Transformers 2 = Better Star Trek 2
- Thread starter Kirk1980
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The first Transformers I thought had absolutely zero characterization attempts.
I ignored a lot of the stupid stuff in this one since Prime seemed to be better written. As he's my favorite character, that's all I wanted, really.
Expectations were low for the second Transformers. All I asked was more screen time for the Transformers and less about the humans and it largely delivered that. There were touches of characterization (see, I didn't entirely expect G1 characterizations, which meant the Megatron bit didn't bother me so much) and again, that's all I asked.
All in all, it just seemed they listened more.
For Trek, I hope they listen, too.
Let's just be clear. I expected a dumb goofy movie with hopefully some decent action and some more focus on the robots this time around. That's largely what I got.
My expectations for a Trek film are far far different.
I ignored a lot of the stupid stuff in this one since Prime seemed to be better written. As he's my favorite character, that's all I wanted, really.
Expectations were low for the second Transformers. All I asked was more screen time for the Transformers and less about the humans and it largely delivered that. There were touches of characterization (see, I didn't entirely expect G1 characterizations, which meant the Megatron bit didn't bother me so much) and again, that's all I asked.
All in all, it just seemed they listened more.
For Trek, I hope they listen, too.
Let's just be clear. I expected a dumb goofy movie with hopefully some decent action and some more focus on the robots this time around. That's largely what I got.
My expectations for a Trek film are far far different.
So it's an awful, stupid movie, filled with racism, stereotypes and goofy moments, with a plot that makes no sense, terrible editing and pacing, and might as well have a US Armed Forces logo in the bottom right (such was the amount of blatant in your face advertising and propaganda)...
But you liked it because it had "characterization" whatever that is.
Riiight.
Well, good for you I guess if you enjoyed that shite.
(for the record, I loved the first film. That actually felt like a film)
But you liked it because it had "characterization" whatever that is.
Riiight.
Well, good for you I guess if you enjoyed that shite.
(for the record, I loved the first film. That actually felt like a film)
And Kpnuts, you liked Trek XI which I didn't even like all that much.
Perhaps you could save the vitriol for something more worthwhile.
EDIT: Incidentally, would you be surprised to know those are basically the same criticisms which could be aimed at the first one?
Perhaps you could save the vitriol for something more worthwhile.
EDIT: Incidentally, would you be surprised to know those are basically the same criticisms which could be aimed at the first one?
I agree with him. The first TF wasn't that bad actually. This second one is pure tripe.
Star Trek XI > Both of them for sure.
Star Trek XI > Both of them for sure.
I really liked the first Transformers. It was about giant fighting robots, but the story was decent enough, and the character's were likable. The new one however was not nearly as good. It seemed like every character needed to be comic relief, and the physical humor was not nearly as good as the first one, even though I did laugh in some parts. It just seemed like the plot was all over the place, and was almost too complicated for such a film. The first one was good because of the simplicity of it's plot, which is what all the movie needed. This one just had too much....stuff...in it, and it suffered.
I agree that Star Trek was far superior to both films.
I agree that Star Trek was far superior to both films.
The first one was a solid action blockbuster. It had good pacing, good editing, was exciting with some good performances. It felt like a movie.
T2 was just an awful mess. Waaaaay too many things wrong with it to list but boring, over-long and embarassing would be three general things wrong with it.
Spot on. Agree totally. Particularly:
SEVEN comic relief characters. One, definitely. Two, ok fine... but SEVEN???
Mom, Dad, the moronic stereotypical twins from da hood, the idiot room-mate, the idiot ex-sector 7 guy, the stupid mini 'humping a girl's leg' deceptikon.
I'm probably missing a couple as well.
The film itself was all over the place, just a giant mess that unfortunately lasted two and a half hours.
Really, the first film was better?
With Bumblebee pissing on the Sector 7 guy? Optimus Prime saying, 'my bad'? The stupid hacker scenes? Overemphasis on the humans? An air strike by the humans (read: US military) which takes down the Decepticons? The maudlin sidestory with the wife at home? The Sector 7 underwear? The masturbation jokes? The lack of anything said by the Transformers themselves? The black charicature of the fat hacker?
These were all complaints and largely the emphasis on the humans was toned down and a much greater emphasis was placed on the Transformers themselves. Some of the fight scenes were done where you could actually see what was going on.
And I'm not saying it was the most amazing thing ever. I'm saying for what I expected it did a good job.
With Bumblebee pissing on the Sector 7 guy? Optimus Prime saying, 'my bad'? The stupid hacker scenes? Overemphasis on the humans? An air strike by the humans (read: US military) which takes down the Decepticons? The maudlin sidestory with the wife at home? The Sector 7 underwear? The masturbation jokes? The lack of anything said by the Transformers themselves? The black charicature of the fat hacker?
These were all complaints and largely the emphasis on the humans was toned down and a much greater emphasis was placed on the Transformers themselves. Some of the fight scenes were done where you could actually see what was going on.
And I'm not saying it was the most amazing thing ever. I'm saying for what I expected it did a good job.
As opposed to the scene with the Constructicon's "balls"? That was stupider then ANYTHING in the first film.
And we are in complete opposition with the characters. This film needed less fighting and more characterization.
Multiply the amount of stupid things in the first film by 10 and you'll have Transformers 2. Just with more racism, Armed Forces product placement, unfunny comic relief characters, and a plot that is a total mess.
That was the equivalent of the pissing scene for me.
But compared to the first film, they at least had SOME character to them. And expecting less fighting and more characterization from a Michael Bay film is more optimistic than I was.
Of course, all of this ignores the main point I had. I felt Orci/Kurtzman listened to people's complaints about the first film and corrected some of them.
Which makes me feel better about the prospects of a better Star Trek movie next time.
But compared to the first film, they at least had SOME character to them. And expecting less fighting and more characterization from a Michael Bay film is more optimistic than I was.
Of course, all of this ignores the main point I had. I felt Orci/Kurtzman listened to people's complaints about the first film and corrected some of them.
Which makes me feel better about the prospects of a better Star Trek movie next time.
Well I am not a die hard transformers fan, or even a fan at all, so if that's what the fans wanted, and the writers listened, more power to them. Hopefully they take some advice for the next film.
However I still hope they keep what made the current film so successful.
I just got back from seeing Transformers 2 in IMAX. It is an entertaining movie and the effect scenes are amazing...maybe even too amazing. At times it was like sensory overload.
The script itself was SHIT! Terrible story, lame and cringe-inducing dialogue, and bad acting.
FX
Transformers 2 > Transformers
Story
Transformers 2 < Transformers.
The script itself was SHIT! Terrible story, lame and cringe-inducing dialogue, and bad acting.
FX
Transformers 2 > Transformers
Story
Transformers 2 < Transformers.
That probably won't happen. As bad as Transformers 2's script is, remember that Trek turned out really well. I have faith that Kurtzman and Orci can deliver a good sequel for Trek.
Yes, because critics are my personal barometer of success. *eyeroll
Look, the main point here isn't whether or not you felt TF2 was a good movie or not. It should be a good thing that someone who didn't like the first Trek feels there's room for hope the second one won't be as bad because they corrected some flaws from the first Transformers.
Look, the main point here isn't whether or not you felt TF2 was a good movie or not. It should be a good thing that someone who didn't like the first Trek feels there's room for hope the second one won't be as bad because they corrected some flaws from the first Transformers.
Are we talking Batman and Robin bad? I thought the first Transformers movie was okay at best and it looks like everyone thinks Bay dropped the ball with the sequel.
so far you seem to be in the minority of whether they corrected flaws or produced a movie that is the lesser of the two.
anyway the second one from some stuff i read is more bay including the "twins".
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