NuUhura - uggh (shudder)

[Temis the Vorta]

"Sleeping with an instructor to advance her career" is just a bit of an unfounded inference. How do we know Starfleet prohibits such things? How do we know her relationship with Spock is anything but genuine?

Her field is xenolinguistics, which implies a fascination with alien cultures. So she shows up one day in Vulcan class and here's this smokin' hot guy who's an alien (well, half, but that's even more exotic). Why wouldn't she go after him like a tribble after quadrum tritocale? I sure would.

Unlike practically every other Trek romance I can think of, Spock/Uhura actually comes off as convincing. Uhura is a consistent, coherent character in the movie: strong, capable, not afraid to get her way, committed to a serious relationship with Spock, which looks like it's reciprocated, and contemptuous of idiot males. As a good-looking female, that last part is inevitable. I'm sure Kirk is not the first drunk fool to give her good reason for that contempt.

 

[trampledamage]

Personally, I liked the sex with farm animals line and I could totally see the original Uhura using it as a put-down for some drunk kid making the moves on her - it shows Uhura's not phased by the situation but she can handle it with humour, which is true to both characters.

Seemed to me they didn't really know the Uhura character at all (old or new). One moment sleeping with an instructor to advance her career, the next abandoning her post to comfort her man.

Talk about putting the most negative spin possible on the situation. Nowhere is it even suggested that she's sleeping with Spock to advance her career - in fact she makes it very clear that she needs no help whatsoever with advancing her career, her own skills will get her there on merit. Having a relationship with Spock nearly scuppers her career before it starts.

 

[Stoek]

Personally I had no problem with any of the re-interpretations of the characters. Chekov and Sulu came of a touch bland but hopefully they will be fleshed out in the next movie. I was fine with Scotty since I assumed that this is what you would get if he had been deprived of the creative outlet that being an engineer had/would give him. I figure the whole thing with Archer's beagle didn't happen in the primeline.

As for the Nuhura NuSpock relationship, I actually thought it made perfect sense. And if you look at some of the earliest TOS episodes you can see that NN and LN have a very nice onscreen chemistry.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Personally, I liked the sex with farm animals line and I could totally see the original Uhura using it as a put-down for some drunk kid making the moves on her - it shows Uhura's not phased by the situation but she can handle it with humour.

We saw glimpses of that in Nichelle's performances, from the simple "Sorry, neither" in TOS to her wonderful handling of "Mister Adventure" in ST III.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Uhura Prime had a lot of character in the movies and she certainly was not completely passive in TOS but did suffer from being a minor bridge character. What character we did see (mostly in the movies) was very spunky and confidant. I was quite happy with NuUhura's personality, though a lot younger seeming than Uhura Prime I could see the genesis of what we saw when Uhura Prime was older. My only tweaking (other than nuking the farm animals line) would have been to have a less generic looking actress. Nothing against Zoe but I think it would have been great to have someone a little more distinctive looking.

Also NuUhura in ST:XII needs to wear those green hoop earrings Uhura Prime had.

 

[UFO]

Original Uhura won't work as a modern action-movie character. She's just too passive.

Yeah, she looked passive in the mirror universe scene with "evil" Sulu.

Uhura Prime had a lot of character in the movies and she certainly was not completely passive in TOS but did suffer from being a minor bridge character.

Tell it like it is sister!

Star Trek is being carefully planned and thought out.

OoooooK … . Er, not the plot though obviously, right?

Now that they've established an interesting dynamic between Uhura and Spock, the relationship can be used in the next movie.

Oh Space No! Look, I have money … Please no, anything but that …

For instance, the shit Spock has experienced makes it ever more difficult to maintain the control of logic.

I knew it!

So now Kirk is the bratty wild-child. There have been a lot of complaints about that as well, but it's also necessary.

KirkP didn't have to behave like a bratty wild-child. NuKirk could have been just a younger version of him without being a complete drop-kick. Why can't young people be well brought up, especially in the 23rd Century? We will have to disagree that action stereotypes are desirable, much less "necessary".

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Why can't young people be well brought up, especially in the 23rd Century?

Because life is messy and shit happens. No matter how much "we have evolved" baloney Roddenberry wrote there were still wars and power struggles and relationship breakdowns all of which effect how children are raised.

Also UFO that was awesome multiquoting.

 

[Nerd unRage]

I like nuUhura. It's much better seeing that character having some lines and depth beyond "Hailing frequencies open Captain". I was disappointed watching the original series and movies with the original cast that Uhura never really got much of anything to do or say. The only exception being in "Mirror, Mirror". Uhura as written in the 60s and in the movies, is just the typical helpless female. I like that the nuUhura is much more modern and in the 23rd century, I would hope she'd be able to take care of herself.

I think what grates a lot of people is nuUhura in a romantic relationship with nuSpock. Or just Spock in a realtionship of any kind. Not so much nuUhura as more spunky and self-sufficient or exhibiting a functioning brain.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

NuSpock is so incredibly hot he NEEDS to be in a relationship with someone.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Wait... was the character of Uhura based on that radio operator from the original series? The one who occasionally gasped in fright? I didn't realize she had a name.

Yep. Things change.

I much prefer Zoe Saldana and nuUhura. I was pretty sure that the line "didn't sound like Star Trek," though, because it was funny.

Here's hoping that the next movie doesn't "sound like Star Trek" either; I'm finally enjoying Trek again.

 

[Bishop76]

Here's hoping that the next movie doesn't "sound like Star Trek" either; I'm finally enjoying Trek again.

Quoted for truth!

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Original Uhura won't work as a modern action-movie character. She's just too passive.

Yeah, she looked passive in the mirror universe scene with "evil" Sulu.

One scene out of how many over the whole series? The proponderance of Uhura's scenes depict her as hardly more important than furniture. And they had to preface it with Uhura being scared and Kirk giving her a pep talk. That would never fly today.

So now Kirk is the bratty wild-child. There have been a lot of complaints about that as well, but it's also necessary.

KirkP didn't have to behave like a bratty wild-child. NuKirk could have been just a younger version of him without being a complete drop-kick. Why can't young people be well brought up, especially in the 23rd Century? We will have to disagree that action stereotypes are desirable, much less "necessary".

Young Kirk had already been established as a "stack of books with legs" during his Academy years. It might have been tenable to create a plot arc around that - the all-too-serious young man loosens up because of the fun and excitement of space exploration - but the real problem is that Spock is already hogging up the role of the all-too-serious young man. Being a Vulcan, there's no wiggle room there.

To keep interesting dramatic contrast between the two lead characters, one of them has to change. So the writers chose to give Kirk the greatest dramatic contrast with Spock possible. If the master plan is to give him an arc that leads to the mature, caring, competent leader we expect, then that's a perfectly acceptable plotline.

And don't bother trying to bribe the writers not to pursue the Spock/Uhura romance because they're being "bribed" by millions of moviegoers who expect to see a romantic subplot in their summer popcorn flicks. As long as this relationship is not as wretchedly written as all the Trek romances before it, I'm happy to give them the benefit of the doubt and see if they can pull it off.

And yeah, I meant the overall story shows signs of being well planned - stuff like including Leonard Nimoy in the movie to give a fitting transition to the new era of Trek, and devising a way to show respect to canon without being tangled up in canon, by inventing a new parallel universe for the action to take place in.

I see Kirk's possible character arc and the Spock/Uhura romance as possibly being part of the same overall scheme. But specific complaints like whether there were plot holes in Trek XI, eh. You can always find plot holes in complicated sci fi stories, especially involving time travel. I'm not gonna sweat the small stuff as long as they get the big stuff right.

NuSpock is so incredibly hot he NEEDS to be in a relationship with someone.

No kidding. Maybe they threw Uhura in there to short-circuit the obviousness of Spock slash with Kirk, McCoy, random redshirts, etc. Not that it's going to stop us...

 

[UFO]

Original Uhura won't work as a modern action-movie character. She's just too passive.

Yeah, she looked passive in the mirror universe scene with "evil" Sulu.

One scene out of how many over the whole series? The proponderance of Uhura's scenes depict her as hardly more important than furniture. And they had to preface it with Uhura being scared and Kirk giving her a pep talk. That would never fly today.

Its true she should have been used more extensively but even if it was only one scene, that was enough to prove she is capable of being "active". It seems like we are at cross purposes here, however nuUhura didn't seem to do very much either and little that was action oriented. So I'm not sure the character was changed that much. A bit more 'tude is all really. Worse, I didn't find her version of it very "endearing".

KirkP didn't have to behave like a bratty wild-child. NuKirk could have been just a younger version of him without being a complete drop-kick. Why can't young people be well brought up, especially in the 23rd Century? We will have to disagree that action stereotypes are desirable, much less "necessary".

Young Kirk had already been established as a "stack of books with legs" during his Academy years. It might have been tenable to create a plot arc around that - the all-too-serious young man loosens up because of the fun and excitement of space exploration - but the real problem is that Spock is already hogging up the role of the all-too-serious young man. Being a Vulcan, there's no wiggle room there.

To keep interesting dramatic contrast between the two lead characters, one of them has to change. ...

Maybe we should question that only such drastic cliche, in your face, contrasts are the only workable ones, but as above, I was not suggesting an ultra serious Kirk, just not a rebel version.

So the writers chose to give Kirk the greatest dramatic contrast with Spock possible. If the master plan is to give him an arc that leads to the mature, caring, competent leader we expect, then that's a perfectly acceptable plotline.

Too trite and annoying for my liking.

And yeah, I meant the overall story shows signs of being well planned ... I'm not gonna sweat the small stuff as long as they get the big stuff right.

Which in my view they didn't unfortunately.

 

[Harvey]

Is this even a question? Uhura was barely a character in the original series--she could be swapped out for another communications officer whenever Nichols was busy and the change to the script was negligible. She didn't even have a first name.

She got more to do in the films, but outside of her "Mr. Adventure" scene in the third film, it still wasn't much.

 

[UFO]

Is this even a question? Uhura was barely a character in the original series--she could be swapped out for another communications officer whenever Nichols was busy and the change to the script was negligible. She didn't even have a first name.

She got more to do in the films, but outside of her "Mr. Adventure" scene in the third film, it still wasn't much.

She was so iconic she only needed one name! You know, like Spock. They were both way ahead of their time.

For being "barely a character" she attracted a lot of attention and is every bit as recognisable as the other "secondary" characters which suggests "there was something about her". But the difference of opinion here seems to be that some of us are saying she was capable of "action" roles or those with greater development, while others are concentrating on what she actually did.

And I suspect there is an attempt to minimise her contribution. Part of a general policy toward older Trek by the look of it.

 

[Harvey]

I'm being chastised for recognizing what the character did instead of some undefined "potential?"

Uhura had all kinds of potential as a character--but it was rarely realized on the series. That's nothing to do with a "general policy towards older Trek." That's just the way it is.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

She was so iconic she only needed one name!

Not giving the non-white characters full names was just casual unconscious insensitivity on the part of Roddenberry and company, and that's all.

oldUhura's barely a character at all, though granted she fares a little better than oldChekov by virtue of being made the butt of fewer ethnic jokes. nuUhura is more interesting and three-dimensional in two hours than the original managed in decades.

And I suspect there is an attempt to minimise her contribution. Part of a general policy toward older Trek by the look of it.

You have a continuing tendency to appropriate and misuse terminology - like "official" and "policy" - in a perhaps unconscious effort to characterize folks who disagree with you about this movie as somehow organized in a decidedly unfair or unsavory way. Whatever shadowy bureaucracy is employing us fans of nuTrek has been missing its deposits to my personal account.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Not giving the non-white characters full names was just casual unconscious insensitivity on the part of Roddenberry and company, and that's all.

Like Tonto and Kato?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Not giving the non-white characters full names was just casual unconscious insensitivity on the part of Roddenberry and company, and that's all.

Like Tonto and Kato?

Good examples of the tendency, yep. At least the Trek characters were permitted to speak in more than monosyllables.

A lot of it was just disinterest in giving any thought to the cultures the characters were supposed to come from. In the case of Uhura, the name was adopted from Swahili as a matter of fashion for its symbolic value. There are a couple of competing stories beyond plain laziness for "Sulu," including the currently popular invented story about the Sulu sea (which may have been a later fabrication of Roddenberry's repeated to the actor).

 

[UFO]

I'm being chastised for recognizing what the character did instead of some undefined "potential?"

No, I didn't do that. I just think she made a bigger impact than some give her credit for.

She was so iconic she only needed one name!

Not giving the non-white characters full names was just casual unconscious insensitivity on the part of Roddenberry and company, and that's all.

Jews are non-white? Still, it doesn't make my contention any less true.

And I suspect there is an attempt to minimise her contribution. Part of a general policy toward older Trek by the look of it.

oldUhura's barely a character at all, though granted she fares a little better than oldChekov by virtue of being made the butt of fewer ethnic jokes. nuUhura is more interesting and three-dimensional in two hours than the original managed in decades.

There you go again.

So you admit there were "deposits"!

How do you feel about "trend", by the way?