I know, it's been awhile. But stand by for 2 new episode reviews tomorrow evening!
Nerys Ghemor's DS9 Episode Review Thread
- Thread starter Nerys Ghemor
- Start date
OK, guys...got 2 new episode reviews for ya!
The first review is "If Wishes Were Horses".
I found the episode overall to be middling, though watchable--it seemed very TNG'ish in nature, and in the end we were left with quite the unresolved question as to what sort of entities were trying to contact the crew of DS9 (though I actually have a personal theory that we were seeing a Prophet exploratory effort--maybe The Sisko sent them after his return to the Wormhole in WYLB? The very real baseball at the end makes me wonder...).
Probably the biggest point this episode had me pondering, however, was Dax. Seeing the Bashir-imagined Dax made me think two things. First, by this point in the season Bashir's efforts to woo Dax had gotten so annoying that it was a wonder Dax didn't report him for sexual harassment after she clearly told him "no." Seeing Bashir's fantasy, it seems, would've only reinforced the point (to my mind) that Bashir's attraction was bordering on unhealthy obsession.
The other point was this. The amorous, "non-cold-fish" Dax that we saw that Bashir imagined looked VERY out-of-character when compared to the real Dax, and for a viewer back when Season 1 was first airing, this would've been blatant. It's quite obvious the writers were trying to show us both what Dax was, and what she was NOT supposed to be. Yet minus the "submissive" part, this supposed caricature of Dax ended up becoming the character once she became Klingon Party Girl (TM). And good God, it's annoying.
A couple other character notes--O'Brien reading to Molly at the end was just priceless! It was also nice not to see Keiko in a scene bitching at him...even after Rumplestiltskin made threats to the family.
Also, seeing what Kira's imagination generated was very, very sobering--even that tiny moment made it very clear just how badly the Cardassians had scarred her and so many other Bajorans. I definitely felt myself imagining the guilt that a number of my Cardassian characters would feel, as I saw that scene.
We did have one other remark that's worthy of note, for its chilling prescience. Quark commented that someone should get Odo a "shapeshifter playmate" to "intermingle" with, and that he'd change his views on romance then. And OH BOY did that ever happen when the Female Shapeshifter came along, and he almost became a "sex" (well, Link) addict. (And I still think it's a wonder Odo was accepted back after that...I think a justifiable case could've been made that he should've been killed for treason. I wonder what an AU would've been like where, instead of Ziyal dying at Damar's hand, Odo died at Kira's hand?)
OH, and we do get treated to a nice beauty shot (well, at least for a Cardassian geek like me) where the torpedoes fire and the skin of DS9 seems to light up in the ochre of a Galor-class ship. In that moment, you can really, REALLY see the kinship in design between the two classes in a way you usually can't.
The second review is for "The Forsaken."
Right at the beginning, I thought it was GREAT that Sisko stuck Bashir with those cranky ambassadors...Lord knows Bashir needed ever hit to his arrogance then that was possible (though this lesson was kind of undermined by his getting commendations, perhaps!).
That is...it was great for BASHIR.
My problem was with Sisko. I think the Arbazan ambassador may have had a legitimate point about Sisko's decision to not deal with the ambassadors. Considering that the station was not on alert status and there were no other pressing missions mentioned, I found that Sisko's refusal to meet with the ambassadors, as the ranking Starfleet officer in the sector, was quite immature. I'm not normally one to criticize Sisko, but that HAS to be pointed out. I honestly cannot come up with a good reason why, until all hell started breaking loose, he should not have been polite and at least given SOME sign of putting in some voluntary face time, even if he wasn't there with them 26-7.
Overall, I am surprised to say that the best moments in this episode were between Odo and Lwaxana. What started out as comic relief actually ended up being incredibly touching, and revealed much more depth to the character of Lwaxana Troi than I think we'd ever seen before. In some ways, I think this foreshadowed what was going to happen in TNG's "Dark Page" (an episode I know some didn't like, but I found very good for the same reasons). Given Lwaxana's tendency towards blunt or seemingly intolerant remarks at times...it was actually pretty neat to see her show that she actually CAN be not just tolerant, but accepting where it really counts.
I should also add that the "Vulcan asshole" ambassador, once combined with Captain Soval several seasons later, DOES kinda show why the writers of ENT did what they did. (And I must also add that in Trek XI, we see some "attitude" from Vulcans, too, and to my mind, it seems fitting.)
I think we got a nice little joke, too, with the whole "abort and retry" bit that the computer came up with--reminded me of the "Abort--Retry--Fail" thing that used to be seen a lot more in that time period.
And the whole "Procedure Not Recommended" line, where the computer would bitch at O'Brien...SO fun. In fact, Rush Limborg even wrote an entire fanfic on that battle between O'Brien and the computer that is SOOOO funny! You should definitely read this: http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=72226
(And irony of ironies...I tried to do a search for this fic using the phrase "Procedure is not recommended" and the TBBS search engine gave me some pretty obstinate messages and kept inserting Boolean code where I SO did not want it)
Here are a few continuity nits.
Surely Bashir should've known it was against etiquette to touch a Vulcan (as he did in Ops), given the fact that it activates Vulcan touch telepathy. This is well established from TOS.
Also, why were the runabout transporters not used to get Odo and Lwaxana out of the turbolift as soon as DS9's transporters failed? Also, why were they not used as signal "repeaters" to replace the comm systems once they went down? Even if they operated as RF radios instead of subspace, I think this could've worked. If the runabouts had been used immediately after the transporter failure, and before the comms went down, that particular aspect of the crisis could've been averted.
Also...again we have some cases of confused worship among the characters. Why do we get "Good Lord" from Quark when it should be "Blessed Exchequer" and "My God" from Kira when it should be "Prophets"? Lazy, writing staff, lazy.
I also have one big nit. Cardassian engineering standards. HOW can they be so low? We know the station is massively overbuilt, difficult to scan, and difficult to destroy at least in a structural sense, and we even see the strength of the materials put into it in this very episode. Cardassian precision and discipline become hallmarks of the species in everything else we see--yet their computers are so tolerant of egregious errors? Unless we're seeing evidence of Cardassia's lack of resorces, I don't know how this makes any sense.
(I also get the feeling the Arbazan ambassador was supposed to be based on people like the British Mary Whitehouse. Interesting that we rarely see a more conservative culture--i.e. one that isn't into premarital sex and so on--portrayed in a positive or at least neutral "that's their way, respect it even if it's not ours" light on Trek...it's always the really loony "Whitehouse" type we get instead.)
Overall, these two episodes are on the "would watch again" list, in spite of the problems...but problems there definitely were.
The first review is "If Wishes Were Horses".
I found the episode overall to be middling, though watchable--it seemed very TNG'ish in nature, and in the end we were left with quite the unresolved question as to what sort of entities were trying to contact the crew of DS9 (though I actually have a personal theory that we were seeing a Prophet exploratory effort--maybe The Sisko sent them after his return to the Wormhole in WYLB? The very real baseball at the end makes me wonder...).
Probably the biggest point this episode had me pondering, however, was Dax. Seeing the Bashir-imagined Dax made me think two things. First, by this point in the season Bashir's efforts to woo Dax had gotten so annoying that it was a wonder Dax didn't report him for sexual harassment after she clearly told him "no." Seeing Bashir's fantasy, it seems, would've only reinforced the point (to my mind) that Bashir's attraction was bordering on unhealthy obsession.
The other point was this. The amorous, "non-cold-fish" Dax that we saw that Bashir imagined looked VERY out-of-character when compared to the real Dax, and for a viewer back when Season 1 was first airing, this would've been blatant. It's quite obvious the writers were trying to show us both what Dax was, and what she was NOT supposed to be. Yet minus the "submissive" part, this supposed caricature of Dax ended up becoming the character once she became Klingon Party Girl (TM). And good God, it's annoying.
A couple other character notes--O'Brien reading to Molly at the end was just priceless! It was also nice not to see Keiko in a scene bitching at him...even after Rumplestiltskin made threats to the family.
Also, seeing what Kira's imagination generated was very, very sobering--even that tiny moment made it very clear just how badly the Cardassians had scarred her and so many other Bajorans. I definitely felt myself imagining the guilt that a number of my Cardassian characters would feel, as I saw that scene.
We did have one other remark that's worthy of note, for its chilling prescience. Quark commented that someone should get Odo a "shapeshifter playmate" to "intermingle" with, and that he'd change his views on romance then. And OH BOY did that ever happen when the Female Shapeshifter came along, and he almost became a "sex" (well, Link) addict. (And I still think it's a wonder Odo was accepted back after that...I think a justifiable case could've been made that he should've been killed for treason. I wonder what an AU would've been like where, instead of Ziyal dying at Damar's hand, Odo died at Kira's hand?)
OH, and we do get treated to a nice beauty shot (well, at least for a Cardassian geek like me) where the torpedoes fire and the skin of DS9 seems to light up in the ochre of a Galor-class ship. In that moment, you can really, REALLY see the kinship in design between the two classes in a way you usually can't.
The second review is for "The Forsaken."
Right at the beginning, I thought it was GREAT that Sisko stuck Bashir with those cranky ambassadors...Lord knows Bashir needed ever hit to his arrogance then that was possible (though this lesson was kind of undermined by his getting commendations, perhaps!).
That is...it was great for BASHIR.
My problem was with Sisko. I think the Arbazan ambassador may have had a legitimate point about Sisko's decision to not deal with the ambassadors. Considering that the station was not on alert status and there were no other pressing missions mentioned, I found that Sisko's refusal to meet with the ambassadors, as the ranking Starfleet officer in the sector, was quite immature. I'm not normally one to criticize Sisko, but that HAS to be pointed out. I honestly cannot come up with a good reason why, until all hell started breaking loose, he should not have been polite and at least given SOME sign of putting in some voluntary face time, even if he wasn't there with them 26-7.
Overall, I am surprised to say that the best moments in this episode were between Odo and Lwaxana. What started out as comic relief actually ended up being incredibly touching, and revealed much more depth to the character of Lwaxana Troi than I think we'd ever seen before. In some ways, I think this foreshadowed what was going to happen in TNG's "Dark Page" (an episode I know some didn't like, but I found very good for the same reasons). Given Lwaxana's tendency towards blunt or seemingly intolerant remarks at times...it was actually pretty neat to see her show that she actually CAN be not just tolerant, but accepting where it really counts.
I should also add that the "Vulcan asshole" ambassador, once combined with Captain Soval several seasons later, DOES kinda show why the writers of ENT did what they did. (And I must also add that in Trek XI, we see some "attitude" from Vulcans, too, and to my mind, it seems fitting.)
I think we got a nice little joke, too, with the whole "abort and retry" bit that the computer came up with--reminded me of the "Abort--Retry--Fail" thing that used to be seen a lot more in that time period.
And the whole "Procedure Not Recommended" line, where the computer would bitch at O'Brien...SO fun. In fact, Rush Limborg even wrote an entire fanfic on that battle between O'Brien and the computer that is SOOOO funny! You should definitely read this: http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=72226
(And irony of ironies...I tried to do a search for this fic using the phrase "Procedure is not recommended" and the TBBS search engine gave me some pretty obstinate messages and kept inserting Boolean code where I SO did not want it)
Here are a few continuity nits.
Surely Bashir should've known it was against etiquette to touch a Vulcan (as he did in Ops), given the fact that it activates Vulcan touch telepathy. This is well established from TOS.
Also, why were the runabout transporters not used to get Odo and Lwaxana out of the turbolift as soon as DS9's transporters failed? Also, why were they not used as signal "repeaters" to replace the comm systems once they went down? Even if they operated as RF radios instead of subspace, I think this could've worked. If the runabouts had been used immediately after the transporter failure, and before the comms went down, that particular aspect of the crisis could've been averted.
Also...again we have some cases of confused worship among the characters. Why do we get "Good Lord" from Quark when it should be "Blessed Exchequer" and "My God" from Kira when it should be "Prophets"? Lazy, writing staff, lazy.
I also have one big nit. Cardassian engineering standards. HOW can they be so low? We know the station is massively overbuilt, difficult to scan, and difficult to destroy at least in a structural sense, and we even see the strength of the materials put into it in this very episode. Cardassian precision and discipline become hallmarks of the species in everything else we see--yet their computers are so tolerant of egregious errors? Unless we're seeing evidence of Cardassia's lack of resorces, I don't know how this makes any sense.
(I also get the feeling the Arbazan ambassador was supposed to be based on people like the British Mary Whitehouse. Interesting that we rarely see a more conservative culture--i.e. one that isn't into premarital sex and so on--portrayed in a positive or at least neutral "that's their way, respect it even if it's not ours" light on Trek...it's always the really loony "Whitehouse" type we get instead.)
Overall, these two episodes are on the "would watch again" list, in spite of the problems...but problems there definitely were.
Okay. Thanks for the ad, Nerys! 
Let me state for the record, folks, that "O'Brien's Day" was my very first attempt at writing Trek. So...any problems with characterization can be attributed to the fact that I was raw. And that I'd only seen the first season of DS9 when I'd written it....
Now...for Nerys's review:
Personally, I'd never thought of Bashir as "harassing" Jadzia. While it was a little pathetic, still, I seriously doubt it was anything to warrent writing him up.
Also, his squirming and flinching when "Other Dax" is putting the moves on him, I think, is an indication that around here is the point where he's grugingly accepted that Real Dax Is Just Not That Into Him.
BTW...There's something to be said about "Real Dax" calling the other one "Submissive", and saying in a defensive tone, "Is that how you want me to be?"
I dunno. I wouldn't call Ezri submissive, per se, but she's certainly more...accepting of Julian's charms.
It's interesting, in "Afterimage", that Ezri seems to give kudos to Jadzia for knowing "how to handle it".
Of course, Julian wasn't nearly as...aggressive...with Ezri as he was with Jadzia, as far as "chasing" was concerned. Perhaps all his experiences with women have taught him, the hard way, how to act like a man, not a boy.
Now...for the "Forsaken":
I think "MADAME...Ambassador" needs some talking down to. Until the end, she's the embodiment of the arrogant jerk seen so much in TOS.
The other two, I think, are pretty cool. I like the Bolian most of all, and his air of certainty. I also like how he put "MADAME...Ambasador" in her place--temporarily of course.
Now...as for why Sisko gave the job to Bashir...I think their scene together establishes quite nicely that Sisko's intention is to bring our doctor down to size a bit. I'd say he succeeded.
Now...as for why "Cardassian Engineering" was so sub-par in this ep...recall that Dukat and Co. made it a point to trash the place before "Emmisary".
The craziness may have been a result of that.
Let me state for the record, folks, that "O'Brien's Day" was my very first attempt at writing Trek. So...any problems with characterization can be attributed to the fact that I was raw. And that I'd only seen the first season of DS9 when I'd written it....
Now...for Nerys's review:
Personally, I'd never thought of Bashir as "harassing" Jadzia. While it was a little pathetic, still, I seriously doubt it was anything to warrent writing him up.
Also, his squirming and flinching when "Other Dax" is putting the moves on him, I think, is an indication that around here is the point where he's grugingly accepted that Real Dax Is Just Not That Into Him.
BTW...There's something to be said about "Real Dax" calling the other one "Submissive", and saying in a defensive tone, "Is that how you want me to be?"
I dunno. I wouldn't call Ezri submissive, per se, but she's certainly more...accepting of Julian's charms.
It's interesting, in "Afterimage", that Ezri seems to give kudos to Jadzia for knowing "how to handle it".
Of course, Julian wasn't nearly as...aggressive...with Ezri as he was with Jadzia, as far as "chasing" was concerned. Perhaps all his experiences with women have taught him, the hard way, how to act like a man, not a boy.
Now...for the "Forsaken":
I think "MADAME...Ambassador" needs some talking down to. Until the end, she's the embodiment of the arrogant jerk seen so much in TOS.
The other two, I think, are pretty cool. I like the Bolian most of all, and his air of certainty. I also like how he put "MADAME...Ambasador" in her place--temporarily of course.
Now...as for why Sisko gave the job to Bashir...I think their scene together establishes quite nicely that Sisko's intention is to bring our doctor down to size a bit. I'd say he succeeded.
Now...as for why "Cardassian Engineering" was so sub-par in this ep...recall that Dukat and Co. made it a point to trash the place before "Emmisary".
The craziness may have been a result of that.
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You're very welcome for the ad...the instant I heard "Procedure is not recommended," your fanfic jumped right back into my mind!
Well, the fact that Bashir repeatedly refused to take a clear "no" as an answer, as far as I'm concerned, means Jadzia could easily have had him put on report if she'd wished, and I would've had no problem with it. If Julian was really so accepting that Dax wasn't into him, he should've stopped the romantic overtures. (And yes, before you say it, I think it's possible to sexually harass a man as well.) The reason I suspect it continued, though...I get the feeling Jadzia enjoyed watching Julian make a fool out of himself and was basically manipulating him. In the context of later seasons it seems to be the case, and that, too, is a very unattractive behavior and a rather disrespectful way of relating to men. As I think I've said elsewhere, men aren't there to be used as toys, either.
To his credit, Julian HAS done a lot of growing up by the time Season 7 rolls around. I think the revelations about his genetic engineering, his capture by the Dominion, and a number of other incidents have destroyed his naivete.
And yes, I get that Sisko intended to cut Julian down to size some...however, there were also some rather immature displays from Sisko--like when he was making childish faces when he had his back turned to the ambassadors--that made me wonder if he ever learned his lesson. (And given that he says his ambassadorial escorting tenure ended with his punching someone, I doubt he did.) It did kind of come off as evasion of responsibility.
The thing with Cardassian engineering is this. Yes, Dukat and company did a LOT of damage on the way out. Yet the tech manuals that were part of the Cardassian computers stated that a much lower standard of engineering was considered acceptable. This is the part that seems very, very out of place to me given what we see of the Cardassians in all other areas of their lives. They might not be AS regimented as Vulcans, but they sure get close.
Well, the fact that Bashir repeatedly refused to take a clear "no" as an answer, as far as I'm concerned, means Jadzia could easily have had him put on report if she'd wished, and I would've had no problem with it. If Julian was really so accepting that Dax wasn't into him, he should've stopped the romantic overtures. (And yes, before you say it, I think it's possible to sexually harass a man as well.) The reason I suspect it continued, though...I get the feeling Jadzia enjoyed watching Julian make a fool out of himself and was basically manipulating him. In the context of later seasons it seems to be the case, and that, too, is a very unattractive behavior and a rather disrespectful way of relating to men. As I think I've said elsewhere, men aren't there to be used as toys, either.
To his credit, Julian HAS done a lot of growing up by the time Season 7 rolls around. I think the revelations about his genetic engineering, his capture by the Dominion, and a number of other incidents have destroyed his naivete.
And yes, I get that Sisko intended to cut Julian down to size some...however, there were also some rather immature displays from Sisko--like when he was making childish faces when he had his back turned to the ambassadors--that made me wonder if he ever learned his lesson. (And given that he says his ambassadorial escorting tenure ended with his punching someone, I doubt he did.) It did kind of come off as evasion of responsibility.
The thing with Cardassian engineering is this. Yes, Dukat and company did a LOT of damage on the way out. Yet the tech manuals that were part of the Cardassian computers stated that a much lower standard of engineering was considered acceptable. This is the part that seems very, very out of place to me given what we see of the Cardassians in all other areas of their lives. They might not be AS regimented as Vulcans, but they sure get close.
Naturally, I am in complete agreement with you, senior Legate on the whole 'Cardassian engineering' aspect. Let us not forget that the CU fought a decades long war (albeit one that mainly consisted of a series of border skirmishes) with the AQ's preeminent superpower so Cardassian tech must have some effectiveness.
For example the infamous Cardassian disruptor rifle with it's basic yet study design is a masterpiece of military engineering. And Cardassian isolinear rods are easily the equal of any Federation data storage device.
Basically I'm very much opposed to the 'incompetent Cardassians' that we see in onscreen or in the EU. Although the onscreen Cardassians don't seem that incompetent, they did fight the Klingons to a stalemate after a dishourable sneak attack and with a little help from the Obsidian Order and the Bajoran resistance the CLB proved to be quite effective.
Alas in some of the dominion war novels the Cardassians are described as 'boneheads' and wretched fools whom are easy bested by our Starfleet heroes. Jeez, what's the point of having the Cardassians around eh?
Anyway rant over. Thanks for indulging me...
For example the infamous Cardassian disruptor rifle with it's basic yet study design is a masterpiece of military engineering. And Cardassian isolinear rods are easily the equal of any Federation data storage device.
Basically I'm very much opposed to the 'incompetent Cardassians' that we see in onscreen or in the EU. Although the onscreen Cardassians don't seem that incompetent, they did fight the Klingons to a stalemate after a dishourable sneak attack and with a little help from the Obsidian Order and the Bajoran resistance the CLB proved to be quite effective.
Alas in some of the dominion war novels the Cardassians are described as 'boneheads' and wretched fools whom are easy bested by our Starfleet heroes. Jeez, what's the point of having the Cardassians around eh?
Anyway rant over. Thanks for indulging me...
Can you tell me which, so I'd know what not to read
Can you tell me which, so I'd know what not to read
Behind Enemy Lines and Tunnel through the stars by John Vornholt.
Exactly. The feeling I always have had about Cardassian tech, when I write it, is that using it is a little more like using something 23rd-century...a little more rough-and-ready, and very overbuilt. Not as precise or as capable in all ways as the Feddies, but in a clever gul's hands, a deadly weapon.
The only thing that could excuse such low efficiency standards would be if somehow the Cardassian Union's lack of resources led to some inescapable problems with certain aspects of their tech. Not sure, though.
There are tonnes of examples of Cardassian technological prowess/indications that they're up to speed with the rest of the quadrant in terms of technology, surely? I mean, that episode with the 3 vipers where they all work on the subspace communications platform for the other side of the wormhole springs to mind, along with the episode of Voyager where B'Elanna is describing the Dreadnought missile. She damned nearly didn't manage to disarm that thing, it was by the skin of her teeth, and she's certainly supposed to be up there with some of the most skilled Engineers going.
To be honest, looking at that quote from Vornholt makes me think a lot less of him - he needs to do better research!
To be honest, looking at that quote from Vornholt makes me think a lot less of him - he needs to do better research!
Oh good, I've been missing your reviews
I liked this episode; indeed, my sister and I both consider it the most enjoyable of the season. Having seen seasons 5-7 first, she particularly liked the baseball. "Ah, that's how he got it" she said.
The whole twist that there isn't some random space anomaly was amusing, although as you say a weakness is that the aliens weren't followed up on (it would have been nice if they had been a sub-culture of wormhole aliens, more interested in alien contact than the mainstream Prophets). As you know, I agree with your analysis of Jadzia Dax's shift in personality, although I never had any problem with the KPG. However, your pointing out this episode does indeed demonstrate that the writers lost track of what they were intending Jadzia Dax to be. It also reminds me of "Past Prologue", where Dax mentioned the Joined Trill try to "rise above romance".
Also, seeing what Kira's imagination generated was very, very sobering--even that tiny moment made it very clear just how badly the Cardassians had scarred her and so many other Bajorans. I definitely felt myself imagining the guilt that a number of my Cardassian characters would feel, as I saw that scene.
I always interpreted the fire as the hateful anger of the Pah-wraiths from her mythology overwhelming her, as she tearfully confessed to Opaka in "Battle Lines" she feared she couldn't let go of the violence. It was indeed a very sobering scene and a good one for keeping Kira's inner struggle in the viewer's mind.
I really like "Dark Page" and it's one of my favourites. I always liked it when the writers remembered that Lwaxana's outer demeanor hid a very distraught woman, that it's at least partly an act. Lwaxana as comedy is fine- I usually enjoy it- but it's more poignant when they demonstrate that partly her manner is a means to hide from herself and her true feelings- an irony in Betazoids I wish was further explored.
Even going back to TOS, the Vulcans were a rather insular and intolerant race, within the perameters of a Federation culture dedicated to peace and diversity, of course. TNG, DS9 and ENT were all simply building on that, and personally I've never understood some fans' objection to ENT's depiction of the culture (perhaps they are taking Spock as representative of Vulcans, which is a very poor idea, especially as he's half-human). After all, why wouldn't Vulcans be a little "superior" in dealings with races whose cultures embrace that which Surakian ideology rejects as primitive and dangerous.
Oh, yes, I always dislike that. In season two, Mora Pol exclaims "my God!", and I always wince. You don't have a god, Mora, you worship multiple deities, the Prophets. "Babylon Five" was always quite good at this, in contrast. There, you'll hear "Great Maker!" "By G'Quan!" or "In Valen's Name!" rather than any human terms.
It's a shame we never saw the Arbazan again. I always regret that we didn't see more of the internal politics of the Federation in Trek,particularly in DS9, which elsewhere was very good with the politics of the Trek universe.
^Well, it's like an Undeniable Truth Of Life:
If a "conservative" POV is ever taken seriously in Trek, the fan reaction is "Oh, they're FORCING and PREACHING," etc.
BTW, it's interesting, how in Section 31: Abyss, Ezri goes, "Oh, gods....", implying more than one Trill god.
FWIW, I'm actually working on a project on Trill Religion to that effect, using that and the Trill Ritual Chants in other eps. Nerys know a little about this. The rest o' y'all will probably have to wait a while....
If a "conservative" POV is ever taken seriously in Trek, the fan reaction is "Oh, they're FORCING and PREACHING," etc.
BTW, it's interesting, how in Section 31: Abyss, Ezri goes, "Oh, gods....", implying more than one Trill god.
FWIW, I'm actually working on a project on Trill Religion to that effect, using that and the Trill Ritual Chants in other eps. Nerys know a little about this. The rest o' y'all will probably have to wait a while....
^Well, it's like an Undeniable Truth Of Life:
If a "conservative" POV is ever taken seriously in Trek, the fan reaction is "Oh, they're FORCING and PREACHING," etc.
BTW, it's interesting, how in Section 31: Abyss, Ezri goes, "Oh, gods....", implying more than one Trill god.
FWIW, I'm actually working on a project on Trill Religion to that effect, using that and the Trill Ritual Chants in other eps. Nerys know a little about this. The rest o' y'all will probably have to wait a while....
True that. (the stuff about different POVs although the Trill gods idea has merit.)
Mind you I would not like to see the exact opposite of this either, with those whom do not follow a particular religion or don't believe treated as pariahs or outcasts. If the UFP is a pluralistic society then surely most political and societal views would be accepted with the exception of racism (which would be unacceptable in a interplanetary, multispecies alliance anyway. Not because we outgrew it to become perfect or whatnot just that it would be frakking stupid)
There's also one other great line from section 31; Abyss, when bashir states that "the humans will go mad" temporarily forgetting that he's one himself.
Exactly.
Although, I don't really see Spock as an argument against Vulcans as insular and arrogant, considering 1) the mocking and abuse he received from other children for being half-human ("Journey to Babel") and 2) his own disparaging remarks about Humans (even though they seemed often to be a reaction to McCoy and others mocking Vulcan customs), which in his case amounts to self-loathing in a way; it seemed that, after having been pressurized to be "more Vulcan" while growing up, he came to live among Humans and found himself perceived as a Vulcan, so he stuck to an uber-Vulcan identity he constructed for himself. Funny how rarely anyone in TOS ever pointed out how paradoxical this attitude was (I only remember two times when Kirk points out that Spock is half-human.)
In BSG, where Humans are polytheists (while Cylons are monotheistic), they allowed a mistake in the pilot, when actor Michael Hogan (Tigh) said "Jesus!" which, I think, was not in the script. But from that moment on, they always had characters say "My gods!", in plural (except for Cylons and other characters who accepted their monotheistic religion).
I'm not sure what you're referring to. A lot of fans complain about Star Trek FORCING and PREACHING in many, many cases that have nothing to do with a conservative point of view. Because, you know, Star Trek does tend to preach. Like, all those times when the characters on TNG would start talking about how evolved their society is, with no money, no economic problems, no crime or poverty, everyone having as much as they need - like a communist utopia/fairytale. That kind of thing makes me roll my eyes and say, give me a break.^Well, it's like an Undeniable Truth Of Life:
If a "conservative" POV is ever taken seriously in Trek, the fan reaction is "Oh, they're FORCING and PREACHING," etc.
With this talk of Bashir wanting a Submissive Dax now I can't help but be reminded of Seeds of Dissent.
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I'm not advocating for doing this, either. I just want to see REAL tolerance instead of what the human race in Trek seems to have where apparently you're only tolerated in your beliefs if you're an alien, and it's still seen as this quaint, primitive thing.
Coming tomorrow--reviews of "Dramatis Personae" and...
"DUET"!!!
"DUET"!!!
Whoo hoo!
Lookin' forward to it--especially seeing as "Duet" was the gold standard--the ep that set the standard for the episodes to come.
Indeed it is. BTW, I'm going to PM you something you might like...
BTW, I'm going to PM you something you might like...
"Dramatis Personae"
Right now, at this point in Season 1, I have to admit it. While I'm overall liking the show and think this is the strongest first season any of the Treks ever put out, the line "Something's coming through the wormhole" is starting to feel a little cliched. Instead of alien-of-the-week or anomaly-of-the-week, it's wormhole-ejecta of the week. Thankfully, though, it's not every week. Taken alone, I wouldn't have noticed this because I like many of these episodes, but taken together, it's noticeable.
This episode was interesting to watch, especially seeing the crew take on these exaggerated or otherwise different personas. I especially found Kira's Saltah'na persona interesting because in a lot of ways, she struck me as what the Intendant could've been without all of the ridiculous hyperamorous behavior: cold, conniving, and altogether very frightening. The other major high point of the episode itself was the way Odo dealt with the crisis--he did a WONDERFUL job of acting like he was into the conspiracy to motivate Bashir to solve the problem. Speaking of Bashir, he's still a bit hammy in his "evil" mode, but I think Siddig's learned a bit of a lesson from the Vantika Rao bit on what NEVER to do.
Yet on the other side...kind of like "Something's coming through the wormhole," I've kind of noticed that Odo being the unaffected party whenever something does a mindfrak on people, be it a virus or whatever else, is a running theme. Any of these episodes are good on their own, but taken together, you do start to notice.
The other high point I'd like to mention, though, before I move into the nitpicks, is the visual design of a few items. The Saltah'na clock is really gorgeous to look at, and I'm glad that just like with Picard's flute, they kept it on as a permanent set item. Whoever designed that did a fantastic job. The other thing I found myself really wanting was what looked like a Cardassian WACOM tablet. I'd always wondered how, with pencils and paper not being in existence anymore, people who did art, architectural plans, and so on, on the computer would enter their data; we'd never seen any evidence of it before. But that gold Cardassian WACOM solved the problem. AND it looked great in the process. If someone ever made a real, working WACOM tablet that looked like that, depending on price I would look into it! At the size it was, that would be SUPER awesome!
OK...now that I'm done lauding the props department (giving props for props? ), I'm afraid I do have to move on to the nitpicks--the things that didn't seem right.
First--when the Saltah'na effect tried to affect Odo, why did it go just for his head instead of his entire form? And why did he actually go unconscious still in his humanoid shape? Is that some sort of Changeling instinct? (Heck...MAYBE you could even make a case that it's an infant's instinct to freeze in form, one that Odo hasn't gotten rid of as a mature Founder would have--a defense mechanism against paranoid solids who might persecute a shapeshifter?) On the head thing, I was thinking maybe that's simply an issue of where Odo perceives his consciousness when he's in humanoid form, but that part still seems fishy.
Another question is this. When Odo was trying to get a signal out to Starfleet or Bajor, it seemed to me there was an obvious solution. If ALL subspace communications weren't blocked, it seems like a signal could've been relayed through the Klingon Empire (which I believe was allied at the time). In an EXTREME, desperate emergency, the Cardassian Union might be possible as well, but this would have to be only as a response to imminent, blow-up-the-station danger because the Federation and the Cardassian Union are still NOT on such good terms with each other.
The other question is this. The solution in the cargo bay made it seem like ONLY the senior staff was affected by the Saltah'na orbs. If that's the case--what about all the people who unquestioningly followed orders...some pretty evil orders...from the affected staff? Either they had to have had their minds purged later when we didn't see it onscreen, OR we have a very major problem with some people who followed assassination and mutiny orders of their own free will and did not question the situation they were in as Odo did. Even Quark seemed more suspicious.
Oh, and one last observation, though this one is neutral. I wonder why it is that when transporting the Klingon aboard, the Cardassian transporter didn't automatically step in and force the incoming signal onto its own protocol (as was later done manually)?
And I still question why the Cardassians would put a transporter in Ops...unless they've got a forcefield they routinely bring up during any kind of questionable transport. (Maybe the Feddies think this is too paranoid or mean a precaution because of the risk of accidental shock, but if you ask ME, that would be the ONLY reasonable way to do it, if you have a transporter in OPS.)
And now, the review you've all been waiting for:
"Duet"
Let me say it. This is one of the greats of ALL time, as far as Trek is concerned, and maybe any other show.
For those of you who have seen me reflecting throughout these early episodes on the subject of Cardassian guilt, on how I think my Cardassian characters would feel if they saw the events of some of these episodes with their own eyes, this episode is one of the best explorations of the subject of the horrors of the Occupation through both Bajoran AND Cardassian eyes.
I don't even feel like I can give a "review" per se because it was all excellent. Rather, I am going to leave some food for thought, for the most part, because this episode is FULL of questions that could be debated forever.
One of the questions, indeed, is the subject of guilt. As we'll later find out, Cardassians take this notion very seriously. Whether you ACT in an evil fashion, or you simply think about evil, or you ignore evil going on around you, to a Cardassian mind, you're guilty. Aamin Marritza therefore sees himself as being guilty of a sin of omission, because he failed to act on his deep feeling that what was going on was NOT right. To what degree do you see his guilt being?
And what about what he says about racial guilt? I think that he's right to believe that Cardassians need to be exposed to what happened, to really take a look at the facts and reflect HARD on what's happened, to realize that they have done horrible things in the name of the state. And yet...is it really fair to brand every Cardassian with that sort of Cain's mark? Isn't it just as wrong to not see one's OWN people as individuals as it is to look at another race that way?
When the man who attacked Marritza ranted about Cardassians (speaking of them as object, not even as people--"one of THOSE"), and when he killed him just because he was Cardassian...doesn't that make him just as bad as the kinds of Cardassians he hated? That theme of becoming what you hate really seems to have been a common thread through the treatment of the Bajorans in Season 1: while there is more forgiveness for terrorism than we would see in a modern show, I must say that they didn't hesitate to show the ugliness that the Bajorans have taken into their own spirits, the almost Cardassian way that they've allowed themselves to become.
Finally, about Marritza himself...what IS he, really? Is he mentally disturbed? Is he heroic? Or is he indeed a coward?
Now a few last points on the character interactions we saw. Obviously this was a HUGE Kira episode. We really see the fruits of her work to gain trust between her and Sisko--this could never have happened at the beginning of the season. That said, though, it kind of seems like Kira went over Sisko's head again to tell the Bajoran Provisional Government that they had captured a war criminal. And yet, that seems very true to what we see with Kira always: it's always two steps forward, one step back, with her. She'll do something here--step forward and admit that you can't just kill or hate because someone is Cardassian, she'll care that an innocent Cardassian is dead (first when she believed Darhe'el killed the real Marritza, and then when Marritza himself died), then step dramatically back and refuse to admit that innocents died or were wounded in her attacks, and that there is something sad and wrong about that ("The Darkness and the Light"), or where she used her hate for Cardassians as an excuse not to face her own inner demons, and to hurt someone so she wouldn't have to ("Ties of Blood and Water").
Marritza was very well-acted by Harris Yulin. Yes, Darhe'el was over the top. But maybe the real Darhe'el was like that--and even if he wasn't, it makes sense, because Marritza, too, is being an actor. And in those small moments, when he turns his back, in the middle of his act, or where his face can't be seen by Kira, you get these brief glimpses (once you know what they are) of who Marritza actually is, and how repulsed he must be at his own words, at having to absorb this hideous person that Darhe'el was into himself.
I must say, too, that Marritza REALLY did his research on Kira. Not only did he know her history, but he knew exactly how to tweak her. One wonders just WHAT kinds of files he was able to get into, that the Cardassians had on her. (Tekeny later suggests it's pretty extensive, and Entek does as well.)
One other tragic thing about Marritza, when you think about it. Something tells me that if he'd lived, there would not have been any help for him back on Kora II--just punishment and probably a shameful and public trial and death for what he did, no matter what the Cardassian authorities said. Yet the Federation felt they had nothing they could do other than send him back. Why didn't they let him request asylum? Or was it because there was at least reasonable suspicion that he was non compos mentis, that they felt the only thing they could do was contact the Cardassian authorities and let them handle the situation as they saw fit...even if they were lying through their teeth?
Oh, and we get our first (I think) reprise of Gul Dukat. And I must say, in comparison with someone like Marritza, you just want to SMACK him. "Alleged atrocities"--says the man who was in charge of it all! Yet I should say that his willingness to hand over the files on Darhe'el should've also been a big red flag about who they were holding captive. If Dukat actually wants to help you, you can bet it's not a favorable thing for Bajor or the Federation.
One final technical question: what IS Kalla-Nohra, and why has it never been seen in any other mining accident? The way it's portrayed kind of reminds me of asbestosis, black lung disease, and the like (we see the Gallitep survivors, as well as those who were in the picture from when the camp was actually running covering their faces).
In the end, I only have two tiny nits about this episode at all, and they're very tiny. First, how did the image reconstruction actually shift perspective as it enhanced the image, and replace an entire half a face that wasn't even in the picture? Is that even possible?? And second...it does seem like it was yet another "Odo's objectivity saves the day," which would've been fine except that even in the last episode that's what happened.
Right now, at this point in Season 1, I have to admit it. While I'm overall liking the show and think this is the strongest first season any of the Treks ever put out, the line "Something's coming through the wormhole" is starting to feel a little cliched. Instead of alien-of-the-week or anomaly-of-the-week, it's wormhole-ejecta of the week. Thankfully, though, it's not every week. Taken alone, I wouldn't have noticed this because I like many of these episodes, but taken together, it's noticeable.
This episode was interesting to watch, especially seeing the crew take on these exaggerated or otherwise different personas. I especially found Kira's Saltah'na persona interesting because in a lot of ways, she struck me as what the Intendant could've been without all of the ridiculous hyperamorous behavior: cold, conniving, and altogether very frightening. The other major high point of the episode itself was the way Odo dealt with the crisis--he did a WONDERFUL job of acting like he was into the conspiracy to motivate Bashir to solve the problem. Speaking of Bashir, he's still a bit hammy in his "evil" mode, but I think Siddig's learned a bit of a lesson from the Vantika Rao bit on what NEVER to do.
Yet on the other side...kind of like "Something's coming through the wormhole," I've kind of noticed that Odo being the unaffected party whenever something does a mindfrak on people, be it a virus or whatever else, is a running theme. Any of these episodes are good on their own, but taken together, you do start to notice.
The other high point I'd like to mention, though, before I move into the nitpicks, is the visual design of a few items. The Saltah'na clock is really gorgeous to look at, and I'm glad that just like with Picard's flute, they kept it on as a permanent set item. Whoever designed that did a fantastic job. The other thing I found myself really wanting was what looked like a Cardassian WACOM tablet. I'd always wondered how, with pencils and paper not being in existence anymore, people who did art, architectural plans, and so on, on the computer would enter their data; we'd never seen any evidence of it before. But that gold Cardassian WACOM solved the problem. AND it looked great in the process. If someone ever made a real, working WACOM tablet that looked like that, depending on price I would look into it! At the size it was, that would be SUPER awesome!
OK...now that I'm done lauding the props department (giving props for props?
), I'm afraid I do have to move on to the nitpicks--the things that didn't seem right.First--when the Saltah'na effect tried to affect Odo, why did it go just for his head instead of his entire form? And why did he actually go unconscious still in his humanoid shape? Is that some sort of Changeling instinct? (Heck...MAYBE you could even make a case that it's an infant's instinct to freeze in form, one that Odo hasn't gotten rid of as a mature Founder would have--a defense mechanism against paranoid solids who might persecute a shapeshifter?) On the head thing, I was thinking maybe that's simply an issue of where Odo perceives his consciousness when he's in humanoid form, but that part still seems fishy.
Another question is this. When Odo was trying to get a signal out to Starfleet or Bajor, it seemed to me there was an obvious solution. If ALL subspace communications weren't blocked, it seems like a signal could've been relayed through the Klingon Empire (which I believe was allied at the time). In an EXTREME, desperate emergency, the Cardassian Union might be possible as well, but this would have to be only as a response to imminent, blow-up-the-station danger because the Federation and the Cardassian Union are still NOT on such good terms with each other.
The other question is this. The solution in the cargo bay made it seem like ONLY the senior staff was affected by the Saltah'na orbs. If that's the case--what about all the people who unquestioningly followed orders...some pretty evil orders...from the affected staff? Either they had to have had their minds purged later when we didn't see it onscreen, OR we have a very major problem with some people who followed assassination and mutiny orders of their own free will and did not question the situation they were in as Odo did. Even Quark seemed more suspicious.
Oh, and one last observation, though this one is neutral. I wonder why it is that when transporting the Klingon aboard, the Cardassian transporter didn't automatically step in and force the incoming signal onto its own protocol (as was later done manually)?
And I still question why the Cardassians would put a transporter in Ops...unless they've got a forcefield they routinely bring up during any kind of questionable transport. (Maybe the Feddies think this is too paranoid or mean a precaution because of the risk of accidental shock, but if you ask ME, that would be the ONLY reasonable way to do it, if you have a transporter in OPS.)
And now, the review you've all been waiting for:
"Duet"
Let me say it. This is one of the greats of ALL time, as far as Trek is concerned, and maybe any other show.
For those of you who have seen me reflecting throughout these early episodes on the subject of Cardassian guilt, on how I think my Cardassian characters would feel if they saw the events of some of these episodes with their own eyes, this episode is one of the best explorations of the subject of the horrors of the Occupation through both Bajoran AND Cardassian eyes.
I don't even feel like I can give a "review" per se because it was all excellent. Rather, I am going to leave some food for thought, for the most part, because this episode is FULL of questions that could be debated forever.
One of the questions, indeed, is the subject of guilt. As we'll later find out, Cardassians take this notion very seriously. Whether you ACT in an evil fashion, or you simply think about evil, or you ignore evil going on around you, to a Cardassian mind, you're guilty. Aamin Marritza therefore sees himself as being guilty of a sin of omission, because he failed to act on his deep feeling that what was going on was NOT right. To what degree do you see his guilt being?
And what about what he says about racial guilt? I think that he's right to believe that Cardassians need to be exposed to what happened, to really take a look at the facts and reflect HARD on what's happened, to realize that they have done horrible things in the name of the state. And yet...is it really fair to brand every Cardassian with that sort of Cain's mark? Isn't it just as wrong to not see one's OWN people as individuals as it is to look at another race that way?
When the man who attacked Marritza ranted about Cardassians (speaking of them as object, not even as people--"one of THOSE"), and when he killed him just because he was Cardassian...doesn't that make him just as bad as the kinds of Cardassians he hated? That theme of becoming what you hate really seems to have been a common thread through the treatment of the Bajorans in Season 1: while there is more forgiveness for terrorism than we would see in a modern show, I must say that they didn't hesitate to show the ugliness that the Bajorans have taken into their own spirits, the almost Cardassian way that they've allowed themselves to become.
Finally, about Marritza himself...what IS he, really? Is he mentally disturbed? Is he heroic? Or is he indeed a coward?
Now a few last points on the character interactions we saw. Obviously this was a HUGE Kira episode. We really see the fruits of her work to gain trust between her and Sisko--this could never have happened at the beginning of the season. That said, though, it kind of seems like Kira went over Sisko's head again to tell the Bajoran Provisional Government that they had captured a war criminal. And yet, that seems very true to what we see with Kira always: it's always two steps forward, one step back, with her. She'll do something here--step forward and admit that you can't just kill or hate because someone is Cardassian, she'll care that an innocent Cardassian is dead (first when she believed Darhe'el killed the real Marritza, and then when Marritza himself died), then step dramatically back and refuse to admit that innocents died or were wounded in her attacks, and that there is something sad and wrong about that ("The Darkness and the Light"), or where she used her hate for Cardassians as an excuse not to face her own inner demons, and to hurt someone so she wouldn't have to ("Ties of Blood and Water").
Marritza was very well-acted by Harris Yulin. Yes, Darhe'el was over the top. But maybe the real Darhe'el was like that--and even if he wasn't, it makes sense, because Marritza, too, is being an actor. And in those small moments, when he turns his back, in the middle of his act, or where his face can't be seen by Kira, you get these brief glimpses (once you know what they are) of who Marritza actually is, and how repulsed he must be at his own words, at having to absorb this hideous person that Darhe'el was into himself.
I must say, too, that Marritza REALLY did his research on Kira. Not only did he know her history, but he knew exactly how to tweak her. One wonders just WHAT kinds of files he was able to get into, that the Cardassians had on her. (Tekeny later suggests it's pretty extensive, and Entek does as well.)
One other tragic thing about Marritza, when you think about it. Something tells me that if he'd lived, there would not have been any help for him back on Kora II--just punishment and probably a shameful and public trial and death for what he did, no matter what the Cardassian authorities said. Yet the Federation felt they had nothing they could do other than send him back. Why didn't they let him request asylum? Or was it because there was at least reasonable suspicion that he was non compos mentis, that they felt the only thing they could do was contact the Cardassian authorities and let them handle the situation as they saw fit...even if they were lying through their teeth?
Oh, and we get our first (I think) reprise of Gul Dukat. And I must say, in comparison with someone like Marritza, you just want to SMACK him. "Alleged atrocities"--says the man who was in charge of it all! Yet I should say that his willingness to hand over the files on Darhe'el should've also been a big red flag about who they were holding captive. If Dukat actually wants to help you, you can bet it's not a favorable thing for Bajor or the Federation.
One final technical question: what IS Kalla-Nohra, and why has it never been seen in any other mining accident? The way it's portrayed kind of reminds me of asbestosis, black lung disease, and the like (we see the Gallitep survivors, as well as those who were in the picture from when the camp was actually running covering their faces).
In the end, I only have two tiny nits about this episode at all, and they're very tiny. First, how did the image reconstruction actually shift perspective as it enhanced the image, and replace an entire half a face that wasn't even in the picture? Is that even possible?? And second...it does seem like it was yet another "Odo's objectivity saves the day," which would've been fine except that even in the last episode that's what happened.
My guess is--speedy transport for personnel needed from another part of the station.
"Glinn Ranar--you are required in Ops--immediately."
"You realize that I am on the lowest level on the station."
"Do not worry, sir--we can beam you here."
"Very good. Energize."
Also...on Kira killing Cardassian civillians, I love her reaction to this. She gets defensive, and VERY upset. She doesn't want to admit it, but...deep down, in places she doesn't talk about at parties...she knows Marritza's right. She feels Marritza' right.
