Christmas 08: the Next Doctor. Review

[Servo]

Sorry, Wamdue, I was misremembering who I was discussing the very thing with in the "Deadly Assassin" thread; it was Diankra, who raised the same idea -- that the eighth Doctor fought and died in the Time War.

There's no reason to think that.

In reality, there are reasons to think that the Time War is entirely the ninth Doctor's baby. The "Flood Barriers" essay in The Flood gives some evidence that RTD saw the Time War as purely the ninth Doctor's struggle.

Yeah, and RTD also said that the 4th Doctor's little trip to Skaro in "Genesis of the Daleks" was one of the first "shots" fired in the Time War, which would mean that every Doctor after (and including) Tom Baker fought in the Time War in one fashion or another.
Add to that the fact of Nine's reaction to his own reflection in "Rose", and the comparison between Human-10 and the 9th Doctor offered up by Ten at the end of last season, and there's a hell of a lot more evidence pointing to what Wamdue thinks than there is for what you think.

 

[jamestyler]

I haven't seen Jim melt down in a while, so here goes...

Wibbley-Wobbly, Timey-Whimey?

Sadly that's my favourite not quite technobabble that was recently used to explain time travel to someone who wasn't getting it. I've began explaining things in Tenisms since the episode. It's a massive time saver.

 

[Jim Steele]

I haven't seen Jim melt down in a while, so here goes...

Wibbley-Wobbly, Timey-Whimey?

My apologies, but I'm so full of flu I just don't have the energy to complain. Just pretend I ranted gloriously then have a go at me for being a cock.



On an unrelated note, I'm glad it seems to be generally acceptable to honestly express one's views on The Next Doctor without a select few crushing bores whinging at you for not being a "proper" fan, as was the case with Journey's Shitty End.

 

[Bob The Skutter]

I haven't seen Jim melt down in a while, so here goes...

Wibbley-Wobbly, Timey-Whimey?

My apologies, but I'm so full of flu I just don't have the energy to complain. Just pretend I ranted gloriously then have a go at me for being a cock.



On an unrelated note, I'm glad it seems to be generally acceptable to honestly express one's views on The Next Doctor without a select few crushing bores whinging at you for not being a "proper" fan, as was the case with Journey's Shitty End.

Jim without the energy to complain? My whole world is askew... or is that just the tilt of my glasses?
That's because Journey's End was unrelentingly brilliant and this was a pile of dog shit topping off a landfill!

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Yeah, and RTD also said that the 4th Doctor's little trip to Skaro in "Genesis of the Daleks" was one of the first "shots" fired in the Time War, which would mean that every Doctor after (and including) Tom Baker fought in the Time War in one fashion or another.

From the perspective of the Daleks, yes. From the Doctor's perspective, however, he said that Davros died during the first year of the Time War. It's all a matter of perspective. The Daleks have a longer view of things than the Doctor in this case, surprisingly.

Add to that the fact of Nine's reaction to his own reflection in "Rose", and the comparison between Human-10 and the 9th Doctor offered up by Ten at the end of last season, and there's a hell of a lot more evidence pointing to what Wamdue thinks than there is for what you think.

I really don't understand the widespread belief in fandom that the mirror scene in "Rose" as evidence for a recent regeneration. I make faces in the mirror and play with my ears and nose every day, but it doesn't mean I looked like Paul McGann less than a day earlier.

 

[wamdue]

I really don't understand the widespread belief in fandom that the mirror scene in "Rose" as evidence for a recent regeneration. I make faces in the mirror and play with my ears and nose every day, but it doesn't mean I looked like Paul McGann less than a day earlier.

I think its easy to see why fans think that, but I actually agree that it does not equal a regeneration,

 

[HappyDayRiot]

[On an unrelated note, I'm glad it seems to be generally acceptable to honestly express one's views on The Next Doctor without a select few crushing bores whinging at you for not being a "proper" fan, as was the case with Journey's Shitty End.

Cos it's Christmas!

 

[wamdue]

[On an unrelated note, I'm glad it seems to be generally acceptable to honestly express one's views on The Next Doctor without a select few crushing bores whinging at you for not being a "proper" fan, as was the case with Journey's Shitty End.

Cos it's Christmas!

well this forum does not have alot of that, but there is so much wrong with The Next Doctor, I think even the biggest fan boys are cutting the rest of us some slack.

 

[Chaos Descending]

I really don't understand the widespread belief in fandom that the mirror scene in "Rose" as evidence for a recent regeneration. I make faces in the mirror and play with my ears and nose every day, but it doesn't mean I looked like Paul McGann less than a day earlier.

But your life is NOT a scripted, episodic television series in which every scene is shown because it means something.

 

[HappyDayRiot]

I see why people don't like Journey's End.

All The Next Doctor was a silly giant robot stomping on 19th century London. That's pretty crappy, yes.

But all this moaning about Cybermen and technology and origins and backgrounds is just pointless - I do not see the problems with any of it. It was simple - they came from the Void and have some tech from the Daleks. How is that complicated or convoluted? What, the audience won't remember? Well what on earth was that stuff about blinking and angels? No one's complaining about that being mentioned, are they?

 

[The]

Wow, I can't believe people have a problem with The Next Doctor. It's not perfect by any means. But, a giant robot with good FX always, always, always beats a slight rubber tentacle and sock-dragon/hand-puppet from the Classic Era, or the silly-ass robots in VotD, or the unrelenting cheese of the Queen of the Racnoss, or campy Santa Clause robots mindlessly roaming around the UK only during December, or etc., etc., etc.

Personally, this was the least cheesy, least contrived, least campy, least OTT RTD story I think I've ever seen. It was steady and standard. And while there wasn't anything super noteworthy about it (save the female villian, who was utterly flawless in execution and acting), it was a good Doctor Who story. Predictable? Partly. Cliched? Vaguely. But, still a good episode.

And I remind everyone (especially Sci ) that I loathe pretty much all RTD stories. So, if people were disappointed that it wasn't some nostalgia crossover with Paul McGann, or a crafty, precise psychological examinaton of the mind, or a universe-shattering battle with Santa Claus, The Destroyer of Words, or whatever....that's cool. But, I just don't get the overall sentiment that it was bad...

 

[The]

I haven't seen Jim melt down in a while, so here goes...

Wibbley-Wobbly, Timey-Whimey?

My apologies, but I'm so full of flu I just don't have the energy to complain. Just pretend I ranted gloriously then have a go at me for being a cock.

Ah damn man....sorry to hear that. Listen, you just owe me a stroke-level rant when you get better, okay? I mean, it's not Christmas if my soul isn't blackened by your Rage-O-Doom...

 

[Worf2DS9]

Watched this on YouTube last night and I must say I loved it. Fantastic, my fave Christmas special to date. Morrissey was great as the not-Doctor, and I'm glad the truth about him wasn't some ridiculous thing. I loved all the stuff about the Doctor finding out about the other guy, like looking forward to seeing his TARDIS; I honestly wasn't sure if we were going to see something completely un-TARDIS-like or the familiar TARDIS itself. The balloon was brilliant, as was the Doctor's reaction.

The Cybermen stuff was pretty good, and it was neat seeing them stomping around old London in the snow. The Cybershades were a bit odd, but they were fun too. I'm sure they creeped out all the kiddies watching.

Oh, and I liked the montage of Doctors (yay McGann, and it's always great to see Eccleston again!), and Cyberzilla at the end was a hoot. Wonderful stuff. Looking forward to watching it properly again, someday.

Next up: "Planet of the Dead". Intriguing. Can't wait.

 

[Sci]

Personally, this was the least cheesy, least contrived, least campy, least OTT RTD story I think I've ever seen.

What about "Midnight?" and "Utopia?"

But it's probably the least campy of the Christmas specials, yeah. It's too bad, isn't it? I was hoping for something cheesier and campier for Christmas.

 

[The]

Personally, this was the least cheesy, least contrived, least campy, least OTT RTD story I think I've ever seen.

What about "Midnight?" and "Utopia?"

I knew someone was going to point that out. It had to be you, didn't it?

J/K While the Futurekind damages Utopia's ranking for me, I think you summed up what I meant, below...

But it's probably the least campy of the Christmas specials, yeah.

However, this...

It's too bad, isn't it? I was hoping for something cheesier and campier for Christmas.

That kind of talk is only going to secure you a spot in hell...

 

[davejames]

Wow, I can't believe people have a problem with The Next Doctor. It's not perfect by any means. But, a giant robot with good FX always, always, always beats a slight rubber tentacle and sock-dragon/hand-puppet from the Classic Era, or the silly-ass robots in VotD, or the unrelenting cheese of the Queen of the Racnoss, or campy Santa Clause robots mindlessly roaming around the UK only during December, or etc., etc., etc.

Personally, this was the least cheesy, least contrived, least campy, least OTT RTD story I think I've ever seen. It was steady and standard. And while there wasn't anything super noteworthy about it (save the female villian, who was utterly flawless in execution and acting), it was a good Doctor Who story. Predictable? Partly. Cliched? Vaguely. But, still a good episode.

Agreed. Certainly some of his stories can be overblown and self-indulgent (although with Journey's End I actually thought it felt appropriate), but I didn't see any of that here. It was probably one of the cleanest and most straightforward "big" episodes he's written.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I find it amusing that she survived cyberconversion because she'd spent a lifetime licking her so called betters assholes and calling it ice cream... So, essentially any one that has ever worked for McDonalds is going to come out the other end intact.

Although, considering the Torchwood section head "Fiona" survived partially too? This could just be the writers applauding girl power in general?

 

[The]

And part of RTD's mother-issues?

 

[Jon1701]

Good stuff.

Only the BBC would have been able to recreate a dickension christmas scene so well. The plot was so-so, but I enjoyed it on the whole.

NuWho needs more Steampunk robots.

 

[wamdue]

you know im getting fed up with the obsession Doctor Who fans seem to have with Steampunk at the moment, it was something I would hope they would put to bed in "The Next Doctor" the head gear she was wearing when she took control of the Cyberking was a good start, but it was not a full body suit.