Endgame

[Gary7]

Voyager getting home ahead of schedule "reboots" the future. The Admiral Janeway we saw thus became a temporal paradox. Her death only cleaned things up, removing the last traces of the other timeline.

That's the great thing about this kind of time travel... you change the past and then the "new future" wouldn't have any clue about the change.

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her? Well, that would put too much of a burden on the premise of that episode. Suffice it to say, they probably saw that there was more of a benefit than a detriment, and allowed it to take place.

 

[antiquityscion]

Voyager getting home ahead of schedule "reboots" the future. The Admiral Janeway we saw thus became a temporal paradox. Her death only cleaned things up, removing the last traces of the other timeline.

That's the great thing about this kind of time travel... you change the past and then the "new future" wouldn't have any clue about the change.

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her? Well, that would put too much of a burden on the premise of that episode. Suffice it to say, they probably saw that there was more of a benefit than a detriment, and allowed it to take place.

Unfortunately, by following that same logic, Star Trek 11 negates TOS, TNG, DS9, and VOY!

 

[Guy Gardener]

You didn't figure that out while watching Star trek 11?

 

[F. King Daniel]

Voyager getting home ahead of schedule "reboots" the future. The Admiral Janeway we saw thus became a temporal paradox. Her death only cleaned things up, removing the last traces of the other timeline.

That's the great thing about this kind of time travel... you change the past and then the "new future" wouldn't have any clue about the change.

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her? Well, that would put too much of a burden on the premise of that episode. Suffice it to say, they probably saw that there was more of a benefit than a detriment, and allowed it to take place.

Or they're from the branch of the future Admiral Janeway created in "Endgame", so to them it was always meant to be.

 

[Deckerd]

Time behaves completely differently in the Star Trek universe, along with every other law of physics. Therefore there's no reason why different timelines can't co-exist.

 

[{ Emilia }]

Time behaves completely differently in the Star Trek universe, along with every other law of physics. Therefore there's no reason why different timelines can't co-exist.

What Deckerd said.

And:

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsGWdGhYKtY[/yt]

 

[Gaith]

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her?

I'd explain it, but there's a lot of math.

 

[propita]

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her?

I'd explain it, but there's a lot of math.

Not if Janeway's going back in time was a part of their past all along, and all they had to do was "wait it out" for it to happen.

Here's one: Does the existence of the Relativity actually negate parallel universes? Wouldn't they ensure that their universe came about and, well, destroy those that would not lead to their existence?

 

[Deckerd]

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her?

I'd explain it, but there's a lot of math.

Not if Janeway's going back in time was a part of their past all along, and all they had to do was "wait it out" for it to happen.

Here's one: Does the existence of the Relativity actually negate parallel universes? Wouldn't they ensure that their universe came about and, well, destroy those that would not lead to their existence?

Clearly not, since mirror and parallel universes abound in Trek world.

 

[Guy Gardener]

A mirror Universe just "is". there's no evidence that they are created by time travel and not just natural manifestations that all birthed simultaneously with the big-bangs alongside the Universe we are familiar with in Star Trek, or not.

Yesterdays enterprise, and Time and again both show the the destruction and overwriting of time, rather than the creation of an alternate divergent timeline.

Voyager is inconsistent, so carry on.

 

[Deckerd]

^I don't see what's inconsistent. If we agree that time behaves differently in the Trek universe then it's possible to do just about anything with it. Mirror universes are a different thing, I agree. I just put mirror in there in a moment of insanity.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Don't worry, you're still almost perfect in every other way.

Janeway from a couple days in the future vanished in the past after she paradoxically bolloxed up the past that would grow into her present come the conclusion of Time and Again. IE the planet said "To Boom or not to boom".

Then you have Sela Yar flirting with Data on the Romulan front of the Klingon Civil War despite her mother dying as a child picking a fight with a tetchy tar pit.

Two Braxtons came back from two different alternate futures to meddle with the same Voyager which was Schroedingers Cat about if Voyager was going to blow up the 29th century Earth or not... Okay this is dodgy considering that Voyager was predicated on the Computer revolution of the 1970s based on tech stolen form the Aeon which means that everything was predetermined even though Voyager didn't ram the Aeon killing billions and Braxton turned up again.

**Sigh**

See? Conflicting rules. Either time is fixed but generating new timelines rather than change, or Time is fluid constantly overwriting itself where time travelers are divorced from their own continuity that they can survive the most pressing paradox, or they can't.

 

[Gaith]

But then you have the USS Relativity with all of it's time line continuum scanning... wouldn't they have detected this breach of protocol and tried to stop her?

I'd explain it, but there's a lot of math.

Not if Janeway's going back in time was a part of their past all along, and all they had to do was "wait it out" for it to happen.

Here's one: Does the existence of the Relativity actually negate parallel universes? Wouldn't they ensure that their universe came about and, well, destroy those that would not lead to their existence?

See, those are the kinds of questions I can't explain without delving into the math.

 

[Gojira]

^ It also means that he expects this thread to turn into a battlefield, as a few other threads covering this topic have.

My two cents: What I don't like about Endgame is its sudden ending. They should have dealt with the reintegration of the Maquis crew members, Seven's fate, awkward meetings with remarried spouses - and then have the Borg emerge from the transwarp conduit. So character closure first, then go out with a bang.

What I did like was that Voyager got home because of the bad guy (Admiral Janeway) winning - a nice change.

We needed a half an hour more for this episode. Yeah they got home and I was happy. The episode was pretty good as it stands but we had been watching these people for 7 years so it would have been better to have seen them starting their lives back home and seen them being greeted by family members and celebrating their return.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Lately, I re-watched Endgame and by taking a little distance (4 months between the 1st and 2nd viewing), I have to admit that the story wasn't so bad as I thought.
Of course, I still cringed in seeing the so-called romance between Chakotay and Seven (a moment to forget like the Janeway/Paris salamanders kids in Threshold, right?! ) but the idea to play with the pasta nd/ or the present to modify the course of events is fascinating, challenging ... and sometimes, just as dangerous. (remember Code Quantum).

The problem is that producers/writers already used so much times in the past that to use this stratagem again was a little too redundant.
In the same, it appeared clear right the beginning that the Voyager and its mixed crew were lost in Delta Quadrant because of one Janeway's decision and that only her was able to make adjustment and return her people to Earth. No matter the resources used, the space time.

The question which lies is that by occurring on the present to modify the future, Admiral Janeway dived her couterpart and her crew into the unknown. We have a french quotation which says "on sait ce que l'on perd mais on n'ignore ce que l'on gagne"" (something like "we know what we lose but we ignore what we win") and sometimes, the unknown turns out to be the worst than what was expected/planned but we can always make some suppositions... .

For my part, I find funnier to play with parallel dimensions, when individuals meet their couterparts with some physical differences or differences of character.
You can so make the inconceivable possible ... and maybe satisfy everybody one way or another.

 

[Dukhat]

No offense, but how did you even find this thread topic after five years of nobody posting in it?

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Euh, just used the "Search" button. Was this thread closed? I still can move my comment elsewhere if you want...

 

[Dukhat]

Lol, no, wasn't implying it was a problem...I just always wondered how people resurrect old topics is all. I've never used the search function so that makes sense. And at least you had something meaningful to say instead of just "It teh sukd!"