The James Bond Film Discussion Thread (With Bonus Lazenby!)

[The Wormhole]

While I'll agree Goldeneye is probably Brosnan's best, I find his entire run is pretty damn good. Tomorrow Never Dies is a great movie in its own right and I have no complaints with The World is Not Enough, I don't even mind Denise Richards as a nuclear physicist. Even Die Another Day is a fun movie, even if it is dumb fun.

 

[Starkers]

I think what's most annoying about DAD is that the first half at least is pretty good.

TND is hugely enjoyable. TWINE has grown in me, it just feels very drab and washed out, kudos for giving us the only female Bond villain (although I guess you could argue Rosa Klebb is, but she still reports to Blofeld)

 

[Firebird]

Die Another Day is the one Bond film that is just too awful for me to watch unless I'm doing the full franchise marathon. I've never cared for it.

 

[cardinal biggles]

I'm with Starkers, the first quarter of DAD is some of Brosnan's best work as Bond. The second quarter is almost as good as the first. The last half of the movie is utter silliness on a level not seen since that fucking slide whistle in TMWTGG, or maybe the quadruple-take pigeon in Moonraker. Except those were brief moments, and this was half of a movie.

 

[cooleddie74]

For me the bottom 3 are DAD, Spectre and QoS. Quantum isn't as dumb as Spectre but damn, is it more tedious and littered with spastic, annoying editing. That lands it in the #25 slot of the official EON Bonds.

 

[Tallguy]

I think what's most annoying about DAD is that the first half at least is pretty good.

I would reply but...

I'm with Starkers, the first quarter of DAD is some of Brosnan's best work as Bond. The second quarter is almost as good as the first. The last half of the movie is utter silliness on a level not seen since that fucking slide whistle in TMWTGG, or maybe the quadruple-take pigeon in Moonraker. Except those were brief moments, and this was half of a movie.

Nailed it. The scene with Bond and M in the train station is SO good. For that matter so is the scene in the hospital. (And the callback to book The Man with the Golden Gun with the wall separating them is lovely.)

Oh, and Cleese got to be a pretty good Q. Once.

 

[cooleddie74]

DAD's opening sequence is nothing short of brilliant. The second half, though, is bottom of the barrel levels of ridiculous and stupid and tanks the film for me.

 

[The Realist]

I rewatched GoldenEye for the first time in years over the weekend. Such a superb Bond film, one of the best. Shame Brosnan never got anything quite as good again (IMO obviously).

Great action, wonderful cast and at just a shade over two hours it rattles along.

Said it before, but this is the kind of Bond film Amazon should be looking to make. Fun, exciting, and standalone.

Agree that GoldenEye is Brosnan’s best (and just plain one of the better films in the series), but I also liked The World Is Not Enough a good deal. Among other things, having the main Bond Girl turn out to be the Big Bad was an inspired twist.

 

[cooleddie74]

And to tie in with the original theme of this thread, Elektra King is another Bond character who indirectly references Tracy when she asks James, "Have you ever lost a loved one, Mr. Bond?" Bond's icy silence for a few moments is a great nod to continuity.

 

[Tallguy]

And to tie in with the original theme of this thread, Elektra King is another Bond character who indirectly references Tracy when she asks James, "Have you ever lost a loved one, Mr. Bond?" Bond's icy silence for a few moments is a great nod to continuity.

The film's title is literally from OHMSS.

 

[Starkers]

It's interesting that Moore Dalton and Brosnan all get references to Tracy in their films. I think Moore and Dalton's were more obvious.

 

[Set Harth]

Agree that GoldenEye is Brosnan’s best (and just plain one of the better films in the series), but I also liked The World Is Not Enough a good deal. Among other things, having the main Bond Girl turn out to be the Big Bad was an inspired twist.

And the song...

 

[Tallguy]

Such Garbage.

 

[Firebird]

For me the bottom 3 are DAD, Spectre and QoS. Quantum isn't as dumb as Spectre but damn, is it more tedious and littered with spastic, annoying editing. That lands it in the #25 slot of the official EON Bonds.

I find QoS fares slightly (and I do mean slightly) better only when immediately watching it after Casino Royale. It doesn't stand up as a solo effort one bit, it's gotta be a double feature. It really suffered from the writers' strike, and that shoddy editing that ruins the audience's ability to understand what the fuck is going on during the action sequences.

 

[the G-man]

I find QoS fares slightly (and I do mean slightly) better only when immediately watching it after Casino Royale. It doesn't stand up as a solo effort one bit, it's gotta be a double feature. It really suffered from the writers' strike, and that shoddy editing that ruins the audience's ability to understand what the fuck is going on during the action sequences.

At the end of the day, IMO Craig's hits (CR, Skyfall) were outnumbered by his misses (QoS, Spectre, NTTD), while Brosnan's ratio was more or less reversed, especially if one gives him a half-point for the first half of DaD. Brosnan's biggest problem is that he went out on such a low note with the last half of DaD that it taints his run more than deserved.

 

[Tallguy]

I find QoS fares slightly (and I do mean slightly) better only when immediately watching it after Casino Royale. It doesn't stand up as a solo effort one bit, it's gotta be a double feature. It really suffered from the writers' strike, and that shoddy editing that ruins the audience's ability to understand what the fuck is going on during the action sequences.

Yeah, there's 0 point to QoS without Casino Royale. And you're there ENTIRELY for Bond and M. And Mathis, actually. But wow, mopey revengy Craig is wonderful. Pity there wasn't a movie around it.

Oh, and the crazy-you-don't-know-where-you-are editing was GENIUS for the opening car chase. And unusable for the rest of the film. Especially the first big chase / fight after the interrogation. (I'm going from memory for a film I haven't seen in 16 years.) I just remember thinking "The best fight scene ever in a James Bond film is happening and I CAN'T SEE IT!"

Brosnan's biggest problem is that he went out on such a low note with the last half of DaD that it taints his run more than deserved.

Wow, isn't that the truth? Three amazing movies (one of them just about perfect) and all we can remember is the stupid CG para-sail.

 

[Starkers]

I've seen QoS numerous times now. It's no classic but there is a lot to like about it and whilst the first half is a mess the second half isn't actually that bad. The film settles down a lot once they get to Bolivia.

My Craig rankings go something like this:

Skyfall
Casino Royale
.
.
.
No Time to Die
.
.
.
Quantum of Solace
Spectre

For Brosnan my rankings go in production order, although if the second half of DAD had lived up to the first TWINE might have ended up my least favourite Brosnan.

 

[Starkers]

Talking of rankings, has anyone done this?

https://sorta.app/q/1043

It isn't perfect (I've just done it twice and got slightly different results) but the top 7 and bottom 5 are pretty much spot on, even if they shift around slightly (sometimes CR slips out of the top 5 for instance)

On Her Majesty's Secret Service
Skyfall
GoldenEye
Casino Royale
The Living Daylights
The Spy Who Loved Me
Live and Let Die
Licence to Kill
Tomorrow Never Dies
Goldfinger
For Your Eyes Only
Moonraker
From Russia with Love
The Man with the Golden Gun
Thunderball
Dr. No
Diamonds Are Forever
The World Is Not Enough
No Time to Die
You Only Live Twice
Die Another Day
Quantum of Solace
A View to a Kill
Octopussy
Spectre

 

[the G-man]

It isn't perfect (I've just done it twice and got slightly different results) but the top 7 and bottom 5 are pretty much spot on, even if they shift around slightly (sometimes CR slips out of the top 5 for instance)

On Her Majesty's Secret Service

If OMSS had been Connery's last instead of Lazenby's first (only), even with no other changes, it would unquestionably be considered the best of the franchise by everybody.

 

[Starkers]

If OMSS had been Connery's last instead of Lazenby's first (only), even with no other changes, it would unquestionably be considered the best of the franchise by everybody.

I don't think this is an unpopular opinion, but for me it wouldn't have hit as hard with Connery.

Connery was a way better actor than Lazenby, but I couldn't ever see him landing that final moment the way George did. (Actually I don't even think Tim or Daniel would have done it any better).

It isn't just about the final scene though. Lazenby is vulnerable in a way none of the others are, and OHMSS needs Bond to be vulnerable.

Plus if Connery had done it it's eminently possible Diana Rigg might not have been chosen to play Tracy.