Spoilers What does SNW get right that DSC and PIC got wrong??

[ED-209]

So I think we can all agree the majority of us enjoy SNW while we were quite divided over DSC & PIC.

So what does SNW get right that the others got wrong?? A couple of my ideas.

1) A Starfleet captain: Pike is what a Starship captain should be, Lorca/Saru/Burnham/Rios/That version of Picard are not.

2) It's light tone, we like Star Trek because it's bright and optimistic (even in tone when the Story isn't) - SNW is the only one that achieves this, DSC & PIC were slit your wrists dark at some points.

3) The episodic format, Trek works best it's episodic.

4) Back to the roots! - it's about exploring (ahem) "Strange New Worlds" .

Anything to add?

 

[Nerys Myk]

Good writing

 

[Mudd]

They just did Star Trek.

 

[Racefuel]

Its just fun, SNW doesn't have the baggage of unresolved storylines and character arcs like Picard did.

They set out to have SNW be a touch lighter in tone when possible.

I enjoyed Picard, I enjoy SNW, I don't think either got anything "right" or "wrong", they're just different.

 

[Cyrus]

I liked the other shows especially Picard, so I have nothing to add here. But I do like the return to episodic format.

 

[HotRod]

It's fun. It's optimistic. It doesn't take itself too seriously.... I dunno.

I think @Serveaux said it best...

They just did Star Trek.

 

[Rahul]

Superficially the episodic nature.

PIC & DIS could have been great - if someone actually thought about the season long stories in terms of being ACTUAL STORIES, and not as hooks, cliffhangers and mystery boxes.

SNW - by it's nature of being episodic - HAS to think about plotlines more traditionally:
Set-up, climax, payoff.
Every week.
It sure as shit also struggles with it's season-spanning arcs (remember M'Benga's daughter? Or slow-dripping anything insightful about the Gorn?).

But still - it has to deliver an actual, fully functional story each episode. That avoids the disappointment of watching a story for 8 episodes, only to have a complete ass-pull in the second-to-last episode, completely swap out the badguy, and tell a completely different story that renders the previous majority of the season meaningless.

 

[Q2UnME]

Superficially the episodic nature.
*snippage*

But still - it has to deliver an actual, fully functional story each episode. That avoids the disappointment of watching a story for 8 episodes, only to have a complete ass-pull in the second-to-last episode, completely swap out the badguy, and tell a completely different story that renders the previous majority of the season meaningless.

I'd also be tempted to add "the needlessly padded episodes in the middle of the arc (that add nothing to the overall story being told) placed there just to fufill air time and episode count".

 

[UssGlenn]

2) It's light tone, we like Star Trek because it's bright and optimistic

The also turned the actual lights on the set on. Probably has a bigger unconscious impact than you'd think.

 

[The Wormhole]

If there's one thing Disco and Picard have proven it's their writing staffs are not adept at serialized storytelling at all. SNW has pulled off the perfect blend of episodic storylines that are resolved an hour after they start with character arcs running through the season so each episode still feels like it's building something rather than being completely disposable, which let's be honest, a vast majority of episodes from the 90s shows do feel rather disposable.

 

[comsol]

SNW has the advantage - since it's episodic - of being able to do a greater variety of types of stories. It can take risks, like a musical episode, that would be very difficult - if not impossible - for the other live action series.

 

[Discovery McDiscoveryFace]

I think I find I just really like this crew. Both the characters and the actors. They seem to have engaged on social media a lot more - they come across really well (I mean who could not end up adoring Melissa Navia after seeing her Ready Room interview).

That's not to say that I dislike the others - I could watch Doug Jones as Saru for hours and am awestruck at his characterisation when working with a bucket on his head effectively. And Jeri Ryan is a joy. But there is just something about the whole SNW cast that hasn't been there before - very much from the first couple of scenes that Anson Mount did in Disco when he literally had us, all of us.

 

[DonIago]

At least in the case of DISCO, the frequent turnover behind-the-scenes probably didn't help anything at all either. Similarly, PIC changed showrunners between S1 and S2. I'd be curious to see what PIC is like in an alternate timeline where that didn't happen.

 

[Kaelef]

DISCO's writers never decided what kind of show they wanted to be, and switched gears and focus in a rudderless way. The huge time jump was a pretty glaring indication that the writers weren't on board with the original vision for the show, or that the original vision hadn't been fully thought-through. And despite it being the longest-running of the new Trek shows, I feel the writers never did a good enough job of making the characters believable people.

PIC was just shockingly bad writing (far less so in the third season but still fell apart in the last couple of episodes IMO), and, especially in the first season, there was that same sense of not knowing where the show was going to end up.

SNW has had far fewer instances of what stand out as bad writing, and it seems to know what kind of Trek it wants to be. It probably doesn't hurt that the more episodic format is easier to get right than season-long story arcs. Decent writing combined with inspired casting that has resulted in a crew that gels well together is a powerful combination.

 

[DonIago]

^FWIW, I thought the time jump in DISCO was one of the best things they decided to do with the series...I wish we had any reason to think that that had been planned from the beginning. I do think S4 of DISCO holds together pretty well for the most part, except that there's definitely some padding in later episodes. With how short TV seasons have become, it's unsettling when you're left thinking a season had too many episodes.

I found PIC S1 better than S2 for the most part. S2 was hugely disappointing to me because I was tuning into PIC to watch a show about the future, not to watch Our Heroes wander around slightly future LA for far too long (though the first couple of episodes of S2 are pretty decent). That said, I very much didn't care for PIC's tendency to bring back long-missed characters only to end their stories.

 

[ichab]

Not to dump on the other shows, but IMO SNW just seems to better understand what makes Star Trek work. The cast is almost perfect, the writing is top notch and the episodes are just so much more engaging. I care about this crew and I look forward to whatever adventure they get in next. It's like TOS, but better because we also have side stories and relationships that carry forward, which allows you to be invested with everyone.

Plus I just think the episodic format works better for this franchise. I like having a goofy episode one week, a serious the next, a horror after that and then a musical etc. etc. The show has very low chance of becoming stale because there is always something different. On the other shows, everything just seemed to be dark and grim all the time with one storyline spread across an entire season that could have been completed in half the episodes.

 

[T'Bonz]

Gen Trek Discussion.

 

[Vger23]

I like them all, but for different reasons.

We had a bunch of clones (TNG, VOY, ENT) already, and I think it’s important that different series have different styles and tones. It’s not about “getting it right” as much as it is about keeping it fresh and not using the same formula over and over again.

The fallout is, of course, that some people aren’t going to like certain approaches.

I think that’s ok and it’s natural.

 

[Lord Garth]

So I think we can all agree the majority of us enjoy SNW while we were quite divided over DSC & PIC.

SNW is broader, so more people enjoy it. If you don't like DSC's specific style or storytelling, you're out for an entire season at best or an entire series at worst. Same goes for PIC.

SNW wants to go out of its way to please more people. DSC and PIC will only go so far. I don't think all three shows should be the same as each other. There's room for different styles. If anything, I think having SNW around allows for the other shows to become more niche because they don't have to be all things to all people.

I generally don't watch episodic shows. I haven't in about 15 years. So DSC and PIC are closer to what I normally watch.

There's also the very real possibility of SNW running out of ideas, following TOS, TNG, VOY, and the first two seasons of ENT. So I think the more "out there" they go and the more "outside the box" they go, the better. Whenever it was Traditional Trek doing Business As Usual, I'd give the episodes 6s. Whenever they've been wacky and out there, putting the Strange in the Strange New Worlds, I've given them 9s and 10s.

From what I've seen, I liked the first half of the first season and the second half of the second season better than most of what came in the middle. There are a few episodes I haven't seen at all yet, and a few I didn't finish. Sometimes I'd wait days or weeks to see an episode. Whereas with DSC and PIC, I'd be there the second an episode dropped on CBSAA or Paramount+, and I couldn't wait to see what happened next. I like cliffhangers, they're page-turners.

Anyway, I know I'm the dissenting opinion in this case, but I do have to make some attempt to stick up for the other point of view. So there it is. But look at it this way: the worst I can say is that sometimes SNW doesn't grab me, and I encourage them to keep going wild, when they do go wild.

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And yeah, sorry, but I like the dark lighting! Look at what I look like! Can you really be surprised?

 

[Tosk]

I remember when one of the SNW producers oh-so-insightfully said in an interview, "We thought, why not just do Star Trek?"

That's it, that's my answer.