Having Babies In Space.

[Rob Grant]

Hi, i know this is probly been discussed before.. but how do they have babies on a starship in the 2$th/25th Century given the ban on making genetics and that you wouldnt be able to live in space really..

in some of the episode you see the aliens have babies.. like that Arcadian crewman on the Startrek Voyager..
or the Borgs Children that were discovered by Seven

because they are from space.. they have a natural advantage... so shouldnt the ban be reversed so that Humans can increase their numbers out in the galaxy too?

 

[Sci]

Hi, i know this is probly been discussed before.. but how do they have babies on a starship in the 2$th/25th Century given the ban on making genetics and that you wouldnt be able to live in space really..

in some of the episode you see the aliens have babies.. like that Arcadian crewman on the Startrek Voyager..
or the Borgs Children that were discovered by Seven

because they are from space.. they have a natural advantage... so shouldnt the ban be reversed so that Humans can increase their numbers out in the galaxy too?

The ban is in genetic engineering, and it's a Federation-wide ban. With the apparent exceptions of allowing inter-species couples to conceive and of modifying the genetics of severely deformed infants, no Federation species can engage in genetic engineering -- not just Humans, but Vulcans, Andorians, Betazoids, Trill, Tellarites, Alonis, Bzzit Khaht, Axanari, Coridanites, Benzars, Berellians, Bolians, Bre'elians, Caitians, Damiani, Deltans, Efrosians, Grazerites, Nasat, Pahkwa-thanh, Pandrilites, etc, etc, etc.

Being born in space doesn't give you a "natural advantage," since starships essentially replicate as many aspects of planet-bound life as they can. If anything, children born in space would be at a disadvantage, since they would probably be lacking the health benefits of exposure to a star and to a class-M planetary environment.

 

[Timo]

The genetic engineering ban isn't actually stated to be that strict. Our information comes from the DS9 episode "Dr. Bashir, I Presume", and this is what is stated there:

"DNA resequencing for any reason other than repairing serious birth defects is illegal."

That's a ban on a specific technique only - one used on Bashir.

"Any genetically enhanced human being is barred from serving in Starfleet or practising medicine."

That's a ban on specific professions only - ones applying to Bashir.

Bashir Sr. then pleads guilty to "illegal genetic engineering", somewhat suggesting that legal genetic engineering also exists (and indeed we see the government perform experiments on that in TNG "Unnatural Selection").

Admiral Bennett responds that

"The law against genetic engineering provides a firewall against such men"

where "such men" refers specifically to the likes of Khan. However, he finds no fault in Dr. Bashir himself, and the genetically engineered specimen is allowed to go free and pursue a career that is both medical and Starfleet.

The episode, in combination with others where genetical engineering has been utilized for good without a comment from our heroes or other authorities, suggests that the ban is of a very specific sort and narrow in scope, aimed very carefully at blocking the routes to the creation of further Khans.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Sci]

The genetic engineering ban isn't actually stated to be that strict. Our information comes from the DS9 episode "Dr. Bashir, I Presume", and this is what is stated there:

"DNA resequencing for any reason other than repairing serious birth defects is illegal."

That's a ban on a specific technique only - one used on Bashir.

"Any genetically enhanced human being is barred from serving in Starfleet or practising medicine."

That's a ban on specific professions only - ones applying to Bashir.

Bashir Sr. then pleads guilty to "illegal genetic engineering", somewhat suggesting that legal genetic engineering also exists (and indeed we see the government perform experiments on that in TNG "Unnatural Selection").

Admiral Bennett responds that

"The law against genetic engineering provides a firewall against such men"

where "such men" refers specifically to the likes of Khan. However, he finds no fault in Dr. Bashir himself, and the genetically engineered specimen is allowed to go free and pursue a career that is both medical and Starfleet.

The episode, in combination with others where genetical engineering has been utilized for good without a comment from our heroes or other authorities, suggests that the ban is of a very specific sort and narrow in scope, aimed very carefully at blocking the routes to the creation of further Khans.

Timo Saloniemi

No, the episode pretty firmly establishes that all resequencings of DNA -- in other words, all acts of genetic engineering -- have been banned. "Unnatural Selection" is an obvious conflict, but that's what happens when you retcon things; we should probably take "Unnatural Selection" as a special exception to the ban authorized by the Federation Council.

 

[Rob Grant]

Hi, i know this is probly been discussed before.. but how do they have babies on a starship in the 2$th/25th Century given the ban on making genetics and that you wouldnt be able to live in space really..

in some of the episode you see the aliens have babies.. like that Arcadian crewman on the Startrek Voyager..
or the Borgs Children that were discovered by Seven

because they are from space.. they have a natural advantage... so shouldnt the ban be reversed so that Humans can increase their numbers out in the galaxy too?

The ban is in genetic engineering, and it's a Federation-wide ban. With the apparent exceptions of allowing inter-species couples to conceive and of modifying the genetics of severely deformed infants, no Federation species can engage in genetic engineering -- not just Humans, but Vulcans, Andorians, Betazoids, Trill, Tellarites, Alonis, Bzzit Khaht, Axanari, Coridanites, Benzars, Berellians, Bolians, Bre'elians, Caitians, Damiani, Deltans, Efrosians, Grazerites, Nasat, Pahkwa-thanh, Pandrilites, etc, etc, etc.

Being born in space doesn't give you a "natural advantage," since starships essentially replicate as many aspects of planet-bound life as they can. If anything, children born in space would be at a disadvantage, since they would probably be lacking the health benefits of exposure to a star and to a class-M planetary environment.

um.. whether it is or not doesent matter..

it should be allowed for humans.. JUST to allow procretion.. as they arent native to space.. like the all those other aliens.. or like Data.. who was able to make his child.. tho i suppsoe he is sort of not a 'real man'.. so might be able to make a child 'properller' anyway..

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

I'm not even sure what the OP was referring to. Several different people from several different species (including humans) have given birth on starships. When was it established that humans aren't able to procreate on a starship? Why should this constitute a problem? What problem would this be? And what has genetic engineering to do with anything? I'm confused.

Molly O'Brien seemed fine to me. So did Jake Sisko (I think one of the Prophets' flashback in "Emissary" showed Jennifer giving birth in a starship's sickbay). The same applies to Naomi Wildman (half-human with a fully human mother), Miral Paris (three-quarters human) and to Star Trek XI's Kirk.

 

[SilentP]

um.. whether it is or not doesent matter..

it should be allowed for humans.. JUST to allow procretion.. as they arent native to space.. like the all those other aliens.. or like Data.. who was able to make his child.. tho i suppsoe he is sort of not a 'real man'.. so might be able to make a child 'properller' anyway..

I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at here? There's nothing to prevent humans from breeding in space.

And the vast majority of the aliens in Star Trek aren't native to space either, unless places like Vulcan and Qo'Nos are just really well disguised starships. And Data was 'born' on a planet as well.

 

[Rob Grant]

I'm not even sure what the OP was referring to. Several different people from several different species (including humans) have given birth on starships. When was it established that humans aren't able to procreate on a starship? Why should this constitute a problem? What problem would this be? And what has genetic engineering to do with anything? I'm confused.

Molly O'Brien seemed fine to me. So did Jake Sisko (I think one of the Prophets' flashback in "Emissary" showed Jennifer giving birth in a starship's sickbay). The same applies to Naomi Wildman (half-human with a fully human mother), Miral Paris (three-quarters human) and to Star Trek XI's Kirk.

COS HUMANS dont come from SPACE
they are from Earth..

http://www.infoniac.com/science/sex-in-space.html




Molly's Chinese no? not an alien..

 

[Rob Grant]

um.. whether it is or not doesent matter..

it should be allowed for humans.. JUST to allow procretion.. as they arent native to space.. like the all those other aliens.. or like Data.. who was able to make his child.. tho i suppsoe he is sort of not a 'real man'.. so might be able to make a child 'properller' anyway..

I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at here? There's nothing to prevent humans from breeding in space.

And the vast majority of the aliens in Star Trek aren't native to space either, unless places like Vulcan and Qo'Nos are just really well disguised starships. And Data was 'born' on a planet as well.

yeh.. but they are all in the night sky! ie Space..

dont have the complications of no gravity and such.. and no air.. like how the borgs were able to swim in space without any suits.. yet Picard, Wolf and Hulk had to.. cos they are used to it..

like how jellyfish cant live underwater.. yet humans only an for 1 or 2 mins.. cos they are from there..

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

COS HUMANS dont come from SPACE
they are from Earth..

Yeah, and any other species comes from some planet too. Nobody comes "from space". What's your point?

http://www.infoniac.com/science/sex-in-space.html

This article is referring to problem arising from having sex in zero gravity. In Star Trek we have artificial gravity, so it's no problem.

Molly's Chinese no? not an alien..

Molly is half-Japanese/half-Irish. And she was born on board the Enterprise-D in the TNG episode "Disaster".

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

dont have the complications of no gravity and such.. and no air.. like how the borgs were able to swim in space without any suits.. yet Picard, Wolf and Hulk had to.. cos they are used to it..

The Borg are probably able to survive in a vacuum because they're cybernetic organisms (partially machines). Any other species happens to die when exposed to vacuum.

 

[Rob Grant]

dont have the complications of no gravity and such.. and no air.. like how the borgs were able to swim in space without any suits.. yet Picard, Wolf and Hulk had to.. cos they are used to it..

The Borg are probably able to survive in a vacuum because they're cybernetic organisms (partially machines). Any other species happens to die when exposed to vacuum.

thats silly tho.. who actually believet that? ist that a retcon.. like the Akira coming AFTER the Enterprise tho it was based on it..

 

[SilentP]

The Borg are probably able to survive in a vacuum because they're cybernetic organisms (partially machines). Any other species happens to die when exposed to vacuum.

thats silly tho.. who actually believet that? ist that a retcon.. like the Akira coming AFTER the Enterprise tho it was based on it..

Ummm...what has the appearance of the NX got to do with Borg being cybernetic?

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

dont have the complications of no gravity and such.. and no air.. like how the borgs were able to swim in space without any suits.. yet Picard, Wolf and Hulk had to.. cos they are used to it..

The Borg are probably able to survive in a vacuum because they're cybernetic organisms (partially machines). Any other species happens to die when exposed to vacuum.

thats silly tho.. who actually believet that? ist that a retcon.. like the Akira coming AFTER the Enterprise tho it was based on it..

How exactly is that supposed to be a "retcon"?? The Borg were always cybernetic organisms.

In "Scorpion, Part 2", Seven of Nine survived a vacuum, yet she was born human. So, how do you think she survived that?

 

[Rob Grant]

The Borg are probably able to survive in a vacuum because they're cybernetic organisms (partially machines). Any other species happens to die when exposed to vacuum.

thats silly tho.. who actually believet that? ist that a retcon.. like the Akira coming AFTER the Enterprise tho it was based on it..

Ummm...what has the appearance of the NX got to do with Borg being cybernetic?

Retcon.. init.. stuff made up after..

i think this is going off topic tho..

i wanted this thread to duiscuss wherether we should make the federeation legalise eugenics cloning for starfleet.. or 'space humans' to be pricies.

 

[Misfit Toy]

thats silly tho.. who actually believet that? ist that a retcon.. like the Akira coming AFTER the Enterprise tho it was based on it..

Ummm...what has the appearance of the NX got to do with Borg being cybernetic?

Retcon.. init.. stuff made up after..

i think this is going off topic tho..

i wanted this thread to duiscuss wherether we should make the federeation legalise eugenics cloning for starfleet.. or 'space humans' to be pricies.

What are 'pricies'?

 

[Sci]

i wanted this thread to duiscuss wherether we should make the federeation legalise eugenics cloning for starfleet.. or 'space humans' to be pricies.

Please learn how to spell the following words:

"Discuss," "whether," "Federation," "legalize," and "precise."

In any event -- again, there's no reason to. Starships have artificial gravity, so the effects of being born in space in the Trekverse are unrelated to the effects of being born in zero gravity today. No other species engages in genetic engineering or eugenics for the purposes of creating "space Vulcans" or "space Cardassians" -- their ships all mimic the conditions on their homeworlds. There's no actual benefit to modifying their genetic codes to specialize in inhabiting starships, because starships are not sufficiently different from planets.

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

Retcon.. init.. stuff made up after..

"Retcon" is "making up stuff" which contradicts (and therefore overrides) earlier facts. But when was it established that Borg couldn't survive in a vacuum?

i wanted this thread to duiscuss wherether we should make the federeation legalise eugenics cloning for starfleet.. or 'space humans' to be pricies.

What exactly are "space humans" then? Humans who can survive in the vacuum of space? Well, this hasn't anything to do with humans (or other species) being born on a starship and growing up there.

 

[Myasishchev]

I can survive in the vacuum of space for a minute or two, and maintain consciousness for at least thirty seconds.

Am I a Coordinator?

 

[Rob Grant]

I can survive in the vacuum of space for a minute or two, and maintain consciousness for at least thirty seconds.

Am I a Coordinator?

what do u mean?