Ok. What is the chance of a Picard spinoff?

[FederationHistorian]

Picard taking a refit E-G into the DQ would definitely be a first for the franchise.

I think it would help with the plot, in leaving everything from the TNG era behind. Instead of trying to answer every loose thread or rely on every callback possible.

PIC has a world of its own to use and play off of and to develop.

 

[HotRod]

After S3, SNW only has two years left at most (given P+'s penchant for cancelling shows after five seasons).

We don't know that. We still have no real idea with how Discovery preformed in terms of ratings. The show may have had its cord pulled from bad ratings.

With Strange New Worlds, we actually have proof of it doing relatively well in ratings. If the show is doing well, and it still makes financial sense for the show to continue, we may very well see several more seasons.

We only have Discovery's example to go off of, and that's hardly conclusive evidence.

I think it would help with the plot, in leaving everything from the TNG era behind. Instead of trying to answer every loose thread or rely on every callback possible.

So that's never gonna happen.

 

[evilchumlee]

We only have Discovery's example to go off of, and that's hardly conclusive evidence.

It's all somewhat tough, as they don't actually release viewership data. It's all kind of a "trust us" situation. There has been indication that Discovery had been long doing poorly, but Paramount kept pumping money into mostly a safe-facing gesture... it was CBS All Access'/P+'s big Prestige show... they wouldn't allow it to fail.

I think it would help with the plot, in leaving everything from the TNG era behind. Instead of trying to answer every loose thread or rely on every callback possible.

While they don't need to do it ALL the time, not doing it at all is the exact opposite of what the fan outcry is. People WANT the TNG connection.

There's certainly a way to have a blance.

 

[Danja]

We don't know that. We still have no real idea with how Discovery preformed in terms of ratings. The show may have had its cord pulled from bad ratings.

With Strange New Worlds, we actually have proof of it doing relatively well in ratings. If the show is doing well, and it still makes financial sense for the show to continue, we may very well see several more seasons.

We only have Discovery's example to go off of, and that's hardly conclusive evidence.

Yellowstone is a hit.

IT'S getting the axe after five seasons.

As time goes on, shows become increasingly expensive to produce. The days of shows going on and on into eternity are over (especially when, like Trek and Yellowstone, P+ has less costly sequels and spinoffs in the works).

P+ doesn't want to spend the money (Netflix is notorious for cancelling shows after THREE seasons).

They have to cut the thing off SOMETIME.

It's all somewhat tough, as they don't actually release viewership data. It's all kind of a "trust us" situation. There has been indication that Discovery had been long doing poorly, but Paramount kept pumping money into mostly a safe-facing gesture... it was CBS All Access'/P+'s big Prestige show... they wouldn't allow it to fail.

It was so sudden. One week, SMG was telling the media, "No one's discussed ending the show with us. We haven't had that conversation." The next week, they were cancelled (P+ announced the cancellation while the cast was at sea aboard the Star Trek Cruise -- truly a tasteless move).

 

[HotRod]

Yellowstone is a hit.

IT'S getting the axe after five seasons.

Didn't that have more to do with an issue with Kevin Costner?

 

[fireproof78]

While they don't need to do it ALL the time, not doing it at all is the exact opposite of what the fan outcry is.

Will it make them money?

The fan outcry is loud but is it deep?

 

[evilchumlee]

Will it make them money?

The fan outcry is loud but is it deep?

Hard to say, but from what we know, Picard S3 was a success.

There's at least some financial benefits as well, given they already have a slew of sets, props, costumes, 3d models, etc. Assuming we don't have any of the TNG people on the main cast, relegated to maybe a cameo here and there, the cast should be relatively inexpensive comparatively.

Special effects are always going to be expensive, but people seem to be into the idea.

It seems like, at the very least, something a stronger foundation than Starfleet Academy... Legacy at least has some noise behind it. They're making SFA kind out of left field. That's not say it won't or can't be good, but just straight measuring risk... Legacy seems to be the less risky move.

Although SFA is kind of the same difference... they have sets, props, costumes, etc. from DSC they can just reuse.

 

[HotRod]

slew of sets,

It's my understanding that all sets, save for the Enterprise-D, were destroyed.

 

[Danja]

It's my understanding that all sets, save for the Enterprise-D, were destroyed.

No one was anticipating calls for a spinoff (least of all Terry Matalas).

It didn't even have a name until Terry suggested "Star Trek: Legacy" last year.

They can do what they've done with the other Enterprises in the past and give it a "refit."

 

[fireproof78]

Hard to say, but from what we know, Picard S3 was a success.

Yes, but people would say that Discovery wasn't a success yet led to Pike and Starfleet Academy.

There's at least some financial benefits as well, given they already have a slew of sets, props, costumes, 3d models, etc. Assuming we don't have any of the TNG people on the main cast, relegated to maybe a cameo here and there, the cast should be relatively inexpensive comparatively.

Which is the one drawback. What drew in Season 3 for many (as posted here, amongst other places) was the TNG crew. Legacy isn't about that crew.

It seems like, at the very least, something a stronger foundation than Starfleet Academy... Legacy at least has some noise behind it. They're making SFA kind out of left field. That's not say it won't or can't be good, but just straight measuring risk... Legacy seems to be the less risky move.

It still is risky. And a Academy ideas has been circling since the 80s, so it isn't as left field as many might think. It also is far less riskier financially, since they have sets already built and in a place that is cheaper to film in Canada. They can bring in relatively young or unknown actors to make it cheaper as well.

Legacy would be the more expensive, and riskier, proposition, to my mind.

 

[Danja]

It still is risky. And a Academy ideas has been circling since the 80s, so it isn't as left field as many might think. It also is far less riskier financially, since they have sets already built and in a place that is cheaper to film in Canada. They can bring in relatively young or unknown actors to make it cheaper as well.

Legacy would be the more expensive, and riskier, proposition, to my mind.

Legacy would have Jeri Ryan and Terry Matalas attached (an award-winning actor/writer team).

It would also have the benefit of Picard's built-in audience.

 

[FederationHistorian]

So that's never gonna happen.

Maybe for Legacy.

But how many callbacks to TNG do people expect with a PIC movie? Since its runtime is likely only going to be for 2 hours, 2.5 hours at most.

While they don't need to do it ALL the time, not doing it at all is the exact opposite of what the fan outcry is. People WANT the TNG connection.

There's certainly a way to have a blance.

Yes, there is.

If they want to have the same energy as S3, then that means Ent-G, TNG reunion and rouge Changelings at least.

PIC energy is the PIC S1-2 cast, La Sirena, The Stargazer, Romulans/Zhat Vash, synths, Xbs/Jurati Borg, Watchers, and Q.

Not counting Terry's wishlist for S3 for characters he did not get. And that the Ent-E might get a final hurrah in the PIC film, like the Ent-D got in S3.

 

[Danja]

If they want to have the same energy as S3, then that means Ent-G, TNG reunion and rouge Changelings at least.

They'll have the E-G.

PIC energy is the PIC S1-2 cast, La Sirena, The Stargazer, Romulans/Zhat Vash, synths, Xbs/Jurati Borg, Watchers, and Q.

There was nothing wrong with S1-2.

S2 got hit by the Covid lockdowns. That's not the fault of the show.

 

[HotRod]

But how many callbacks to TNG do people expect with a PIC movie?

Depends on who's making it. If it's Matalas, I'd expect to be beaten over the head with callbacks.

 

[fireproof78]

Legacy would have Jeri Ryan and Terry Matalas attached (an award-winning actor/writer team).

It would also have the benefit of Picard's built-in audience.

Would that be enough?

Depends on who's making it. If it's Matalas, I'd expect to be beaten over the head with callbacks.

Yes, but its popular so it must be right...

 

[Paul755]

I think Legacy would have a very hard time keeping the peace between the fans that want non-stop cameos/call backs, the ones that want some and the ones that want very little to none.

 

[evilchumlee]

I think Legacy would have a very hard time keeping the peace between the fans that want non-stop cameos/call backs, the ones that want some and the ones that want very little to none.

You will never please all of the people, all of the time. I think that's particularly apparent in Discovery, which seems to be a particularly polarizing show.

It seems to be it's clear there is a market for both things... seems like Paramount can handle two productions at a time. Have one that is its own thing, with very little callbacks to anything. Have another that is nostalgia callback fanservice fest.

It still is risky. And a Academy ideas has been circling since the 80s, so it isn't as left field as many might think. It also is far less riskier financially, since they have sets already built and in a place that is cheaper to film in Canada. They can bring in relatively young or unknown actors to make it cheaper as well.

Legacy would be the more expensive, and riskier, proposition, to my mind.

I wasn't aware that the PIC sets had been destroyed, so there's an added cost.

The risk factor I think is off base. The very fact that there are people actively asking for one, and... nobody asking for the other should be an indicator.

The ONLY potential advantage SFA has is likely being targeted a different audience, the young adult crowd. It has potential to bring in a new audience, although it has potential to push away the existing fanbase. Kurtzman has addressed this, and while I don't trust Kurtzman as far as I can throw him, the fact that he's at least signaled he's aware of it is mildly promising. He's said something along the lines of "the show needs to be accessible to a new fan just picking it up, but also satisfying for an old fan with decades of canon knowledge".

I think the same thing could have been done with Legacy, although in the grand scheme, the fact that SFA was so far along in development is probably a good reason why Legacy won't happen. They're similar things. Legacy would have ALSO been the "younger crew" show. Had SFA NOT had any legs when PIC S3 rolled around, it may be a different story. SNW hit at the right place, right time... fans wanted it, and they didn't really have anything in active development.

There was nothing wrong with S1-2.

S2 got hit by the Covid lockdowns. That's not the fault of the show.

S2 got hit by Covid, Executive Meddling "it was too Star Trek" and had to be rewritten, and the whole time travel thing to begin with a cost saving measure passed from on high at the studio.

Some of the loose threads were kind of other issues as well. The whole anomaly/wormhole thing wasn't even supposed to be there, but it was determined the ending needed more action, so they stuck that in. Matalas wanted to actually tie it into S3 and have a quick explanation that it was a decoy transwarp conduit to distract from the one opening in Sol, but they just didn't have the time to make it happen.

S2 and S3 got hit by Covid, they filmed back to back. Alot of corners were cut in S2 to make S3 happen the way it did.

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm pretty sure CBS had plans to make a spinoff with Pike, Spock and the Enterprise far before the 'fans' made any noise about it. Don't delude yourself into thinking that the fans have any power over the choices that CBS/Paramount makes.

It was probably because of Akiva pushing for it.. He wanted a Pike and Spock series from the very start, he says that the reason he originally said yes to Kurtzman to work on DSC was him thinking it would be a Pike series. All he knew at the time was that it was a TOS prequel.

He's the one that had the Enterprise added to the season 1 finale to set up Pike for Season 2.

It's all somewhat tough, as they don't actually release viewership data.

While Paramount hasn't been releasing their own exact numbers, the Nielsen system started tracking P+ last year and we have numbers for PIC Season 3 and SNW Season 2.
According to those numbers, SNW S2 had more views than PIC Season 3 on average.

and the whole time travel thing to begin with a cost saving measure passed from on high at the studio.

It was Terry's idea to do a time travel story.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

Would you call SNW a "slam dunk"?

I wouldn't.

I like this, because it’s true.

SNW has done well critically, but it hasn’t set the general audience on fire.

None of the latest Star Trek shows have done much more than excite people who were already Star Trek fans. None of it has penetrated the wider culture in any meaningful or noticeable way.

 

[Quantum21]

Discovery is the Spinoff! See future spoilers.