clones), and not forgetting Alison signing the agreement last season to get Leekie off her back (or so she thinks). It appears that being out for yourself is a trait among the clones, so it's not something I can really hold against Cosima.

I think that's completely unfair. Sarah isn't doing any of this for herself -- she's doing it for Kira. Everything she's done from the beginning of this series has been about Kira. She's a mother putting the safety of her child above all other considerations. Can you really call that selfish?

Gotta say, as much as I love watching the clones do their thing, I'm still not really feeling this Prolethean conspiracy storyline so far, or whatever it is this cult is up to. Things were already vague and murky enough with the Neolutionists and their agenda, and having this second group in the mix only makes it worse.

But the Prolethean/Neolutionist conflict has been a driving force of the series from the start. The only thing different now is that we're learning more about the Proletheans, getting to see more of them than just crazy Tomas and his brutality in the name of faith.

I frankly found the more straightforward threats last season to be far more engaging, whether it was the cops investigating Sarah or Helena hunting down and killing the clones.

Did we watch the same show? It abandoned any pretense of being a straightforward procedural after about three or four episodes.

 

[Aldo]

Yes, you're right. She is doing it for Kira, but she's abandoning everyone (except Felix) for Kira. it's something that she was always planning on doing from the start. It's just that she got mixed up in Beth's life and problems that kept her around longer than she intended. Perhaps calling her selfish is a bit unfair, but I'm not the only one that's used that word regarding Sarah.

 

[Christopher]

It's not the first time Sarah's been tempted to take Kira and run away. Last time, though, she chose to stay and help others. Maybe she'll do the same this time. We don't know how it plays out yet, so it's too early to judge.

 

[Aldo]

I believe I mentioned this upthread too, but if she took off indefinitely there wouldn't be much a a show

 

[Christopher]

^Sure, but it's a question of whether she chooses to stay or is forced to by circumstances beyond her control.

Then again... By its very nature, this is one show where you could drop the lead character without having to lose the lead actress. Theoretically Sarah could be offscreen for a few episodes while Allison and Cosima and Rachel and whoever carried the storyline.

 

[sojourner]

Or they could have part of each episode being Sarah, Felix, and Kira's madcap adventures on the run. Encountering other clones, righting wrongs, trying to find a way home.

 

[Aldo]

^Sure, but it's a question of whether she chooses to stay or is forced to by circumstances beyond her control.

Then again... By its very nature, this is one show where you could drop the lead character without having to lose the lead actress. Theoretically Sarah could be offscreen for a few episodes while Allison and Cosima and Rachel and whoever carried the storyline.

I recall a discussion along those lines in last years thread where everyone surmised that killing Sarah wouldn't necessarily end the show. At the time I thought it'd be a ballsy move to off Sarah and have another clone take center stage (because as you said, we'd still retain the lead actress).

However at this stage I think Sarah is solidified as the main protagonist, it is her POV that we are following after all.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Really, because all I'm thinking about is Dark Allison going Dexter on Donnie next week.

 

[auntiehill]

I love Alison. I wonder if she's going to bust out the hot-glue gun on her hubby again?

 

[Guy Gardener]

That was to get answers.

She has all the answers now.

Now she just wants to be safe.

Safe and loved.

In whatever plan she comes up with, and it is going to be a crazy plan, you have to remember that she has to consider that she has two children she doesn't want to see thrown back into the system.

The least she has to do is empty the joint bank account, put his stuff on the lawn, change the locks, and then wait for her ridiculously generous alimony settlement to break his soul.

 

[Aldo]

m.

The least she has to do is empty the joint bank account, put his stuff on the lawn, change the locks, and then wait for the alimony payments to break his soul.

That's all she has to do were he a normal husband, but he's not. Being her monitor, I'm sure he'd make it really hard for her to cut him out of her life.

 

[Guy Gardener]

We know that Donny is a fat stupid loser.

The people paying him to be her monitor, and paying handsomely since he went back after the torture are paying him to be not worried about the next bout of torture. If he was smart, he should have negotiated a raise and bonus. But with the new evidence at hand, I don't think Donnie is smart after seeing his "stealth moves" in that grave yard today.

He's a fat stupid loser.

Does she think that Donnie is only pretending to be a fat stupid loser, or does she not know that he is a fat stupid loser?

There's a %99 chance that his job that paid for that house is sourced entirely by the Dyad institute and that it will vanish if he stops opening the door once once a month to let the spook scientists commit medical experiments on his drugged unconscious wife.

Is that any definition of love?

That's the only reason Donnie would have gone back to her after the hot glue, well maybe for the kids, but with him I think that the cable package is more important to him than his children.

An adult that still allows himself to be called "Donnie" and isn't in the mob, has to be a little bit retarded.

Don or Donald.

Yes he could lose weight, but he's still stupid.

 

[Mister Fandango]

Didn't they imply that he was some kind of former military special forces guy last season though, with the hidden cache of personal information from before the marriage? If he's just a bumbling idiot, I don't get what that whole storyline was about.

 

[Aldo]

I just rewatched the whole first season this last week and I don't remember any mention of that.