Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

[teya]

The lack of a childhood with the Borg would be reason enough for Seven’s lack of experience, but there is one more factor. Seven had an emotion damper, so her view of the world and the emotional impact of social interactions, let alone learning to relate to people as friends or even potential lovers was muted if not outright filtered. That had to add to her emotional immaturity.

I don’t think it is realistic to think she could catch up to someone as mature as Chakotay in only four years without said filtering, let alone with it. I cannot suspend my disbelief on that one.

Brit

Excellent point. Another factor is the impact of the dampener's removal. There is an assumption that this is a good thing, that she will be experiencing nothing but "good" emotions. However, she would also be experiencing bad or negative emotions with more clarity and depth than ever before. The removal of the dampener would be a double-edged sword.

My daughter (FYI who has a BS in Biology and several hours toward a MS in Neurobiology) says that the dampener would have had to be turned off in stages, a little at a time to avoid psychotic reactions.

Brit

First, I wonder exactly how long she had that dampener. Since it was a part of the cortical node--which is not Seven's original node, but belonged to Icheb--her original node might not have had that technology. This would explain how Seven already experienced grief, anger, remorse, guilt, etc. Strong and powerful emotions.

Second, to try and use this directly from 21st century medicine is a bit absurd. After all, in the 24th century, they can replicate new neural tissue, provide IV fluids without an IV set-up, put people into stasis, and seemingly magically treat any and all illnesses (unless something seemingly incurable is required for the plot ) with just the raising of the arch on the biobed.

They have also been able to cure most psychoses since Kirk's day.

 

[Gorf]

Reading the past several posts has been like watching a Swedish film without subtitles.

Hey some of us almost understand Swedish (Danish is pretty close). Sorry, this was totally taken out of context, but I couldnt help myself.

This is my first visit in months and I had to log on to give this couple the thumbs down - that's my opinion on the matter.

 

[kimc]

Reading the past several posts has been like watching a Swedish film without subtitles.

Hey some of us almost understand Swedish (Danish is pretty close). Sorry, this was totally taken out of context, but I couldnt help myself.

Don't worry - that's the same sort of random joke I would be tempted to make myself.

 

[kimc]

I just thought of something.

In Unity, Chakotay was hooked up to a mini-collective, he has personal, first-hand experience of what it's like to be part of a collective and so he would be slightly more able to understand and appreciate what Seven's life had been like as a Borg.

This could have potentially tipped the balance in his favor as Seven regarding him as a compatible and suitable life companion.

It's the only thing I can think of that would explain the logic behind such a seemingly mis-matched couple.

(If anyone else had raised this point that in the previous 21 pages of thread, sorry for not reading that far back. )

Actually that same piece of equipment planted into Chakotay was what enabled them to free Seven from the collective in the first place. Yes, I can see his experience enabling him to have some empathy for Seven's situation (once he got over wanting to toss her out an airlock) but to me a more fatherly/mentorly one than a romantic one.

Given the vast amoung of life experience Chakotay has on Seven it would never be a partnership of equals.

 

[teya]

Actually that same piece of equipment planted into Chakotay was what enabled them to free Seven from the collective in the first place.

It wasn't planted into him. In both cases they were temporary.

Given the vast amoung of life experience Chakotay has on Seven it would never be a partnership of equals.

Please detail this "vast amount of life experience." Just because he's 50 doesn't mean he's a wise old man. I know plenty of 50 year-old men children.

For one thing, we've got no indication that Chakotay has *ever* been involved in a long-term relationship--with the possible exception of Seska, which doesn't say a whole lot. If we go by Jeri Taylor, he had a worship-type relationship with Sveta similar to the way he viewed Janeway. Not a particularly good track record.

 

[kimc]

Given the vast amoung of life experience Chakotay has on Seven it would never be a partnership of equals.

Please detail this "vast amount of life experience." Just because he's 50 doesn't mean he's a wise old man. I know plenty of 50 year-old men children.

For one thing, we've got no indication that Chakotay has *ever* been involved in a long-term relationship--with the possible exception of Seska, which doesn't say a whole lot. If we go by Jeri Taylor, he had a worship-type relationship with Sveta similar to the way he viewed Janeway. Not a particularly good track record.

Are you now saying that Chakotay is a good match for Seven because he has Peter Pan Syndrome?

Look, any idiot who is breathing for 50 years is going to have a vast amount of life experience compared to a person who was assimilated at a young age and has only experienced individuality for a few short years.

Seven needs to date around and have some fun before finally settling down with someone who she has common interests with, imo.

 

[exodus]

Given the vast amoung of life experience Chakotay has on Seven it would never be a partnership of equals.

Please detail this "vast amount of life experience." Just because he's 50 doesn't mean he's a wise old man. I know plenty of 50 year-old men children.

For one thing, we've got no indication that Chakotay has *ever* been involved in a long-term relationship--with the possible exception of Seska, which doesn't say a whole lot. If we go by Jeri Taylor, he had a worship-type relationship with Sveta similar to the way he viewed Janeway. Not a particularly good track record.

Are you now saying that Chakotay is a good match for Seven because he has Peter Pan Syndrome?

Look, any idiot who is breathing for 50 years is going to have a vast amount of life experience compared to a person who was assimilated at a young age and has only experienced individuality for a few short years.

Not if you're introverted or done very little with your life.

Plus it's can be said that in his many years, that it's questionable if George W. Bush had any life experances at all to even solve common sense issues. The man didn't have the life experance to know what to do about a locked door after trying to exit a room after making a speech.

 

[teya]

Are you now saying that Chakotay is a good match for Seven because he has Peter Pan Syndrome?

No. I'm just pointing out that age does not automatically equal maturity in relationships.

And, frankly, I'd hardly call an aging bachelor as suffering from "Peter Pan Syndrome." That's certainly taking it a bit far, don't you think?

Unless you're saying that anyone who prefers the single life to married life is pathological in some way. Interesting premise, I must say.

Seven needs to date around and have some fun before finally settling down with someone who she has common interests with, imo.

And I disagree. Just because this is the standard that you find acceptable, doesn't make it the only way to do things.

 

[kimc]

Unless you're saying that anyone who prefers the single life to married life is pathological in some way. Interesting premise, I must say.

Yeah, it would be if:
1) That was what I actually said.
2) I wasn't single myself

Seven needs to date around and have some fun before finally settling down with someone who she has common interests with, imo.

And I disagree.

Okay then!

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

 

[AuntKate]

Chakotay's experience with the link in "Unity" is ambivalent at best. While he was healed by the link and enjoyed his intimacy with Riley, he soon found out that he was also their pawn when they used him to regain their control of the other drones against Janeway's orders. Then, when he distracts Seven with the cortical device in "Scorpion," he suffers a great deal of pain when she is severed from the collective.

So, yes, he would have a better understanding of Seven's situation, but not necessarily for the good, and certainly not with any desire to have that kind of connection again. I agree with KimC that he would probably be paternal about this, giving Seven advice based on his own wider experience.

 

[teya]

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

It's an English Angora rabbit. Hopefully my next pet.

A working pet. You comb the rabbit--which you have to do daily, since rabbits can't regurgitate furballs--and spin the combings into angora yarn.

It also looks like a giant tribble.

 

[exodus]

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

It's an English Angora rabbit. Hopefully my next pet.

A working pet. You comb the rabbit--which you have to do daily, since rabbits can't regurgitate furballs--and spin the combings into angora yarn.

Seriously?

 

[Akiraprise]

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

It's an English Angora rabbit. Hopefully my next pet.

A working pet. You comb the rabbit--which you have to do daily, since rabbits can't regurgitate furballs--and spin the combings into angora yarn.

It also looks like a giant tribble.

Wow, I just assumed it was a photoshop. Interesting.

 

[teya]

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

It's an English Angora rabbit. Hopefully my next pet.

A working pet. You comb the rabbit--which you have to do daily, since rabbits can't regurgitate furballs--and spin the combings into angora yarn.

Seriously?

Seriously. That's where angora yarn comes from.

They love being combed. I've watched spinners spin directly from the rabbit while it sits in their lap.

 

[exodus]

BTW, what is that fuzzy white thing in your avatar? I've been putting off asking but my curiosity is getting the better of me.

It's an English Angora rabbit. Hopefully my next pet.

A working pet. You comb the rabbit--which you have to do daily, since rabbits can't regurgitate furballs--and spin the combings into angora yarn.

It also looks like a giant tribble.

Wow, I just assumed it was a photoshop. Interesting.

It looks the head of the Abominable Snowman from those claymation Christmas specials.

I had no idea angora came from a Rabbit.

 

[KimMH]

I love to knit and knew angora comes from goats and rabbits but I've never seen an Angora Rabbit. It does look like a tribble. I'm all for it either way!

 

[exodus]

I love to knit and knew angora comes from goats and rabbits but I've never seen an Angora Rabbit. It does look like a tribble. I'm all for it either way!

Yeah, Goats I knew just not rabbits.

 

[teya]

I love to knit and knew angora comes from goats and rabbits but I've never seen an Angora Rabbit. It does look like a tribble. I'm all for it either way!

Mohair comes from angora goats. Angora comes from Angora rabbits.

Oooh! Another knitter.

 

[KimMH]

didn't realize the distinction re: the goats vs rabbits. I DON"T do my own spinning - I'm a pokey enough knitter - my son would never get socks or sweaters if I had to card and spin it too! I only know a couple sheep and thier wool goes to a local mill for processing. maybe someday if I have a yard that needs real mowing . . .

I'm mostly dependent on my local yarn shop for most of my wool - so much wool - so little time! I have experimented w/ bamboo and am considering alpaca-looks a little pricey - I may reserve it for a pair of socks for me!

 

[Brit]

I'm wondering how many case studies your daughter has done on people with emotional dampners?

A better question would be how many have you? In fact do you know the first thing about brain chemistry? Her M/S study was with a professor that was working on the theory that the brain really is a sort of a computer and works like a computer network. One of the case studies she did look at was a male with a brain injury that left him unable to feel any emotion. She said he was a complete and utter airhead, and that his was one of the nicer case studies that she was exposed to.

Brit