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Die Hard vs. The Fugitive

Flying Spaghetti Monster

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They don't make action films like they used to, and while both of these films came before the advent of CGI effects and stunts, I also believe that both helped to define the modern action film. What it comes down to is character.

Die Hard: An action powerhouse so good it is still quoted today, and so influential to filmmaking that it started its own sub-genre (Die Hard on a...). John McCain is a memorable everyman thrown into a situation that is extraordinary, and what shines through is his humanity What makes the film even better is that villains in the film are not dumb. They are constantly on top of things. Plus they have class. The film concludes with some great special effects, but we never forget the humans in the story, and the tight story.

The Fugitive: After a few slam bang action set pieces early on, this film takes a different path, choosing to mellow out a bit, placing suspence and many near-misses over sheer action. It is Andrew Davis' best film, and, again, the characters really shine through. Ford is the perfect every man here, and has to play many of his scenes alone. He's perfect, because we care about him, based on his expressions alone. Equal is Tommy Lee Jones. As Ebert says (when he was good at reviewing films) Jones is on target here in a role that becomes more complicated than it first appears. It is never spelled out exactly when this happens, but it is clear that Gerard continues the pursuit despite believing that his target is innocent. Subtlety in a simple action film? There is a lot of it.

So which of these two films is better. I'll discuss the major weeknesses first.

The weaknesses come in the form of supporting characters. Die Hard gives us two characters that almost derail the film. The newscaster played by Atherton seems to be transplanted from a comedy, as is Paul Gleason's character. I respect Gleason (RIP) but he seems to be playing the same guy he did in The Breakfast Club here as well. ValJohnson turns in the best performance you can expect, but he starts as such a comical sterotype that it does hurt the film a bit.

Some character stereotypes do work, particularly the FBI guys. They work well and their brief role is funny.

In The Fugitive, the supporting player that gives me pause is the guy that plays Dr. Nichols. He is fine, but I heard he wasn't thne first choice for the role. The problem with the guy they got is that he just screams "villain" to me and takes some of the mystery out.

Both of these films bridge the gap between fun action movies and good film making. Which do you think is more influential? Which one do you think is better?
 
I don't think anyone would call The Fugitive an influential movie. It's very well done, don't get me wrong... but broken down, it's pretty by the numbers.

Now, Die Hard actually revolutionized the action movie genre. for 10 years prior to it, your action heroes were invincible supermen, think Commando and Rambo. After Die Hard, John McClane clones were the de facto standard. For literally years afterword action movies were sold as "Die Hard in a..." i.e. Speed was marketed as "Die Hard on a Bus!!", etc.

If you want to debate the merits of action movies, and which is more influential, I think the much better argument would be Die Hard vs. Aliens. IMHO, both are near perfect movies that were very original upon release, and have been copied ad nauseum ever since, to varying levels of quality.
 
Die Hard achieved what it was supposed to achieve. A great action flick with plenty of comedy. There were sterotypes all over the place, the cops, the FBI guys, the terrorists, Ellis, but I'll forgive all that. A true representation of anyone in that movie would make the movie completely different.

The Fugitive was suspenseful, and Tommy Lee Jones turned in the best performance of the film. I agree with the OP, the guy that played Dr. Nichols... that was a really strange casting choice, but then again, I really didn't suspect that he would be the kind of guy that would do that.

The Fugitive has two things in it, that completely take me out of the film:
1. When kimbal jumps out of that tunnel and is falling, it is so painfully obvious that it's a dummy. I know they can't really have a stunt man make that fall, but that was really bad.

2. The subway scene that has the janitor from Scrubs in it. This is really the fault of Scrubs for playing a whole episode around it, and not the Fugitive. But now when I see that scene, I think of how it played out in Scrubs.
 
No contest, Die Hard is far better. I've never seen why the fugitive is so popular. It's a pretty typical Ford movie, of which there are better ones. Witness and Air Force One for example.
 
I agree with Foley that Die Hard is definitely the more influential of the two. I can't really call The Fugitive influential at all, although it is well-made and contains a number of moments that are now iconic (i.e. the bus escape/train crash, "I didn't kill my wife!" "I don't care!", and then the waterfall jump -- hey, it got spoofed on The Simpsons, so it must be memorable). Die Hard, on the other hand, spawned quite a few imitators in the action movie genre.

Which film is better? I'd be hard-pressed to say, as I really like both of them, but for different reasons. I'll have to think about that one...
 
The Fugitive is the smarter movie, and for that reason I think it's superior. The characters are richer and more complex. Die Hard, on the other hand, is a lot of fun--but it's also big and dumb. Of course, Die Hard spawned a lot of big and dumb immitators. Most of them aren't as good as the original, including the Die Hard sequels. I don't think The Fugitive spawned many immitators, besides a sequel (U.S. Marshalls) and a pardoy (Wrongfully Accused), which is too bad, since I could always go for a smart, character-driven thriller.
 
I can't seriously place The Fugitive anywhere near the same level as Die Hard. Die Hard exemplified an entire genre.
 
Die Hard: An action powerhouse so good it is still quoted today, and so influential to filmmaking that it started its own sub-genre (Die Hard on a...). John McCain is a memorable everyman thrown into a situation that is extraordinary, and what shines through is his humanity What makes the film even better is that villains in the film are not dumb. They are constantly on top of things.

Ummm... these are a bunch of thieves trying to conceal their theft by pretending to be terrorists. They're committing far more violent and public crimes than they need to in order to achieve their goals, and somehow think that will make it easier for them to get away with it. Sounds pretty dumb to me. ;)


The Fugitive: As Ebert says (when he was good at reviewing films) Jones is on target here in a role that becomes more complicated than it first appears. It is never spelled out exactly when this happens, but it is clear that Gerard continues the pursuit despite believing that his target is innocent. Subtlety in a simple action film? There is a lot of it.

Well, the credit there goes to the original Roy Huggins-created TV series. The show's Gerard (who had a different first name and title) was an honest, dedicated police lieutenant who became increasingly uncertain of Kimble's guilt, but continued the pursuit because it was his duty. Even if Kimble didn't kill his wife, he did commit the crime of escaping from justice, and Gerard's job was to bring him in, period. It wasn't his place to act outside the law and let Kimble go. Although he did ultimately help Kimble prove his innocence.

My problem with The Fugitive as a remake is that the movie was a totally different type of story from the show. The series was a character-driven drama, the movie a pure action spectacle. They took the same premise in two wholly different directions.
 
Personally, I'd put the Fugitive in the same sort of area of my DVD shelf as say 'Master & Commander' and 'Children of Men'. Not exactly revolutionary, but well made, enjoyable, engaging and perhaps most importantly; very re-watchable. The sort of film you can always come back to on a rainy day. Not lowest common denominator "switch your brain off" flicks, but not the kind you have to make much of an effort to follow either.

Not that Die Hard isn't all those things, but it was much more of a mould breaker. Whole different class of film. I suppose those other films I mentioned are mould breakers too, but they're the first ones that came to mind (from my collection at least) when I think about well made, non-nostalgic re-watchability.
 
My preference is definitely for The Fugitive, since the protagonists aren't going around killing a bunch of people and making wisecracks about it. I greatly prefer stories where only the bad guys are killers.
 
Die Hard by a mile. The Fugitive is an enjoyable movie, probably Ford's last credible outing as a leading man. But DH remains the best action movie of all time in my book. Just no comparison, as far as I'm concerned.
 
I haven't seen Die Hard. I recall enjoying The Fugitive, but I don't remember much about it. I should try and catch it again sometime.

I haven't been much of an action movie fan since I was thirteen or so. I think video games have almost entirely supplanted that particular psychological niche for me.
 
Die Hard by a distance!

I always remember one reviewer at the time The Fugitive came out making the point that it would have been a way better film if Jones and Ford had swapped roles. (at the time) everyone knew Harrison Ford wouldn't have killed his wife, Tommy Lee on the other hand... that would have given the film a lot more mystery.
 
I'd say Die Hard was the bigger influence of the two, but I kind of like them pretty equally. I suppose the fact there there are four Die Hard films, all of them excellent does in the end put some distance ahead of The Fugitive.

Although I have a hard time deciding who's more badass: Tommy Lee Jones or Bruce Willis.
 
Die Hard by a distance!

I always remember one reviewer at the time The Fugitive came out making the point that it would have been a way better film if Jones and Ford had swapped roles. (at the time) everyone knew Harrison Ford wouldn't have killed his wife, Tommy Lee on the other hand... that would have given the film a lot more mystery.

That was Barry Norman, formerly of BBC's Film [insert year] programme. IIRC, he said something like 'We all know Harrison Ford couldn't kill his wife. But Tommy Lee Jones, he could kill his mother!'

I didn't agree with him though. The whole point of the original series was that Kimble was an innocent man, sentenced to death. Which of itself was quite a daring concept in the 1960s, the idea that the US justice system could get it so spectacularly wrong. Norman's idea might have made for an intriguing movie but it wouldn't have been The Fugitive.

Though to a certain extent, that premise did occur in the semi-sequel, US Marshals, where, IIRC, there was more ambiguity about Wesley Snipes' character.
 
Die Hard by a distance!

I always remember one reviewer at the time The Fugitive came out making the point that it would have been a way better film if Jones and Ford had swapped roles. (at the time) everyone knew Harrison Ford wouldn't have killed his wife, Tommy Lee on the other hand... that would have given the film a lot more mystery.

That was Barry Norman, formerly of BBC's Film [insert year] programme. IIRC, he said something like 'We all know Harrison Ford couldn't kill his wife. But Tommy Lee Jones, he could kill his mother!'

I didn't agree with him though. The whole point of the original series was that Kimble was an innocent man, sentenced to death. Which of itself was quite a daring concept in the 1960s, the idea that the US justice system could get it so spectacularly wrong. Norman's idea might have made for an intriguing movie but it wouldn't have been The Fugitive.

Though to a certain extent, that premise did occur in the semi-sequel, US Marshals, where, IIRC, there was more ambiguity about Wesley Snipes' character.

Yeah I see your point, just would have made it a bit more interesting for me.
 
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