News Star Trek Prodigy Cancelled, Season 2 to be shopped around

[Wouter]

Past shows that have been pulled were rotated off and resold, not pulled and wrote off their taxes which is what Paramount has said they are doing if they can't sell it, just like HBO and Disney have done in the last year. If they write it off the existing physical media is all that can be made, they can't make more. You can't write it off and continue to sell it. That's tax fraud.

I don't know the ins and outs and the legal nuances, but a show like "The Nevers", in what may be a similar situation, was broadcast on Tubi and is still getting sold as disc-sets, after it got effectively written-off. That suggests it is possible to get income from it through certain means, I suppose the streaming service has separate book keeping and it's them that write off the show, not the connected operations that produce the show(s).

Interesting plea from Shawna Benson:
https://twitter.com/shawnabenson/status/1672357485724991488
Apparently, no residuals for Prodigy, which may (I hope...) increase the chance of finding a new home for S2.

 

[wayoung]

I don't know the ins and outs and the legal nuances, but a show like "The Nevers", in what may be a similar situation, was broadcast on Tubi and is still getting sold as disc-sets, after it got effectively written-off. That suggests it is possible to get income from it through certain means, I suppose the streaming service has separate book keeping and it's them that write off the show, not the connected operations that produce the show(s).

Interesting plea from Shawna Benson:
https://twitter.com/shawnabenson/status/1672357485724991488
Apparently, no residuals for Prodigy, which may (I hope...) increase the chance of finding a new home for S2.

The Nevers wasn't written off. It was sold to Tubi. That's what the hope is for Prodigy. That it will be sold to another streamer or network.

 

[Wouter]

The Nevers wasn't written off. It was sold to Tubi. That's what the hope is for Prodigy. That it will be sold to another streamer or network.

IIRC it was also pulled abruptly from the Streamer who offered it (HBO Max, I think), and at the time it wasn't known whether or not it would be picked up by another service later. A month or so later, it was announced that it would go elsewhere.

Shawna Benson wrote something that may be the heart of the matter (besides the general financial state of the streaming services, which creates a cutthroat environment): "ST: Prodigy was always an underdog. We heard it over and over -- what Star Trek fan will watch a show for kids? And what kid will watch Star Trek?"

I agree with her that they managed to make a show that is good for kids and for older fans at the same time, but financially it may not have been the hit with either that current streaming services demand it to be.

 

[Sakonna]

Seeing how many kids shows also came down from P+, it feels like they really couldn't make the whole "Kids" part of their business work at all.

Which tracks with what I see IRL. I know a lot of parents, and none of them are streaming P+ for the kids.

 

[wayoung]

IIRC it was also pulled abruptly from the Streamer who offered it (HBO Max, I think), and at the time it wasn't known whether or not it would be picked up by another service later. A month or so later, it was announced that it would go elsewhere.

Being pulled off a streamer does not equal being used for a tax write off. The Nevers was sold to Tubi. Westworld was sold to Prime (I think? Was that official yet or still just in the works?). They are going to other networks. The fees WB got by selling the rights to other streamers was more than the possible deduction for writing them off, so they sold them.

Other projects were written off. They were worth more in tax deductions than licensing the to others. Those will never be seen (legally) anywhere again.

Prodigy is in-between right now. If someone offers Paramount enough money, Paramount will sell it. If the licensing offers aren't high enough and Paramount decides it's worth more to take the tax deduction, then they write it off and it is never seen again.

That is what Zaslav has brought to the entertainment industry. Instead of filling your service with content and spending years re-selling projects if it doesn't generate an immediate return bury it forever and take the tax deduction.

And business wise it's working for him. HBO Max was profitable for the first time ever. He got a big bonus. Disney followed his precident and are saying it's key to profitability. Now Paramount is doing the same.

No more years building up cult audiences by licensing stuff cheaply to small channels. Big subs on your platform immediately. If that doesn't work, big licensing fees immediately. If that doesn't work, fuck it, take the tax deduction.

 

[Wouter]

Being pulled off a streamer does not equal being used for a tax write off. The Nevers was sold to Tubi. Westworld was sold to Prime (I think? Was that official yet or still just in the works?). They are going to other networks. The fees WB got by selling the rights to other streamers was more than the possible deduction for writing them off, so they sold them.

Other projects were written off. They were worth more in tax deductions than licensing the to others. Those will never be seen (legally) anywhere again.

Prodigy is in-between right now. If someone offers Paramount enough money, Paramount will sell it. If the licensing offers aren't high enough and Paramount decides it's worth more to take the tax deduction, then they write it off and it is never seen again.

That is what Zaslav has brought to the entertainment industry. Instead of filling your service with content and spending years re-selling projects if it doesn't generate an immediate return bury it forever and take the tax deduction.

And business wise it's working for him. HBO Max was profitable for the first time ever. He got a big bonus. Disney followed his precident and are saying it's key to profitability. Now Paramount is doing the same.

No more years building up cult audiences by licensing stuff cheaply to small channels. Big subs on your platform immediately. If that doesn't work, big licensing fees immediately. If that doesn't work, fuck it, take the tax deduction.

That's a shame. What do you think the chances are that Netflix, or other possibly interested parties, would offer enough to make it worth as much or more than the tax reduction?

The apparent decision to continue production at least seems to point to some belief that it can be sold, otherwise business logic says to end production right now, no matter if its 97% complete.

This policy will make it ever more unlikely that well plotted (but not necessarily spectacular right-out-of-the-box) series will get a chance to thrive, or even to get a pick-up in the first place. The suits will only go for the quasi guaranteed hits.

 

[wayoung]

That's a shame. What do you think the chances are that Netflix, or other possibly interested parties, would offer enough to make it worth as much or more than the tax reduction?

This policy will make it ever more unlikely that well plotted (but not necessarily spectacular right-out-of-the-box) series will get a chance to thrive, or even to get a pick-up in the first place. The suits will only go for the quasi guaranteed hits.

I've no idea what the chances are. Like everyone else, my fingers are crossed. I haven't seen all of Prodigy, I don't have children, and was only throwing episodes on once in awhile out of curiosity, although now I'm hoping to finish it before it goes in my country. But regardless of my thoughts on the show itself, I don't think any piece of art should be treated this way. Zaslav stabbed Film and TV in the gut last year setting this precedent and now it's dying slowly and painfully. It's a disgusting practice. It's also the new normal.

It's like all those old movies and TV shows that were lost forever because the tapes were reused because the tape itself was judged more valuable than the show/movie on them. And then the next 60 years people shit on the companies for doing so, saying they can't imagine how anyone could make that decision. Destroying movies and TV for the price of tape.

But now they're doing it again. For a tax deduction.

 

[Danja]

So does this not affect anyone with the ad plan?

Edit: I just checked my P+ ad plan that I have through Amazon Prime. It still looks the same (i.e. I don’t get Showtime shows.) Although they don’t have the Showtime add-on option anymore; if I want to watch Yellowjackets, for example, I’d have to pay for each episode.

I have the Premium Plan on Amazon Prime.

They added Showtime+ as another programming tier within P+ (I was wondering how it was going to work. I was considering giving up Prime for the P+ app.)

It's like all those old movies and TV shows that were lost forever because the tapes were reused because the tape itself was judged more valuable than the show/movie on them.

92 episodes of Doctor Who are gone for that reason.

Seeing how many kids shows also came down from P+, it feels like they really couldn't make the whole "Kids" part of their business work at all.

Which tracks with what I see IRL. I know a lot of parents, and none of them are streaming P+ for the kids.

P+ just pulled some Nick shows today:

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/paramount-removes-inside-amy-schumer-many-nickelodeon-shows/

 

[Commander Troi]

I'm beyond pissed off at this. Cancellation sucks, but pulling the show? That's just sick and wrong.

OT: I led the campaign to bring the WB TV show Birds of Prey to DVD (it was cancelled after one season).

Thank you. It's on my shelf.

Checked yesterday, and P+ didn't mention anything about it leaving. They usually announce it on the show page... so people who don't follow such specific news didn't even know about it

 

[BillJ]

Paramount+ isn't exactly giving me a reason to keep subscribing.

 

[Oddish]

If I unsubscribe, I will specifically tell them that it's in retaliation for Prodigy.

And their lack of a PS5 app, too.

 

[herofhyrule]

Has any one person ever caused as much damage to the entertainment industry as Zaslav?
Also, I wouldn't say it's as bad as it was back then. They're gone legally, yes, but nowadays it's pretty much guaranteed that they will still survive illegally.

 

[fireproof78]

Has any one person ever caused as much damage to the entertainment industry as Zaslav?

Probably.

 

[herofhyrule]

Well, I mean, I'm struggling to think of anyone else in particular who made it a trend to just bury your new TV series if they're unsuccessful.

 

[fireproof78]

Well, I mean, I'm struggling to think of anyone else in particular who made it a trend to just bury your new TV series if they're unsuccessful.

Hollywood accounting has been around for decades now. It's how some actors never get paid on residuals because the film never made a profit...on paper.

 

[tomalak301]

Paramount+ isn't exactly giving me a reason to keep subscribing.

I'm going to cut back when my renewal period comes. I still want to see the new Star Treks, but it's not worth the full year subscription. This service has become a month on month off service for me.

 

[herofhyrule]

Hollywood accounting has been around for decades now. It's how some actors never get paid on residuals because the film never made a profit...on paper.

OK, but that's not solely the idea of one person. What I meant was, has anyone done more harm by themselves. As far as I can tell, this whole tax write-off thing was invented by Zaslav, or at the very least heavily popularised by him.

 

[wayoung]

OK, but that's not solely the idea of one person. What I meant was, has anyone done more harm by themselves. As far as I can tell, this whole tax write-off thing was invented by Zaslav, or at the very least heavily popularised by him.

Unfinished projects were written off all the time. Finished projects - aired and unaired - that's all him

 

[Avro Arrow]

The fact that there could be episodes in the venerable Star Trek franchise that are just disappeared never to be seen again just boggles my mind.

This is the streaming world that the studios wanted to rush towards. As usual, it's the consumer who gets the raw end of the deal.

Yes. Each month they put out press releases for major new releases and "leaving this month" films/tv. They just don't get reported outside places like Mobile Syrup and other online entertainment sites. They also post them on social media

In this case they didn't mention it at all.

Its a big deal if they were losing all the Star Treks, so I'd expect somekind of statement or acknowledgement given how upset alot of Trekkies will be with them.

So based on this, I did some searching, and found Crave's list of removals and additions for July. As people have mentioned in this thread, none of the Star Trek shows are listed in the removals ("Last Chance Programming"). So presumably one of three things are true:

1. This was a very last-minute change, and they didn't know it was going to happen before the list was published (a mere five days ago).
2. They knew it was going to happen, but didn't add it to the list in hopes of avoiding a backlash, or some other reason.
   
3. As a couple people have mentioned in the thread, the shows aren't really leaving at all, and the dates in the app are just to drum up interest, or because an agreement is being renewed, or something like that.

I would be quite happy if all of this was much ado about nothing. It would be great to think that, at the very least, Prodigy season 2 still had a home at Crave.

 

[fireproof78]

OK, but that's not solely the idea of one person. What I meant was, has anyone done more harm by themselves. As far as I can tell, this whole tax write-off thing was invented by Zaslav, or at the very least heavily popularised by him.

If you need a boogeyman go for it.