Why Gun is Civilization...

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Although maybe it's the *concealed* bit, that's the real concern. If I can see that somebody has a gun, I can more easily avoid a confrontation with them. It's easier to walk away from somebody I know is armed - easier to know for certain that I shouldn't mess with them. You can at least respect that, can't you?

You can solve that problem simply by avoiding confrontation with anyone, and not going around messing with people.

I already do that, as best I can. But you'd be surprised what could constitute a 'confrontation'. Sometimes it's something you yourself have no control over.

 

[Surefire]

It's the gun worshipers who are disturbing; what's called the "Gun Culture." That faction whose lives revolve around these instruments of killing, who collect them like comic books, shoot at things for fun, obsess over them day and night-- or, like the guy quoted in the first Post, are afraid to face the world without one.

This type of post is the exact hysteria that is being referred to. Do people realize that a LOT of gun owners are competitive shooters (or simply enjoy the challenge of the sport of shooting) that have no interest in killing things?

I do think some take it to the extreme-- like the militia types that sleep with 16 AR 15s next to them each night.

But the typical shooter, even collector, is not some repressed wannabe killer.

 

[msbae]

I do think some take it to the extreme-- like the militia types that sleep with 16 AK 45s next to them each night.

But the typical shooter, even collector, is not some repressed wannabe killer.

There's no such thing as an AK-45. You're thinking of that piece of Commie-made garbage called the AK-47, which I wouldn't even take for free, let alone purchase.

Also, check out this YouTube video I found of a S&W Model 66 being fired, with Klingon music no less. The gun sounds a lot louder in real life than it did in the video.

 

[Surefire]

I do think some take it to the extreme-- like the militia types that sleep with 16 AK 45s next to them each night.

But the typical shooter, even collector, is not some repressed wannabe killer.

There's no such thing as an AK-45. You're thinking of that piece of Commie-made garbage called the AK-47, which I wouldn't even take for free, let alone purchase.

Also, check out this YouTube video I found of a S&W Model 66 being fired, with Klingon music no less. The gun sounds a lot louder in real life than it did in the video.

Yep, that was a major typo

I wasn't even thinking about the AK.

I meant to type AR-15!!

 

[msbae]

It does if you believe that power corrupts; that's what the phrase means. As for other weapons, they would be corrupting, too, to a degree determined by the power and ease of use of each-- if you believe that power corrupts.

Horseshit. I never feel tempted to shoot someone when I have one of my guns in my hands. How do you know I would (hypothetically) use a gun to injure/kill someone? Why not use a knife? Or some kind of large tool? Or my bare hands? One thing does NOT necessarily lead to another, RJ.

But you just said it did. You said that power ALWAYS corrupts.

Do try to keep up with what you yourself are saying

I believe I was talking about political power, which the police department does wield. They aren't above protecting one of their own who might have acted badly in some situations. Fortunately, The Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office doesn't seem to have that kind of corruption but, I prefer not to take the chance. Our late, great sheriff Harry Lee would have agreed with that sentiment.

Now, if you all will excuse me, I'm going to watch a violent western before bed.

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

Although maybe it's the *concealed* bit, that's the real concern. If I can see that somebody has a gun, I can more easily avoid a confrontation with them. It's easier to walk away from somebody I know is armed - easier to know for certain that I shouldn't mess with them. You can at least respect that, can't you?

You can solve that problem simply by avoiding confrontation with anyone, and not going around messing with people.

I already do that, as best I can. But you'd be surprised what could constitute a 'confrontation'. Sometimes it's something you yourself have no control over.

I'd be surprised? What...do you think I live in a bubble or something? I'm 40 years old, and have never gotten into a situation I couldn't talk my way out of or walk away from.

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

There's no such thing as an AK-45. You're thinking of that piece of Commie-made garbage called the AK-47, which I wouldn't even take for free, let alone purchase.

There's nothing wrong with an AK. It does what it was designed to do, flawlessly.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

But you'd be surprised what could constitute a 'confrontation'. Sometimes it's something you yourself have no control over.

I'd be surprised? What...do you think I live in a bubble or something? I'm 40 years old, and have never gotten into a situation I couldn't talk my way out of or walk away from.

We're not all that lucky.

 

[Surefire]

This is a real tragic and sad situation...

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/california/la-me-bart-shooting7-2009jan07,0,1962746.story

http://www.mercurynews.com/localnewsheadlines/ci_11399026

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

But you'd be surprised what could constitute a 'confrontation'. Sometimes it's something you yourself have no control over.

I'd be surprised? What...do you think I live in a bubble or something? I'm 40 years old, and have never gotten into a situation I couldn't talk my way out of or walk away from.

We're not all that lucky.

Well, smiling a lot helps.

 

[FrontLine]

Not to keep speaking for RJ on this, but if he has a "history" of anything here, it's been a pretty staunch defense of the US Constitution and the rights it bestows. That doesn't mean you two can't disagree on the details or interpretation of course...

Some of the rights. He has shown a selective interpretation of the constitution.

Yeah. Babaganoosh, seriously, I think you need help.

Come on, you should know better than to Post something like this. Keep it civil, please.

Oh I am keeping it civil. Hell he even agrees.

This is the type of hysteria I hear often from some people. They assume that all gun owners are pyscho. I work with several people who believe guns owners are by definition evil pyschos.

It's the gun worshipers who are disturbing; what's called the "Gun Culture." That faction whose lives revolve around these instruments of killing, who collect them like comic books, shoot at things for fun, obsess over them day and night-- or, like the guy quoted in the first Post, are afraid to face the world without one.

Paint things with a broad brush much? Or would you consider that there are folks who enjoy all of their rights enumerated in the constitution that the government cannot abridge and are defensive against those who selectively pick and choose which rights they want to enjoy and want to force their opinion on others. Ya know, like the paranoid gun grabbers who want no bit of personal responsibility and want someone else to take care of em? Yeah painting with broad brushes sucks, doesnt it?

This is a real tragic and sad situation...

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/california/la-me-bart-shooting7-2009jan07,0,1962746.story

http://www.mercurynews.com/localnewsheadlines/ci_11399026

But I thought the police were there to protect us? What can we do

 

[Moocey]

I own and carry because it's my right, and because I can't carry a cop with me. :muad:

 

[RJDiogenes]

Some of the rights. He has shown a selective interpretation of the constitution.

Examples?

Oh I am keeping it civil. Hell he even agrees.

Comments to PM, please.

It's the gun worshipers who are disturbing; what's called the "Gun Culture." That faction whose lives revolve around these instruments of killing, who collect them like comic books, shoot at things for fun, obsess over them day and night-- or, like the guy quoted in the first Post, are afraid to face the world without one.

Paint things with a broad brush much? Or would you consider that there are folks who enjoy all of their rights enumerated in the constitution that the government cannot abridge and are defensive against those who selectively pick and choose which rights they want to enjoy and want to force their opinion on others. Ya know, like the paranoid gun grabbers who want no bit of personal responsibility and want someone else to take care of em? Yeah painting with broad brushes sucks, doesnt it?

Defensive, indeed. If you don't understand that the type of person I described above exists and understandably creeps out civilized Human beings, you are not just defensive but in denial. As for "enjoying all your rights," I suspect there are a few more Gun Clubs than there are No-Quartering-Of-Troops Clubs. In any case, the type of people who are drawn to the Gun Culture are usually the ones who are "selective" about what Rights their fellow citizens can "enjoy."

 

[Pingfah]

It does if you believe that power corrupts; that's what the phrase means. As for other weapons, they would be corrupting, too, to a degree determined by the power and ease of use of each-- if you believe that power corrupts.

Horseshit. I never feel tempted to shoot someone when I have one of my guns in my hands. How do you know I would (hypothetically) use a gun to injure/kill someone? Why not use a knife? Or some kind of large tool? Or my bare hands? One thing does NOT necessarily lead to another, RJ.

But you just said it did. You said that power ALWAYS corrupts.

Do try to keep up with what you yourself are saying

I believe I was talking about political power, which the police department does wield. They aren't above protecting one of their own who might have acted badly in some situations. Fortunately, The Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office doesn't seem to have that kind of corruption but, I prefer not to take the chance. Our late, great sheriff Harry Lee would have agreed with that sentiment.

Presumably then you can explain the difference between political power, and the power that holding a gun gives you (like the one you gleefully described your friend owns that would make anyone who had it pointed at them piss themselves, SO impressed by the way), and exactly why one corrupts and the other doesn't?

If you're not just making it up as you go along of course.

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

It does if you believe that power corrupts; that's what the phrase means. As for other weapons, they would be corrupting, too, to a degree determined by the power and ease of use of each-- if you believe that power corrupts.

But you just said it did. You said that power ALWAYS corrupts.

Do try to keep up with what you yourself are saying

I believe I was talking about political power, which the police department does wield. They aren't above protecting one of their own who might have acted badly in some situations. Fortunately, The Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office doesn't seem to have that kind of corruption but, I prefer not to take the chance. Our late, great sheriff Harry Lee would have agreed with that sentiment.

Presumably then you can explain the difference between political power, and the power that holding a gun gives you (like the one you gleefully described your friend owns that would make anyone who had it pointed at them piss themselves, SO impressed by the way), and exactly why one corrupts and the other doesn't?

If you're not just making it up as you go along of course.

Google "Mcminn County War of 1946". Pay particular attention to the aftermath.

 

[Deckerd]

I thought you were much younger, you know.

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

Some of the rights. He has shown a selective interpretation of the constitution.

Examples?

Oh I am keeping it civil. Hell he even agrees.

Comments to PM, please.

It's the gun worshipers who are disturbing; what's called the "Gun Culture." That faction whose lives revolve around these instruments of killing, who collect them like comic books, shoot at things for fun, obsess over them day and night-- or, like the guy quoted in the first Post, are afraid to face the world without one.

Paint things with a broad brush much? Or would you consider that there are folks who enjoy all of their rights enumerated in the constitution that the government cannot abridge and are defensive against those who selectively pick and choose which rights they want to enjoy and want to force their opinion on others. Ya know, like the paranoid gun grabbers who want no bit of personal responsibility and want someone else to take care of em? Yeah painting with broad brushes sucks, doesnt it?

Defensive, indeed. If you don't understand that the type of person I described above exists and understandably creeps out civilized Human beings, you are not just defensive but in denial. As for "enjoying all your rights," I suspect there are a few more Gun Clubs than there are No-Quartering-Of-Troops Clubs. In any case, the type of people who are drawn to the Gun Culture are usually the ones who are "selective" about what Rights their fellow citizens can "enjoy."

I think Frontline's point might be that even though people like you throw in words like, "usually", "most" (which I've never seen backed up) and "the type of gun owners..." to give yourself an out, it comes across as if you're trying all all gun owners and/or 2nd Amendment supporters look bad.

I think pretty much by definition, a whole lot more anti-Second Amendment types are selective about what Rights their fellow citizens can enjoy than pro-Second Amendment types are.

 

[Man Afraid of his Shoes]

I thought you were much younger, you know.

It must be my boyish good looks. :blush:

 

[Deckerd]

I've only ever seen you in the bath/shower.

 

[Pingfah]

Google "Mcminn County War of 1946". Pay particular attention to the aftermath.

That shows that political power corrupts and an armed population can do something about it, which I agree with. It doesn't show that the power that a gun gives the individual does not corrupt the individual, whilst the power that a political position gives a politician always does.

Personally I would say that both political power and the power that holding a machine capable of killing are capable of corrupting people, but that some people are corruptable and some aren't.