Giving it a try, when is it enough?

[Warped9]

I posted my reply because ALL Warped9's posts only repeated the same information regarding 'how much is a fair chance' (indicating he had clear criteria for this from the beginning) and bashed 'Enterprise' and 'VOY'.

Where in my original post did bash the shows? I didn't. I said they didn't work for me.

Did I have an agenda? Yes, in that I (and others) get fed up with people bitching we're unfair somehow because we don't like a show they like.

The idea that shows take time to mature and/or for you to an acquire a taste for them is bullshit. If the producers aren't grabbing you early on then that's their failing and not the viewer's.

Then what's up with:
"That said first season TNG turned me right off in the beginning. It was the occasional second and third season episode that piqued my interest to see more."
It seems you don't have a problem with series having a slow start.

And your problem with Ent and Voy is not the slow start, but that they're "crap" from A to Z:
"But both ENT and VOY left a bad taste very early on and nothing was different whenever I tried again."

During this thread, you only repeated that you're willing to watch even 'slow start' series such as TNG and that Ent and VOY are weak.

PS - "Where in my original post did bash the shows?"
Warped9, you sell yourself too short. I'm sure that, if you look close enough, you'll find 1-2 posts beyond the original one that don't bash Ent.

Which still doesn't change the essence of what I said. Whether I say "it doesn't work for me" or I say "this is garbage" it comes down to the same thing: I DON"T LIKE IT! And no amount of exposure would have changed that.

Yes, I wrote off TNG in the beginning then it got better. That didn't happen with VOY and ENT--they didn't get better, not for me. If TNG had stayed as it was in first season I never would have watched the rest of it. I would have stayed away much as I did with other series.

 

[ProtoAvatar]

Where in my original post did bash the shows? I didn't. I said they didn't work for me.

Did I have an agenda? Yes, in that I (and others) get fed up with people bitching we're unfair somehow because we don't like a show they like.

The idea that shows take time to mature and/or for you to an acquire a taste for them is bullshit. If the producers aren't grabbing you early on then that's their failing and not the viewer's.

Then what's up with:
"That said first season TNG turned me right off in the beginning. It was the occasional second and third season episode that piqued my interest to see more."
It seems you don't have a problem with series having a slow start.

And your problem with Ent and Voy is not the slow start, but that they're "crap" from A to Z:
"But both ENT and VOY left a bad taste very early on and nothing was different whenever I tried again."

During this thread, you only repeated that you're willing to watch even 'slow start' series such as TNG and that Ent and VOY are weak.

PS - "Where in my original post did bash the shows?"
Warped9, you sell yourself too short. I'm sure that, if you look close enough, you'll find 1-2 posts beyond the original one that don't bash Ent.

Which still doesn't change the essence of what I said. Whether I say "it doesn't work for me" or I say "this is garbage" it comes down to the same thing: I DON"T LIKE IT! And no amount of exposure would have changed that.

Yes, I wrote off TNG in the beginning then it got better. That didn't happen with VOY and ENT--they didn't get better, not for me. If TNG had stayed as it was in first season I never would have watched the rest of it. I would have stayed away much as I did with other series.

In other words, in this thread all you did was scream you don't like Ent and Voy (also known as bashing Ent and Voy) - that's exactly what I said in my first post here, Warped9.

A, but let's not forget your other contribution to this thread - you contradicting yourself regarding your attitude towards 'slow start' series.

 

[Warped9]

Then what's up with:
"That said first season TNG turned me right off in the beginning. It was the occasional second and third season episode that piqued my interest to see more."
It seems you don't have a problem with series having a slow start.

And your problem with Ent and Voy is not the slow start, but that they're "crap" from A to Z:
"But both ENT and VOY left a bad taste very early on and nothing was different whenever I tried again."

During this thread, you only repeated that you're willing to watch even 'slow start' series such as TNG and that Ent and VOY are weak.

PS - "Where in my original post did bash the shows?"
Warped9, you sell yourself too short. I'm sure that, if you look close enough, you'll find 1-2 posts beyond the original one that don't bash Ent.

Which still doesn't change the essence of what I said. Whether I say "it doesn't work for me" or I say "this is garbage" it comes down to the same thing: I DON"T LIKE IT! And no amount of exposure would have changed that.

Yes, I wrote off TNG in the beginning then it got better. That didn't happen with VOY and ENT--they didn't get better, not for me. If TNG had stayed as it was in first season I never would have watched the rest of it. I would have stayed away much as I did with other series.

In other words, in this thread all you did was scream you don't like Ent and Voy (also known as bashing Ent and Voy) - that's exactly what I said in my first post here, Warped9.

A, but let's not forget your other contribution to this thread - you contradicting yourself regarding your attitude towards 'slow start' series.

You know, I do recognize an agenda here: yours. For some reason you're interested in ascribing some other motive to the thread when all it is is a starting point for a broader discussion. No one has a problem with it but you.

Well, all I can say is you're the one with the problem.

I will say one thing. Even though I didn't like TNG in the beginning I still saw potential ideas in it. AND we hadn't had new Star Trek (except for films) for ages. That didn't work for the later series. There had been plenty of Trek, over saturation really, by the time VOY and ENT roll around. But I've been far more fair to them than I have been to other shows because I am interested in the Trek universe.

 

[Frontier]

To each his own.

Everyone is different, and not everyone will like everything.

I myself am not much of a fan of Enterprise. I endured it when it was on because I was a die-hard Trekkie. I eventually bought the DVDs on sale out of withdraw from Trek and a physical need to see anything Trek that was semi-new/unseen. Hell I've even read some of the post-finale novels. But... it's not even on my top 100 favorite shows list. Likely not even top 250.

That you don't like nuBSG or Firefly piques my eyebrows! Heh. nuBSG is number one on my list, and Firefly is number one of cancelled shows, top 20 overall. Those, I have to ask: did you watch them in the correct story-line order? Because both of those shows, if you do not watch them in the correct order (mini series, season 1 for nuBSG, Firefly you have to look up the proper story order) it really, really increases the odds of not liking them -- because you've missed a big part of the puzzle.

I didn't like Firefly when it aired. But someone on this forum dared my to watch it in order, and then tell them I didn't like it. I watched. I could not tell them I didn't like it. I loved it. With nuBSG, friend of mine just recently began watching it in order, from the mini-series, after having seen a smattering of episodes and not being too fascinated. Now that he's seen it in order? He's in love with the show, thinks it's one of the best ever.

So... give up on ENT. Go re-try Firefly and nuBSG. Firefly is 15 episodes; if you watch the first 4 or 5 in proper order and dislike... ok. Then you tried correctly. With nuBSG, watch the mini-series, then first 3 episodes of season 1. About 6-7 hours worth. And again, if you don't like it after proper order... ok. Those two shows, specifically, really really need to be seen properly for you to emotionally invest.

 

[Warped9]

Tried Firefly: Good acting and decent writing, but the premise and concepts were so WTF! it took me right out of it.

Tried nuBSG: Again, decently acted, but very poor conceptual thinking. Never went back and never feel I'm missing anything.

 

[CaptainStoner]

Well. Tastes will change over time, though not for everyone. I hated TOS as a small child, ended up loving it as I grew up with it.
By TNG (I am Wil Wheaton's age), I saw that S1 was awkward, stilted, but with nice FX. I hung in with TNG until around S5, by which point there were other things happening in life.
DS9 I had no interest in when it aired, but when watching it end-to-end last year, I thought the quality was excellent from the start, and just got better.
VOY - I really disliked Janeway back then. I've only seen the pilot and first 3 eps so far (burned out after that DS9 marathon), but thought it had a very strong start. And I've done a total 180 on Janeway.
ENT, I'm sorry to say, I never made it past that stupidly incongruous themesong. That was it. Never watched the show.

Speaking of "never watched the show", I saw an interview recently hosted by Whoopi Goldberg with Shatner, Nimoy, Stewart, and Frakes. In it, Shatner admits he's never watched an episode of TNG. (A pretty funny moment in front of the TNG cast). He goes on to say he's never even watched Boston Legal.
That gets into a whole other discussion - this Shatner guy, who seemingly has no reverse gear, nor even stops to review what he's done.
But anyway, I think if one highly dislikes a beloved TV series, one is going to keep getting that "give it a chance" comment. Goes with the territory.
Somewhat related to that, I've had a similar relationship with music genres. My primary craft is music, and I have had many such 180's - Grateful Dead, The Doors, George Clinton, dance music in general, classical music, traditional country. So it may be that when one has a strongly negative reaction to something, there is something in it that one needs, and is resisting for some reason. I've always found an almost alchemical joy in "getting" something I previously heavily disliked. But it could only happen when the time was right. Some additional food for thought.

 

[diankra]

I'm coming in very late on this thread, but...
I stuck with Enterprise season one for about 17 episodes, until Rogue Planet convinced me it really wasn't worthwatching/
I tried again on season two, and reached about eight episodes before The Comminicator and that one about Archer's dog persuaded me to give up.
Season three I dipped into as convenient, and occasionallyliked, but not enough.
Season four I did like enough to watch regularly.

 

[Shatnertage]

Hypothetically, suppose someone started watching TOS with season 3. They sit through the first 6 episodes and, after Spock's Brian, decide that this is just the goofiest excuse for a show they've ever seen.

Personally, Spock's Brain is one of my favorite episodes (I see it as a comedy played very straight), but I can't say that I could blame them if they said they'd given the show six hours of their life and wouldn't watch it anymore.

Could you really tell someone to just hang in there and keep grinding through season 3, because there are a few episodes in there that aren't that bad?

So is the argument that you have to give it time no matter what, or you have to catch it at its creative peak?

 

[Sector 7]

Tried Firefly: Good acting and decent writing, but the premise and concepts were so WTF! it took me right out of it.

Tried nuBSG: Again, decently acted, but very poor conceptual thinking. Never went back and never feel I'm missing anything.

This is all of your diabolical plan for this thread, isn't it?! You are determined to say things that make me agree with you.

I am one of those who do not like DS9 nor nuBSG for the same reasons: I cannot enjoy long story arcs; I cannot enjoy shows which are depressing.

I do enjoy: shows with a positive outlook; episodic series (if I miss an episode, I am not clueless watching the next episode). This positive outlook is what drew me to TOS those many years ago. It is also what draws me to the new Star Trek movie: positive outlook, action, exploration, etc.

 

[Warped9]

^^ Let's not talk about ST09 or we will certainly part ways.

 

[T'Girl]

^^ Let's not talk about ST09 or we will certainly part ways.

Now now Warped9, ST09 is certainly no worst than a lot of sci-fi movies that run at two o'clock in the morning on the SyFy channel (did you see the one with the giant flying shark? It had Tiffany in it.)

 

[RandyS]

Tried Firefly: Good acting and decent writing, but the premise and concepts were so WTF! it took me right out of it.

Tried nuBSG: Again, decently acted, but very poor conceptual thinking. Never went back and never feel I'm missing anything.

This is all of your diabolical plan for this thread, isn't it?! You are determined to say things that make me agree with you.

I am one of those who do not like DS9 nor nuBSG for the same reasons: I cannot enjoy long story arcs; I cannot enjoy shows which are depressing.

Well, I can't agree about DS9--one of Star Trek's high water marks as far as I'm concerned. But New Galactica....ugh. Voyager and Enterprise are both mastepieces of biblical proprtions compared to this shit.

 

[Smiley]

For a series that is already over, watching the three most acclaimed episodes of the series is not unreasonable, although watching one or two with an open mind is still giving a show a chance in my book.

For ongoing shows, watching at least the first episode is enough.

Really, there is so much stuff out there that nobody should feel pressured or coerced into watching shows that they are not enjoying. If opinions differ, then they differ. I don't care if my friends don't share my opinions 100%, and I sure don't care what random people on the internet think about my viewing choices and grades.

 

[CaptainStoner]

^^ Let's not talk about ST09 or we will certainly part ways.

But if you just gave it a chance....

 

[Forbin]

"Fed-upedness" varies from show to show.

My wife and I watched all the first new V episodes, but when it came back for its current run, we realized we just didn't care.

We'd watched Heroes until the middle of last season, when we got so damn tired of nothing happening that we threw our hands up and quit.

I tried to give Enterprise the benefit of the doubt and watched the first few eps with a wide-open mind. There were things I liked, and things I didn't. After a few eps I could see it was "more of the same" stupidity that had plagued Voyager. I watched the whole series so I could be conversant here, but as background while doing other things.

I probably watched most of Voyager (again as background), but for the last few years I really didn't care if I missed it. If the TV guide blurb had the words "the Doctor" "Seven" or "Anomoly," I skipped it.

There are a lot of shows that didn't grab me (and/or my wife) with the first ep, so we stopped. There are a lot that we didn't think we'd like that we checked out after a season or two, and ended up loving.

Ain't no set rule.