Orci strikes back

[ComicGuy89]

Yep.

As much as TOS was some of the smartest writing of its day, it was still largely a western in tone, set in space: Ride into town, whoo the lady of the episode, shut up the bad guy, ride out. Now not every episode was that basic. But the philosophy between TOS and TNG are miles apart.

I go back to TOS, but I liked TNG fine. However, yes, they are miles apart in many ways, and I think they should be thought of and appreciated that way. TOS was smartly written, but it also had its campy and swashbuckling sides that TNG didn't have. More often than not, action drove the story and Kirk was almost always the center of the action.
The typical TNG format seemed more like detective show or mystery movie centered around an ensemble cast with different roles to fill in solving the story. It opened with an initial mystery or conflict, then moved on to showing its effects, there would be analysis, a crisis, then finally a revelation and a resolution.

They're so different, it frankly strikes me that there's really no logical reason to expect someone to like both.

TOS was very much pulp-magazine style sci-fi: Light, quick, fun sci-fi, that you could carry in your back pocket. Sure you had a recurring cast of characters, but overall the series was very much more like an anthology style of story telling.

Now this, I would have to agree with. I would have to argue that TNG set a different tone from TOS, one that was to be the standard of all subsequent Star Trek shows, including Enterprise.

For me, I found the new movies to be quite evocative of TOS, especially after watching TOS on blu-ray recently.

 

[Hober Mallow]

For me, I found the new movies to be quite evocative of TOS, especially after watching TOS on blu-ray recently.

I completely disagree, and I started watching Trek with TOS before TNG existed. Honestly, though, I don't really care how evocative of the original series the new movies are. Just give me a good story. There's got to be potential for better stories than just "Evil Bad Guy out for revenge."

 

[Opus]

Good for Orci, deleting his Twitter account.

I hope the next movie has a scene where a ship filled with 100 redshirts warps into Klingon space and is immediately destroyed by a Klingon warship. For no good reason. At all.

 

[Hober Mallow]

I guess those who said it was OK for him to tell the fans to fuck off were right after all. He is under no obligation to interact with the fans at all and now he isn't. Pity.

Back in the day, when Isaac Asimov was first getting stories published, readers of the SF magazines would write reviews of, or simply share their thoughts on, the stories being published. When readers would criticize an Asimov story, he would write back, sometimes angrily, and tell the readers why they were wrong. I think it was L. Sprague De Camp who finally took Asimov aside and said, "Jesus Christ, Isaac, just let the readers have their opinions."

 

[SeerSGB]

Orci has deleted his Twitter account.

http://blogs.indiewire.com/theplayl...roberto-orci-deletes-twitter-account-20130911

Of course, we have no way of knowing his reasons for doing so but I can't help but think that the recent unfortunate exchange with fans has somewhat soured the situation. I have always thought he should have maintained a professional distance from the fans but as some have stated on this thread, that wall had come down long ago.

I guess those who said it was OK for him to tell the fans to fuck off were right after all. He is under no obligation to interact with the fans at all and now he isn't. Pity.

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

Bunch of fucking jack asses.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

For me, I found the new movies to be quite evocative of TOS, especially after watching TOS on blu-ray recently.

Totally agree, particularly for the 2009 one.

 

[Opus]

^Both for me. Love it!

 

[suarezguy]

One of my criticisms against the new films is that, his tactical decision to use Khan aside (maybe), Kirk is portrayed as always being right, rarely internally conflicted and has changed little while Spock is portrayed as growing by becoming more like him and accepting of his style.

Fair enough. But to offer a counterpoint, I thought Kirk was shown to be dead wrong many times in the film. 1. Reckless endangerment of the Enterprise and her crew even if the goal is noble. 2. Blatant disregard for policy.

Where was the first? If both refer to the Prime Directive issue in the prologue, the film seemed to approve of his disregarding it (and to be very inconsistent in how seriously Starfleet officers and higher-ups regarded it).

3. Naively believing at the start of the movie that he deserved the five-year mission. 4. Falling prey to Marcus: "I'm Sorry." 5. Believing that everything will turn out alright in the end because he's Jim Kirk and he doesn't believe in no-win scenarios. Yet, he faces a real no-win scenario. He has to die to save the ship. So, he's wrong many times in the movie. And his realization at the end of the movie is that he's not always right, and he's surrounded by good people that he should listen too. (Think he'll ever blow off Scotty's opinion again?)

There was indeed some growth with those developments (although his demotion was too brief and it seemed that Marcus fooled almost everyone).

 

[Hober Mallow]

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

No one forced Orci to make himself look like a fool. He did that all by himself.

 

[SeerSGB]

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

No one forced Orci to make himself look like a fool. He did that all by himself.

And no one forced that assholes to behave like assholes. He responded to them. And he didn't look like a fool, he looked like a man that had enough of him and his colleagues being bashed repeatedly by a bunch of spoiled children.

But yeah, I'm sure it won't shut people up about it and they'll be able to piss and moan again about how the writers don't listen to the fans.

 

[HaplessCrewman]

Orci has deleted his Twitter account.

http://blogs.indiewire.com/theplayl...roberto-orci-deletes-twitter-account-20130911

Of course, we have no way of knowing his reasons for doing so but I can't help but think that the recent unfortunate exchange with fans has somewhat soured the situation. I have always thought he should have maintained a professional distance from the fans but as some have stated on this thread, that wall had come down long ago.

I guess those who said it was OK for him to tell the fans to fuck off were right after all. He is under no obligation to interact with the fans at all and now he isn't. Pity.

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

Bunch of fucking jack asses.

Yeah, I'm sure that's what Orci is thinking - that the fans are a bunch of "fucking jack assses". That's exactly the reason why he apologized.

I can hardly wait until another person on the Trek team tells the fans to fuck off. I'm sure you would approve.

You win.

 

[SeerSGB]

Orci has deleted his Twitter account.

http://blogs.indiewire.com/theplayl...roberto-orci-deletes-twitter-account-20130911

Of course, we have no way of knowing his reasons for doing so but I can't help but think that the recent unfortunate exchange with fans has somewhat soured the situation. I have always thought he should have maintained a professional distance from the fans but as some have stated on this thread, that wall had come down long ago.

I guess those who said it was OK for him to tell the fans to fuck off were right after all. He is under no obligation to interact with the fans at all and now he isn't. Pity.

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

Bunch of fucking jack asses.

Yeah, I'm sure that's what Orci is thinking - that the fans are a bunch of "fucking jack assses". That's exactly the reason why he apologized.

I can hardly wait until another person on the Trek team tells the fans to fuck off. I'm sure you would approve.

You win.

Wouldn't bother me if he said it to my face. If you're acting like a fucking jackass don't expect someone not to get mad at you over it. Could he have handled it better? Sure. Did he have to? Nope. It was brutal, it was honest, and a well deserved slap in the face to the jackasses.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Some "fans" should fuck off.

 

[Commishsleer]

Whoo-hoo a bunch of asshole fans chased a member of the production off twitter and fucked over direct interaction witht he production whoo-hoo! They's so k00lz!

No one forced Orci to make himself look like a fool. He did that all by himself.

Look I don't need to interact with Orci. Frankly I don't think my opinions are/should be that important to him.

But there are others out there who enjoyed it and probably Orci did a bit too.

Now no-one has that opportunity.

Say if GR were still alive and I met him, I wouldn't ask him about the 'bad' things he's accused of, if I could actually talk at this point I'd thank him for starting Star Trek etc. If he posted here I'd make sure I was a bit more respectful with my posts about him.
And also I've made a bit of a joke about Shatner's looks on one thread (which I truly believe LOL) but if he were posting here I'd just shut my big mouth. Not because I was a hypocrite but because he also deserves respect and I don't want to spoil it for everyone else.
Same with Orci or any of the other artists who worked on Star Trek.

 

[BillJ]

I can hardly wait until another person on the Trek team tells the fans to fuck off. I'm sure you would approve.

You win.

You know what would solve this? If some fans would quit acting like entitled jackasses.

 

[M'Sharak]

Know what would be really nice? If certain fans would desist from taking swipes at certain other fans and/or groups thereof. That would be swell.

I wag my finger at those to whom this applies.

(Y'all know who you are.)

 

[Kruezerman]

Incoming finger wag. Sound collision.

 

[Tosk]

Yeah, I'm sure that's what Orci is thinking - that the fans are a bunch of "fucking jack assses". That's exactly the reason why he apologized.

When exactly did he apologize? Not that I'm saying he should, I'm just curious.

For me, I couldn't care less about the threat that "the fans will no longer be listened to." You know how people keep mentioning spoiled children and entitled fans? Orci is one of them too. He's a Trek fan who thinks he's better than "those fans". Does no one else see the irony there?

 

[SeerSGB]

Yeah, I'm sure that's what Orci is thinking - that the fans are a bunch of "fucking jack assses". That's exactly the reason why he apologized.

When exactly did he apologize? Not that I'm saying he should, I'm just curious.

For me, I couldn't care less about the threat that "the fans will no longer be listened to." You know how people keep mentioning spoiled children and entitled fans? Orci is one of them too. He's a Trek fan who thinks he's better than "those fans". Does no one else see the irony there?

He apologized on his--now defunct--twitter account. There was some caps floating around of it.

Actually, he is better than "those fans". Same as any of the production team over the years. They made it. They got called up to the big leagues. So, yeah they are better than those of us taking the piss on a messageboard. He was/is right: if you think you can do better, do better. Create a script that revitalizes a floundering franchise, meets the expectations of the studio and the mass market, and make it a success. Put the hours in and fight the fights that go along with the business.

Being critical of the work, the content is one thing. But when you go after the person--as Orci and others on the production have been in some cases--it just comes off as jealous children throwing stones.

If you're not in the game, you don't get to call the plays, only comment on the result.

Harlan's Wisdom that needs repeating about the relationship between fans and writers.

 

[Tosk]

If you're not in the game, you don't get to call the plays, only comment on the result.

Isn't that all we're doing? Commenting on the result?