Blueshirts were security in those days.Sorry about my earlier post with the very female Colt handing Pike the clipboard. However, we don't know exactly who the clipboard guy on Pike's right side is.
Where have all the yeomen gone?
- Thread starter Laura Cynthia Chambers
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MA treats them as two individuals. I dunno, maybe she went to prime universe Altamid and gained alien features like Krall, Kalara and Manas.
Yeah the MA articles influenced my understanding of the Disco Colt.
Or science or medical, like Spock and Boyce. How much of a uniform color consistency was there in the pilots? Communications officer Alden in WNMHGB also wore blue.
Why didn't they have red by that point? Even kind of a washed-out dusty burgundy, in keeping with the other colors...
They did, but it wasn't used for security. Yeomen and other ops type did though
By WNMHGB things are a little different.
Engineering, Helm and Nav are in "coral". The yeoman is in gold. Science is blue. Though Spock (not pictured) is in gold. Science/Medical are blue. But so is comm officer Alden. Security might still be blue as we see an armed blue shirt Mr. Leslie (or one of his clones) on Delta Vega.
SNW plays homage to this format as J. Mitchell and Ortegas are redshirts
Oh, I thought it was tan, gold, and blue.
I call it coral, but tan works too.
If there is a reddish tint to it, that makes more sense.
Some photos show a reddish tint.
So, "The Cage" is the first and only time where a member of security hands the captain a clipboard to read and sign? The blueshirt is holding his own clipboard while Pike reviews the one Colot has just handed him. Does Kirk ever get a PADD (or whatever they were known as in TOS) from security in the series itself?
If you're headed that way anyway, you bring it yourself. If you're not, you dispatch a yeoman.
Any random redshirt handing him a "PADD" could be securitySo, "The Cage" is the first and only time where a member of security hands the captain a clipboard to read and sign? The blueshirt is holding his own clipboard while Pike reviews the one Colot has just handed him. Does Kirk ever get a PADD (or whatever they were known as in TOS) from security in the series itself?
"Where have all the yeomen gone and where are all the gods?"
*Apollo, Q and the Prophets raise their hands*
You were specific about the historical role you want to incorporate. I've pointed out facts about what that position really entailed. That's not hair-splitting.
Oh well, if someone posted it to Wikipedia... But no citations except for the foxhole, and obviously an officer could order anyone to dig whatever hole they wanted. Driving the vehicle is just wrong, there would be someone assigned whose main job was to drive and maintain vehicles. Having a batman act as a bodyguard is not likely, either, because the batman would have an assigned post in a specific platoon, section, squad etc. They were not "extra" personnel, and taking them away to watch over the officer would not be fair to the rest of their team.
The article doesn't mention the important point that the officer paid the servant privately. It is correct that the older term was "soldier-servant," though. You can read the WW1-era regulations on soldier-servants here, where it is noted that they are permitted as "an indulgence" for officers.
Doing domestic chores is more fun? OK.
Story-wise, most of any crew member's day-to-day job is going to be too boring to show, whether it's administrative paper-pushing or putting an engine together. If you want a lower-level person with frequent interaction with the captain, a yeoman is not a bad way to go, and with out the menial service implications of a batman.
Why wouldn't they? Yeomen may have a paperwork job, but they are members of the crew and liable to be detailed to the same duties as any other crew members. A good example is in The Sand Pebbles (1966), a movie set on a small ship between the world wars. In that Yeoman 2nd Class ("ship's writer") "Red Dog" Shanahan is at one point part of an armed landing party and later his battle station is on the bridge with the captain, where he relays orders and is exposed to fire. In the novel, his battle station is loader of the forward 3-inch gun.
Perhaps some people don't understand, in the navy one's regular assigned job is just one part of their duties. Standing watch is something separate, and battle and quarter stations separate things again. In a WW2-type ship, a yeoman's battle station might be as a "talker" (internal communications), or in a gun crew, or in a damage repair party, or in a medical aid party.
I think most of us do understand that the yeomen were non-commissioned officers and in a Trek sense, they would have training in science, engineering, security, and ship's systems. When talking converting the concept very broadly to expand the role of the yeoman, I still think you are hair-splitting because the Yeomen were already doing the domestic chore part of the job, including getting out Kirk's uniform (eventually edited out of the episode), serving food, and giving him a back massage, which were probably not part of a historical yeoman's administrative role. What I was suggesting was more about in what way other (more interesting) parts of the job could be ported across into the writer's bible about how to incorporate the role into the stories. I think Colt was already teasing the batman role by charging down to the planet to search for Pike and Roddenberry later edited a script to keep Rand off Spock's station on the basis that she was Kirk's valet.
I found some interesting historical information on https://www.greatwarforum.org/ which may have a bit more colour than Wikipedia:
"A batman was in British Army parlance an officer's uniformed servant or orderly, supposedly taken on as a voluntary extra duty, for which the officer paid for the service. In addition to his normal duties, the batman was responsible for the officers clothing and kit and also in preparing and serving meals. The duties varied depending on the officer's rank and role and whether he was serving in barracks, on training or on operations. In the trenches, a batman carried his personal weapon and often acted as a bodyguard, while the officer carried out his duties as a platoon, company or battalion commander. There is anecdotal evidence of continuing close relationships between officers and their batmen and of officers going under fire to rescue their batman and vice versa.
Senior officers on the staff and in command positions were entitled to a personal staff, including a batman. It was usual to seek a volunteer from the senior officer's regiment who was detached from the regiment and posted to the senior officer's headquarters or unit."
"I have 1/2 dozen Pre-war Standing Orders from Irish Guards to Kings Own to Army Service Corps. Dates ranging from 1911 through 1912. Irish Gurads Amendments through 1914. In all these cases Officers had extra employed men as Servants and Grooms and no Batmen. Batmen were for Warrant ranks and NCO ranks usually down to Lance Serjeant. Officers Servants could be extra employed men from the ranks who were freely offered, with the right of refusal, that duty (all SO state if a man refuses he can no longer be employed/offered employment by any other officer). An Officer was also free to use civilian servants. Rules and regulations on officers servants are usually fairly well spelled out in each units Standing Orders and can be different from unit to unit.
Servants/Batmen in War were different. By most War Establishments, and Field Service Manuals, Batmen/servants were authorized in the field at the rate of 1 per each dismounted officer and officer with one mount. Two were authorized for Officers authorized two mounts. In an Infantry Battalion in 1914 this would be only the Lieut-Col. In 1915 the Battalion OC went from two to one Horses so he lost a Batman. WO and NCO's lost their Batmen completely for all units including the Guards (at least per regulations) on mobilization. All Batmen were to be armed and trained soldiers unlike peace time. By the War Establishments Officers Servants were called Batmen, but I'd hazard a guess that, particularly in Regular units, they continued to be called Servants/Grooms."
I think the only new stuff that a yeoman would be doing, using this as inspiration only, not a literal adaptation (albeit Rand's wig was as tough as a tin hat) would be adopting the role of personal pilot and personal security. The rest of it looks like what we already saw the yeomen doing, plus admin duties on top.
Baldric was cited as possibly being an example of a batman in Blackadder Goes Forth.
Edit: Of course, yeomen were from an era before emails and replicators, first officers have taken on the role of confidant, and recurring security chief characters now act as bodyguards. I still think that yeoman assistants could have a role since admin duties would remain very onerous but maybe their absence is explained by the fact that they never got the respect they deserved and their story purpose has been dished out to other characters?
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This much is true.
Those duties fall to the Culinary Specialists, the current name for the rate that grew out of the segregated Cook/Steward ratings of WWII via the Mess Management Specialist rating . They would be the ones assigned to a commanding officer not only to be in charge of the Captain's Mess but also be responsible for the CO's mundanes*, like cleaning his/her cabin, maintaining the wardrobe etc.
A Navy Culinary Specialist responsibilities vary and can include ( source ):
- Menu management.
- Food preparation.
- Mess, kitchen, and dining facilities operations.
- Operation and management of shipboard living quarters.
- Operation of shore-based hotel-type quarters.
- Serve as personal food service specialists in Commanding Officer’s and Admiral’s messes.
- Financial record management.
- Maintain subsistence inventories using storeroom management procedures.
- Provide hospitality and catering services during official command receptions and ceremonies.
- Serve as a flight attendant aircrewman on designated aircraft.
*(Some may object to the servile nature of that but a CO should be focused on his command not on whether he has time to make the dry cleaners before the Admiral's visit.
)
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I just realised I've been pronouncing it wrong in my head. I was thinking yee-oh-min.
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