Star Trek and Homosexuality

[DAYoung]

But it'd still be brave for Trek to have same-sex couples (or triples and quadruples, for the Denubulans out there). Not female bodies with sexless slugs, not crazed bisexual control freaks, just couples who happen to be the same sex.

I'm not too pleased about the crazed bisexuals either. Not my idea of a good role model. But then again, even some open-minded people in this thread seem to think being bisexual equals not being able to being in a committed relationship.

Yes, it's a silly conflation: committing to one gender and committing to one person. Not the same thing.

Having said this - and speculating wildly - it is possible that, given the stigma associated with homosexuality, some strongly extroverted types were more willing to express their same-sex desires. And strong extroversion, from memory, often comes with an increased likelihood of straying.

This does NOT mean bisexuality equals lack of commitment. It means that in more conservative societies, only the most extroverted are willing to reveal their bisexuality. And they're also more likely to be the ones with roaming eyes.

But as I said, I'm speculating wildly...

 

[Miss Lemon]

Bisexuals who are in longterm committed relationships are usually viewed upon as either gay or heterosexual depending on the gender of their partner.

 

[DAYoung]

Bisexuals who are in longterm committed relationships are usually viewed upon as either gay or heterosexual depending on the gender of their partner.

That sounds about right.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

The Host dealt with a response from Beverly, who rejected her lover because its new host was female.

Oh crap! Yes of course it was.

I was getting myself confused with "The Outcast". Don't know why.

 

[USS KG5]

When Trek did do gay storylines, like in Rejoined in DS9, it did cause an enormous fuss.

Did it? What was the fuss/response?

Got blown into a bit of a media storm, as another poster said it was touched on slightly on the DVD.

It was actually one of the most open minded episodes trek did on the subject. It was never even mentioned they were both women, so it could be implied that all the characters had no issue with same sex relationships.

It really does surprise me people actually HATE so much, if two guys want to get together it doesn't do anyone any harm, live and let live. I'd have thought this was fairly fundamental to the Trek universe, at least in the TNG era.

 

[Deckerd]

The TNG era wasn't ready for that sort of thing. I'm surprised it didn't crop up in the later manifestations of the show.

 

[Sindatur]

The Mirror Universe Homosexuality, was actually more of a slap in the face then anything. The Mirror Universe is evil and twisted, so, it's OK to show same sex attraction (since only evil and twisted people do it ), but, even then, it was only the women, never saw any indication of men hankering for men.

Rejoined, was handled very well, though, IMHO.

 

[DAYoung]

Honestly, Garak and Bashir should've had a fling. Everyone can see it.

And by 'everyone', I mean everyone important. And by 'everyone important', I mean folks who agree with me.

 

[Sindatur]

Honestly, Garak and Bashir should've had a fling. Everyone can see it.

And by 'everyone', I mean everyone important. And by 'everyone important', I mean folks who agree with me.

Including Adrew Robinson, who played it that way, and was actually told to tone it down by the Powers that Be

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Garak was gay. Bashir didn't really seem to be. Not sure a fling would have made sense but to make it more obvious that Garak was gay (there were plenty of hints) would have been fine.

I used to wonder if the story about Dukat and Garak's feud might involve some incident when they were younger that Dukat was eager to squelch by having Garak exiled someplace where nobody important in Cardassian society might hear the sordid story.

Which is just a roundabout way of saying, if you're going to have a gay character, it would be a good idea to make use of it somehow. Just because Fed society is beyond being bigoted about homosexuality does not mean all societies are. It doesn't seem likely that Cardassian society would be enlightened in that regards, since they aren't in so many other ways.

 

[The Castellan]

When Trek did do gay storylines, like in Rejoined in DS9, it did cause an enormous fuss.

Did it? What was the fuss/response?

Got blown into a bit of a media storm, as another poster said it was touched on slightly on the DVD.

It was actually one of the most open minded episodes trek did on the subject. It was never even mentioned they were both women, so it could be implied that all the characters had no issue with same sex relationships.

It really does surprise me people actually HATE so much, if two guys want to get together it doesn't do anyone any harm, live and let live. I'd have thought this was fairly fundamental to the Trek universe, at least in the TNG era.

Naw, the Trek fandom's got a lot of close minded folks, not just about sexuality, but on a whole range of subjects.

 

[Amaris]

Honestly, Garak and Bashir should've had a fling. Everyone can see it.

And by 'everyone', I mean everyone important. And by 'everyone important', I mean folks who agree with me.

Including Adrew Robinson, who played it that way, and was actually told to tone it down by the Powers that Be

Just another reason to love Andrew Robinson, IMO.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Bashir seems generally confused about a lot of things and I think he should have had the opportunity to work out some of that confusion with Garak.

 

[Ian Keldon]

"The Host"
"Rejoined"
several MU eps

In the Host, Riker's girlfriend was literally a girl. She was part of a androgynous society, but the dialog made clear she was female. There was no homosexuality in the episode.

Wrong episode. I'm talking about the first Trill episode. The ambassador had a fling with Dr Crusher as a male then got put in a female host.

From Rejoined, Former Dax joining Torias Dax was male. And former Khan joining Nilani Kahn was female, They were married to each other and presumably had lots of heterosexual sex with each other. Jadzia Dax and Lenara Kahn (two females) did have attraction for each other, but was it because of their current sexual orientations, or their previous heterosexual relationship? They did exchanged in a "for old times sake" kiss, but did not engage in sex.

Didn't they? It's implied that they did at least once (off screen).

The impression I received from the mirror Attendant Kira, was that her bisexuality was a power game, and not a expression of orientation.

Strictly speaking, she wasn't gay.

Mirror Ezri was also lesbian.

 

[Ian Keldon]

But it'd still be brave for Trek to have same-sex couples (or triples and quadruples, for the Denubulans out there). Not female bodies with sexless slugs, not crazed bisexual control freaks, just couples who happen to be the same sex.

Phase II did it, and it didn't detract from the story at all. I can't say I was entirely comfortable with it, but I don't see this as a reason not to do it.

On the contrary, Phase II did it exactly the way I feared they would: big, bold, flag-waving, "look...a GAY scene". Gerrald went out of his way to insert "fluff" scenes to showcase the homosexual relationship and draw attention to it.

Which is why it came out as preachy and generally cringe worthy.

 

[Amaris]

But it'd still be brave for Trek to have same-sex couples (or triples and quadruples, for the Denubulans out there). Not female bodies with sexless slugs, not crazed bisexual control freaks, just couples who happen to be the same sex.

Phase II did it, and it didn't detract from the story at all. I can't say I was entirely comfortable with it, but I don't see this as a reason not to do it.

On the contrary, Phase II did it exactly the way I feared they would: big, bold, flag-waving, "look...a GAY scene". Gerrald went out of his way to insert "fluff" scenes to showcase the homosexual relationship and draw attention to it.

Which is why it came out as preachy and generally cringe worthy.

I just found it sexy (and sweet), really.

 

[DAYoung]

But it'd still be brave for Trek to have same-sex couples (or triples and quadruples, for the Denubulans out there). Not female bodies with sexless slugs, not crazed bisexual control freaks, just couples who happen to be the same sex.

Phase II did it, and it didn't detract from the story at all. I can't say I was entirely comfortable with it, but I don't see this as a reason not to do it.

On the contrary, Phase II did it exactly the way I feared they would: big, bold, flag-waving, "look...a GAY scene". Gerrald went out of his way to insert "fluff" scenes to showcase the homosexual relationship and draw attention to it.

Which is why it came out as preachy and generally cringe worthy.

Possibly. Though it didn't strike me as any more 'flag-waving' than Kirk's romantic plots and sub-plots. Slightly more tender than some, if anything.

 

[BillJ]

It really does surprise me people actually HATE so much, if two guys want to get together it doesn't do anyone any harm, live and let live. I'd have thought this was fairly fundamental to the Trek universe, at least in the TNG era.

TNG actually ended up being more conservative than TOS when you look at the hurdles each had to go through to get stories on the air.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

But it'd still be brave for Trek to have same-sex couples (or triples and quadruples, for the Denubulans out there). Not female bodies with sexless slugs, not crazed bisexual control freaks, just couples who happen to be the same sex.

Phase II did it, and it didn't detract from the story at all. I can't say I was entirely comfortable with it, but I don't see this as a reason not to do it.

On the contrary, Phase II did it exactly the way I feared they would: big, bold, flag-waving, "look...a GAY scene". Gerrald went out of his way to insert "fluff" scenes to showcase the homosexual relationship and draw attention to it.

Which is why it came out as preachy and generally cringe worthy.

I too felt that there was "flag-waving" (and Trek has done that in other cases)....where I felt it could have had the characters and scenes immersed in the story as everyday people and situations...

(And, this is coming from a bisexual African-American male).

 

[Deckerd]

Garak was gay. Bashir didn't really seem to be. Not sure a fling would have made sense but to make it more obvious that Garak was gay (there were plenty of hints) would have been fine.

I used to wonder if the story about Dukat and Garak's feud might involve some incident when they were younger that Dukat was eager to squelch by having Garak exiled someplace where nobody important in Cardassian society might hear the sordid story.

Which is just a roundabout way of saying, if you're going to have a gay character, it would be a good idea to make use of it somehow. Just because Fed society is beyond being bigoted about homosexuality does not mean all societies are. It doesn't seem likely that Cardassian society would be enlightened in that regards, since they aren't in so many other ways.

Is it wrong of me to think that Gark and Damar would have been hawt?