SG-U – Water (1x06) - (Discuss – Grade | SPOILERS)

[Brent]

8. This one was a bit of a mixed bag but enjoyable. Characters were pretty good. The storyline was interesting with decent drama. Nothing stellar/epic but kept me in the story. The resolution was too obvious, in fact I thought that torchman's solution was going to be to herd them to the gate. The thing plot point about them lying to each other as being mature and a learning experience for Eli fell flat.

I enjoyed it but it was far from perfect. I have to ask again, are the showrunners going to change things up? This basic survival, obtaining resources stuff is ok for now. But, it won't keep the series going for the long run. The basic formula is: they lack X. Ship gets them X or at least gets a wormhole to X.

Mr Awe

I think the next episode "Earth" is going to start moving us toward that direction, and give us more action.

When several of the crew use the communication stones to visit Earth, officials propose a dangerous plan that could return the stranded Destiny crew home.

The one that worries me is the episode after Earth called "Time", yes time travel will be involved apparently this early on in the series in some regard.

 

[Mr Awe]

I think the next episode "Earth" is going to start moving us toward that direction, and give us more action.

When several of the crew use the communication stones to visit Earth, officials propose a dangerous plan that could return the stranded Destiny crew home.

The one that worries me is the episode after Earth called "Time", yes time travel will be involved apparently this early on in the series in some regard.

This early in the series, you just know it's not going to work. This is the type of storyline they should be avoiding, ways to get back that clearly won't work. At this point, it should just be, we have no fucking clue as to how to get back. It'll come down to implementation but it's not really building on a good base.

I don't mind time travel so much. But, it again depends how it is done. And, what's the point of time traveling in another galaxy? We won't know the past from the future of planet X!

They will need some relateable context to make it interesting. Maybe it's connected to Earth? Or maybe future versions of themselves, ala Red Dwarf?

Mr Awe

 

[cylkoth]

I think the next episode "Earth" is going to start moving us toward that direction, and give us more action.

When several of the crew use the communication stones to visit Earth, officials propose a dangerous plan that could return the stranded Destiny crew home.

The one that worries me is the episode after Earth called "Time", yes time travel will be involved apparently this early on in the series in some regard.

This early in the series, you just know it's not going to work. This is the type of storyline they should be avoiding, ways to get back that clearly won't work. At this point, it should just be, we have no fucking clue as to how to get back.

Sigh, didn't we get "Home" in season 1 of Atlantis, and it turned out not to be real, courtesy of the mist aliens, and the way back turned out not viable?

This really is turning into a reboot of Atlantis, doing everything ATL should have done but didn't, using the BSG/Firefly visual style and dark and gritty tone.

 

[Harvey]

And isn't Dexter about a serial killer?

Sure, it's about a serial killer. But isn't Stargate SG-1 about a race of evil aliens who want to enslave/eliminate the human race? Isn't Stargate Atlantis about a race of aliens that thrive by eating humans?

And I'll throw in Boston Legal, a five season ratings success, as another example of there being plenty of shows that aren't "dark and gritty." Although, if you're throwing Star Trek in that category, maybe you'd like to enlighten us as to what "dark and gritty" actually means?

Don't bother--you're arguing with a guy who thinks the new Star Trek movie is conforming to a dark and gritty fad because a bunch of people die and Spock kisses Uhura. The whole debate is absurd.

It's hardly absurd. I'm far from the only one who's aware of it. Even some of the architects of the fad, such as Alan Moore and Grant Morrison have spoken about it. It's a very blatant and obvious cultural phenomenon.

That one wasn't my post.

 

[Snaploud]

I'm still unclear, did those few chunks of ice solve their water problems? Because all that ice they brought back might melt into 200-300 hundred liters tops.

"Good work everyone. Lt. Scott and I have brought back enough water for everyone for one day. I guess we'll be mining for water again soon."

Rush said that it would fill up a fraction of capacity. He also seemed annoyed that Young wanted to waste time trying to save Lt. Slut when he could be collecting more ice.

You're right, though, that the ice couldn't possibly last all that long. They really need to come back to this issue soon.

It's a closed system. So, all the water is recycled. The previous problem was that the aliens were draining the water. They are at less than full capacity on the water but it will be recycled and the alien drain is gone. Getting rid of the aliens was far more important than the measely amount of ice they obtained.

Mr Awe

...then why would Rush push so hard for the Lt. and Colonel Young to stay outside and gather more ice (talking about how they still weren't going to be at more than a fraction of capacity)? There were clearly worries about a water shortage prior to any concerns about mysteriously missing water.

 

[Harvey]

But the water was already missing at that point. They didn't know where it was going, but they did know their supply was decreasing rapidly and had to be replenished, as much as possible.

 

[Snaploud]

We've been given no indication of some advanced 100% efficient water recycling system. In fact, we've been hearing the opposite as far back as the talk about finding the special showers.

 

[Mr Awe]

Rush said that it would fill up a fraction of capacity. He also seemed annoyed that Young wanted to waste time trying to save Lt. Slut when he could be collecting more ice.

You're right, though, that the ice couldn't possibly last all that long. They really need to come back to this issue soon.

It's a closed system. So, all the water is recycled. The previous problem was that the aliens were draining the water. They are at less than full capacity on the water but it will be recycled and the alien drain is gone. Getting rid of the aliens was far more important than the measely amount of ice they obtained.

Mr Awe

...then why would Rush push so hard for the Lt. and Colonel Young to stay outside and gather more ice (talking about how they still weren't going to be at more than a fraction of capacity)? There were clearly worries about a water shortage prior to any concerns about mysteriously missing water.

I'm forgeting, but wasn't that before they knew what was happening to the water? They certainly hadn't gotten rid of the aliens by that point.

Mr Awe

 

[Snaploud]

*checks over episode descriptions*

The first mention of water rationing is in Darkness (the episode after the one with the desert). There appears to have already been evidence at that point that the water was being used for some purpose they could not identify (the aliens, we now know).

However, this episode also gives us our first and only reference to a liquid waste recycling system (one they had not yet been able to fix), and there is no mention of its efficiency in water recycling.

That means we're still waiting on the writers to tell us whether or not water is going to be a periodic issue.

 

[Kpnuts]

Pretty good episode. Finally a bit of action.

Getting fed up with all the arguing and yelling.

 

[Mr Awe]

However, this episode also gives us our first and only reference to a liquid waste recycling system (one they had not yet been able to fix), and there is no mention of its efficiency in water recycling.

I'm pretty sure that any civilization that can create a stargate system, create a ship that can last for 100,000 years, travel between galaxies, and has enough AI to fend for itself and deduce the needs of the inhabitants, will also have 100% efficient water recycling system! That's small potatos to everything else!

Plus, they talked about it being a closed system where there shouldn't be any water loss. The implication is that they just recently learned more about the water system. That there shouldn't be any water loss but yet there was.

Mr Awe

 

[Xerxus]

*checks over episode descriptions*

The first mention of water rationing is in Darkness (the episode after the one with the desert). There appears to have already been evidence at that point that the water was being used for some purpose they could not identify (the aliens, we now know).

However, this episode also gives us our first and only reference to a liquid waste recycling system (one they had not yet been able to fix), and there is no mention of its efficiency in water recycling.

That means we're still waiting on the writers to tell us whether or not water is going to be a periodic issue.

Actually, they mentioned water rationing in Air Part 3 briefly. After Rush and Franklin returned from the desert, Young orders Riley to give him water. Riley says "that was my ration for the day." At least they were thinking about it at that point.

Darkness mentions the liquid waste recycling system during the morning briefing.

"BRODY: We also identified a recycling system for liquid waste, so once we get that system up and running ..."

 

[RJDiogenes]

How can something with so much lens flare be "dark and gritty"?

When it's rebooted to kill off two planets worth of people, not to mention the parents of the main characters, just for the "shock" value and to eliminate the core concept of an optimistic future; the current audience finds anything positive to be "cheesy."

Wait, so people never died needlessly in previous Trek? Planets were never destroyed or wiped clean of life?

You do know that this past May Star Trek was rebooted to a nu, darker version of the original, right?

And isn't Dexter about a serial killer?

Sure, it's about a serial killer. But isn't Stargate SG-1 about a race of evil aliens who want to enslave/eliminate the human race? Isn't Stargate Atlantis about a race of aliens that thrive by eating humans?

No, those shows are about heroic Humans defending the Earth (and others) from the antagonists that you mention.

And I'll throw in Boston Legal, a five season ratings success, as another example of there being plenty of shows that aren't "dark and gritty." Although, if you're throwing Star Trek in that category, maybe you'd like to enlighten us as to what "dark and gritty" actually means?

I'm not familiar with Boston Legal, but I didn't say that every single show or movie has succumbed as yet. I can name several exceptions myself. And there are several great shows, such as Firefly and Lost, that rely on the D&G appeal. As to why Star Trek now falls into that category, it's because they've thrown out forty years of history and rebooted the original concept of an optimistic future into a darker world where the parents of the main characters are killed and the planet Vulcan is destroyed (along with most of Starfleet and part of Earth apparently) just for the sake of shock value and so SNL won't make fun of it.

 

[David cgc]

So, it counts as dark and gritty when Vulcan is blown up, but when a dozen nameless planets are chopped up or eaten whole by doomsday machines and space amoebas just to make the threat of the week more daunting, that's fine.

 

[Gepard]

It's also worth noting that the new Doctor Who--of which RJ is quite the fan--rebooted it's core concept by destroying the Doctor's home planet and wiping out his people (albeit off screen) and has spent four seasons milking that for all the pathos it could. It's very similar to Star Trek that way, yet somehow it's not "dark and gritty."

(along with most of Starfleet and part of Earth apparently)

This is why you shouldn't comment on things you haven't watched, because you're wrong. The Narada drilled a hole in the San Fransisco bay and destroyed a small number of Starfleet ships. The planet Earth, all of Starfleet's facilities and the bulk of the fleet itself are totally fine. Hell, by wiping out a third of the fleet, the Borg did more damage in "The Best of Both Worlds."

 

[Star Wolf]

It's a closed system. So, all the water is recycled. The previous problem was that the aliens were draining the water. They are at less than full capacity on the water but it will be recycled and the alien drain is gone. Getting rid of the aliens was far more important than the measely amount of ice they obtained.

Mr Awe

...then why would Rush push so hard for the Lt. and Colonel Young to stay outside and gather more ice (talking about how they still weren't going to be at more than a fraction of capacity)? There were clearly worries about a water shortage prior to any concerns about mysteriously missing water.

I'm forgeting, but wasn't that before they knew what was happening to the water? They certainly hadn't gotten rid of the aliens by that point.

Mr Awe

Despite all of Rush's genius it took the Last Starfighter Eli to make the connection. Alien species appears water disappears

 

[David cgc]

Though there is the question of where exactly they were putting it. I mean, there weren't nearly enough bugs to account for 40,000 liters of water, even if that was the only thing they ingested to reproduce.

 

[T'Girl]

Pressure suits reminded me of the suits from the first alien movie.


`

 

[RJDiogenes]

So, it counts as dark and gritty when Vulcan is blown up, but when a dozen nameless planets are chopped up or eaten whole by doomsday machines and space amoebas just to make the threat of the week more daunting, that's fine.

Yes, they were too cavalier with the body count when they thought that nobody would watch any given episode more than once or twice. And, yes, it is different when something happens to a main character or setting than when it happens to someone or something supernumerary. And, yes, it is different when you go back to the beginning and retcon the mass death and destruction of established icons and settings for cheap shock value.

It's also worth noting that the new Doctor Who--of which RJ is quite the fan--rebooted it's core concept by destroying the Doctor's home planet and wiping out his people (albeit off screen) and has spent four seasons milking that for all the pathos it could. It's very similar to Star Trek that way, yet somehow it's not "dark and gritty."

I'm not too crazy about that aspect of Doctor Who; it's been pretty pointless and does seem like a gratuitous nod to the fad so far. But the thing is, they haven't used it to ruin the Doctor's character and the show has been otherwise excellent.

This is why you shouldn't comment on things you haven't watched, because you're wrong. The Narada drilled a hole in the San Fransisco bay and destroyed a small number of Starfleet ships. The planet Earth, all of Starfleet's facilities and the bulk of the fleet itself are totally fine.

That's why I said "apparently." In any case, it adds to the retconned deaths. They also wiped out billions on Romulus, which was retarded, but not a retcon (unless you count the future of "All Good Things").

Hell, by wiping out a third of the fleet, the Borg did more damage in "The Best of Both Worlds."

Yes, and that was a great story because it was a deviation from the norm. Unfortunately, somebody realized how much the contemporary audience loves death and torture and this led to the war in DS9, the Borgification of VOY, the general graying of Trek and ultimately to the horrible First Contact and then nu Trek.

 

[cultcross]

Yes, they were too cavalier with the body count when they thought that nobody would watch any given episode more than once or twice. And, yes, it is different when something happens to a main character or setting than when it happens to someone or something supernumerary. And, yes, it is different when you go back to the beginning and retcon the mass death and destruction of established icons and settings for cheap shock value.

So Star Treks I, II, III, VI and VII are all awful too, I assume, as they, in turn, threatened Earth and totally changed the Enterprise, killed Spock, destroyed the Enterprise, killed off the Klingon Empire, and killed Kirk?
You can't like a great deal of the franchise, if your standards are really this set in stone. The cinematograhpy and approach may be literally 'darker' than it used to be in TOS, the subject matter really isn't - TNG, with its happy-happy-happy approach is the exception, not the rule.

I'm not too crazy about that aspect of Doctor Who; it's been pretty pointless and does seem like a gratuitous nod to the fad so far. But the thing is, they haven't used it to ruin the Doctor's character and the show has been otherwise excellent.

The show, particularly in the first season and most subsequent 'event' episodes, has been largely about the effects of the Time War and the fact The Doctor is the last of the time lords. If you can look past that plotline, you're being very selective here about what 'dark and gritty' stuff is just fine.

Unfortunately, somebody realized how much the contemporary audience loves death and torture and this led to the war in DS9, the Borgification of VOY, the general graying of Trek and ultimately to the horrible First Contact and then nu Trek.

With the exception of the Borg on Voyager (but actually an exception because of the pansy-assed lighthearted way they treated the Federation's greatest threat, not any 'dark' aspects), those are some of the best things Trek has ever done. The DS9 war arc, First Contact, and the removal of that horribly childish barrier to conflict and drama in the 24th century. It brought back the spirit of the original series, that we are strong despite our weaknesses, rather than that we have none.