Poor Jeri Ryan
- Thread starter Jaespol
- Start date
I transcribed what Wang has said about Mulgrew's feelings towards Ryan in the interview initially provided by Jaespol in this thread ...
Garrett Wang said:
That still doesn't say that Kate *abused* Jeri.
Oh, I'm not disagreeing. The first one to use the word abuse in this context was Jaespol in the very first post. And some people just went with it.
You said that much better than I did, GeorgeKirk. That's exactly how I've come to see Berman.
Wow, thanks for that Madzilla. From that perspective, Kate seems totally understandable.
Thanks for typing that out, NCC-1701.
Yeah, I'm not really seeing evidence for abuse here.
All we really seem to know is:
- Kate said she was not happy Jennifer Lien was fired. (for IMO understandable reasons)
- Kate said she was not happy at the addition of Seven of Nine (for IMO understandable reasons)
- Kate and Wang both said Kate was angry with the producers but Wang said she ended up being bitter toward Jeri Ryan
- Wang says Jeri had a bad overall experience on VGR
Okay, here's my question...
Why is it totally understandable from that perspective?
If Voyager was supposed to be a Trek series showcasing strong, capable, intelligent women, then what exactly was the problem with bringing another strong, capable, intelligent actress on the show?
^^ Yeah. I still, despite Exodus'...um...insistence just don't see evidence of real nastiness. Which isn't to say that there isn't any, I just haven't seen it in this thread, including in that transcript Madzilla posted for us - and thanks for that, BTW. Oh, well. Life goes on.
That really only works though if you accept that Kate's irritation was "completely understandable."
So I'd really like to know why it's completely understandable.
I can't speak for Praetor, but the "completely understandable" part for me is this: "She did a damn good job, Jeri Ryan. But I resented the philosophical implications that we couldn’t simply succeed, right? That we had to do it this way. I grew accustomed to it over time, but there’s no point in...in deceiving you."
The way I interpret this - but unlike some, I don't pretend to be able to read Mulgrew's mind - is that Mulgrew felt that in replacing one "strong female character" (Kes) with another "strong female character" who is more obviously sexy (Seven) was a step back - that it was just a shame that TPTB felt they had to appeal to a young male fanbase. I'm not saying she's right or anything, but I can see why it might seem that way to her.
You do have to remember that they didn't just add a strong female character - they eliminated one and replaced her with another. If they just wanted another strong female character, why not have both Kes and Seven? I think that would have been really cool, but then again, I wasn't in charge of keeping Voyager solvent. So it's easy for me to say.
Because opinion isn't fact and hearsay is only admissible in a court of public opinion.
What a neat circle.
Just say no aneurysms.
Either way, by saying that adding Jeri to the cast was a step back, then it seems as if Mulgrew's saying that Jeri is, because of what she looks like, less intelligent or capable.
Surely that's not something we'd consider an enlightened POV, is it?
And if Mulgrew made life even uncomfortable on the set because of that, well, I don't consider that laudable behavior.
I don't read it that way, but you're going to have to make up your own mind. It doesn't sound to me as though the problem was Ryan and the character Seven of Nine so much as Ryan and the character Seven of Nine decked out to look like Aquawoman and titilate all the boys with her lovely body, but I freely admit that I am guessing here.
But either way, Mulgrew shouldn't have made the set uncomfortable, if in fact she did. So long as she acted like a professional, she didn't have to be buddies with any of her co-workers. But I have no idea how to define that. I know how I look and act when I have a coworker I'm willing to work with but not crazy about, and I am confident that I still act like a professional under those circumstances, but I have no idea if Mulgrew crossed the line or not. There isn't enough in this thread to tell me one way or another, and I kind of doubt if there is anywhere, unless someone has behind-the-scenes footage on the set.
But either way, Mulgrew shouldn't have made the set uncomfortable, if in fact she did. So long as she acted like a professional, she didn't have to be buddies with any of her co-workers. But I have no idea how to define that. I know how I look and act when I have a coworker I'm willing to work with but not crazy about, and I am confident that I still act like a professional under those circumstances, but I have no idea if Mulgrew crossed the line or not. There isn't enough in this thread to tell me one way or another, and I kind of doubt if there is anywhere, unless someone has behind-the-scenes footage on the set.
This might be a side bar, but wasn't Mulgrew reportedly thinking about leaving the show after season 5? I thought there was much made about that which made the end of Equinox seem like it could have easily written Janeway out. I'm glad she stayed till the end, but all these reports and who said what to whom does seem to be coming together.
And what's the difference?
Does Jeri somehow lose brain cells because she's in a catsuit?
Why can't a woman who looks like Jeri be considered intelligent and capable no matter what she's wearing?
Well, then what exactly is her problem with Seven and/or Jeri?
That she looks the way she does? Why is that a problem if the character and the actress are still intelligent women?
I didn't mean that Mulgrew's iciness/anger towards Jeri Ryan was fair, but that it was understandable that she would be upset about the way the producers were handling things, and that that bitterness would translate into the way she interacted with Ryan.
Look at it this way: the suits fire a perfectly capable actress and write out her character in order to introduce a new actress for the primary purpose of being eye candy, while also refusing to treat Janeway like a woman? I don't mean to insult Jeri or Seven, because the Seven character is more than a catsuit, but it does feel like a step back in the mature treatment of female characters to me. And Mulgrew had this constant reminder of all of this perceived unfairness that she had to work with a lot, so it's only human that she would end up seeing her as this 'embodiment' of this problem.
From that perspective I understand why Mulgrew would be bitter towards Ryan. Is it fair? Heck no. But neither was the way the producers treated Mulgrew or Lien.
Look at it this way: the suits fire a perfectly capable actress and write out her character in order to introduce a new actress for the primary purpose of being eye candy, while also refusing to treat Janeway like a woman? I don't mean to insult Jeri or Seven, because the Seven character is more than a catsuit, but it does feel like a step back in the mature treatment of female characters to me. And Mulgrew had this constant reminder of all of this perceived unfairness that she had to work with a lot, so it's only human that she would end up seeing her as this 'embodiment' of this problem.
From that perspective I understand why Mulgrew would be bitter towards Ryan. Is it fair? Heck no. But neither was the way the producers treated Mulgrew or Lien.
The problem was that Jeri was, as I read in the beginning of this thread so long ago, was that she was the physical manifestation of Jennifer getting fired.
Think how kids react about step parents just moving in and taking over. Now imagine step brothers and step sister trying to replace your own sister that they murdered.
Oh, and this...
-----
"Lets hire bigger breasts!"
"Yes, bigger breasts will improve the ratings."
"I concur. How many more bigger breasts should we hire?"
"Two should do it."
"Sets, or all together?"
"Just one pair I think, after all, we don't want to confuse the monkeys watching our show. If their heads are bobbling about trying to view and review multiple new bigger breasts rolling from one side of the frame tot he other, their line of sight might just escape from the plane of the television all together and that would be the end of us."
----
Jeri represented manifest that up there above too.
It's not her fault that she was an ugly reminder of how capricious the Powers that be are.
Think how kids react about step parents just moving in and taking over. Now imagine step brothers and step sister trying to replace your own sister that they murdered.
Oh, and this...
-----
"Lets hire bigger breasts!"
"Yes, bigger breasts will improve the ratings."
"I concur. How many more bigger breasts should we hire?"
"Two should do it."
"Sets, or all together?"
"Just one pair I think, after all, we don't want to confuse the monkeys watching our show. If their heads are bobbling about trying to view and review multiple new bigger breasts rolling from one side of the frame tot he other, their line of sight might just escape from the plane of the television all together and that would be the end of us."
----
Jeri represented manifest that up there above too.
It's not her fault that she was an ugly reminder of how capricious the Powers that be are.
Last edited:
The suits said the character was going nowhere and that they couldn't figure out what to do with her. I agree--they'd written her into a box in the beginning.
Except that TPTB initially conceived of the character as male. It was UPN who wanted her made babe.
Either way, that's still not Jeri's fault and doesn't justify treating her like a pariah.
Just because it's "human" doesn't make it acceptable. There's a lot of crappy behavior that humans exhibit.
Do we really know that for sure? I know Wang was going to get the axe originally, but did they really plan out the character as male, or...? Either way, when it became the eye candy issue, Mulgrew was upset.
I agree. Like I said, understandable but unfair.
Similar threads
