Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x09 - "Võx"

[Magistos]

Red eyes don't fit with the borg either.

Technically....
Red is the complementary color to green. Opposites on the color wheel and the colors that most make each other "pop".
It kind of fits - transmitter/receiver, king/queen, yadayada

Christmas is borgapalooza with all the red and green.

 

[Oso Blanco]

Now who said that the bridge of the D isn't movie worthy? That looked absolutely fantastic ... they should have found an excuse to use the D from the very beginning of this show!

 

[jaime]

The era of rapid Franchise Expansion is done. Star Trek isn't on TV anymore, you can't just tune into TNG/DS9/VOY on TV anymore for free, you have to go out of your way to seek it down and buy subscription services.

With it being on Amazon Prime in the UK, it’s almost terrestrial TV — a lot of people have prime just for the other things, the TV almost a bonus.

 

[El Maestro]

So uhhh......if you don't like nostalgia maybe skip this one

 

[El Maestro]

Now who said that the bridge of the D isn't movie worthy? That looked absolutely fantastic ... they should have found an excuse to use the D from the very beginning of this show!

Hell yes; the D hate is wrong she is beautiful.....

 

[bob saget]

And if we accept your premise that this is what Star Trek is, then there's no significant division between Trek and something like Star Wars, therefore making it completely redundant and pointless. Why bother at all if that's all it is?

You have to have some distinguishing quality to justify your existence. This doesn't anymore.

 

[bob saget]

Hell yes; the D hate is wrong she is beautiful.....

Yeah that low quality CG with textures blurrier than some games I've played (not even hyperbole) looked great.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

While you're right that the quality:crap ratio is so skewed by now that there is far more swill than quality Trek, and so it's fair to say that Trek is swill, through around the 5th season of TNG it was still what I claimed it to be.

Like I said, Trek's been junk since DS9.

I think it's always been junk. Don't get me wrong I enjoy it! Just like I enjoy junk food. But even DS9 is a 16 year old boy's idea of "dark and edgy" as he ages out of his childhood toys. We're not exactly talking about great literature here.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

And if we accept your premise that this is what Star Trek is, then there's no significant division between Trek and something like Star Wars, therefore making it completely redundant and pointless. Why bother at all if that's all it is?

You have to have some distinguishing quality to justify your existence. This doesn't anymore.

There's room for lots and lots of light entertainment in the world. It justifies its existence in that people are willing to pay for it. Now I'm done responding to you because I need to go outside!

 

[eschaton]

I think I know your problem. You think Star Trek is about the intellectual exploration of ideas. Except for the odd episode, no it never has been. It's always been entertaining junky space opera.

I think this sort of highlights the problem with modern serialized Trek, in that the real strength of Trek as a concept is that it could be a little bit of everything: Junky space opera, deep character study, comedic farce, high-concept SF. But once you commit to a serialized plot for a single season (and given modern short seasons), you're pretty much locked into one mode the whole way through. You can't just say "fuck it, we're going to have a lighthearted casino heist on the holodeck" in the middle of deep heavy shit.

 

[Vyse]

Wasn't part of the reason they destroyed the Enterprise D in Generations was that Voyager was going to be using that sound stage?

 

[jaime]

That is where we differ. Going by what he has said in various interviews, I don't think Terry knows anything but "Nostalgia Trek". His entire concept for "ST: Legacy" is to visit places and people we already know.

Something that has never been truly done in Trek until now. SNW is the closest to it. It, DSC and ENT all suffered from being prequels. Picard, and particularly this series of Picard, is the first time a Trek TV series has directly followed from another. It’s more like the TOS movies in that regard particularly. (Which is why it’s like TMP, TWOK and TSFS had a TUC like baby)
DSC had the time jump, but that’s like calling DUNE a sequel to the ILIAD.

 

[bob saget]

I think it's always been junk. Don't get me wrong I enjoy it! Just like I enjoy junk food. But even DS9 is a 16 year old boy's idea of "dark and edgy" as he ages out of his childhood toys. We're not exactly talking about great literature here.

I never claimed DS9 was any good. Hated it. Hate every TNG movie. Like I said, it's been crap for far longer than it was ever good.

And eschaton is right--the 10 hour movie thing just doesn't work. What you end up with is a TNG movie quality turd with tons of filler.

 

[eschaton]

Wasn't part of the reason they destroyed the Enterprise D in Generations was that Voyager was going to be using that sound stage?

I could be wrong, but I think part of it was also just deciding that the Enterprise sets just didn't look good with movie lighting/film resolutions.

 

[jaime]

The red door imagery was junk, too. Didn't fit with the Borg at all. You can't allude to something if your allusions have ABSOLUTELY ZERO VISUAL, AURAL, OR THEMATIC CONNECTION TO IT. It's SO bad. Really, it's shameful.

Fits with Picards though. Genetic Trauma.

 

[Tomalak]

This is how I've always felt and how I respond when people have complained about Disco / earlier Picard seasons not all being about delivering lessons as if that's the only thing star trek has ever done.

I think it's because people saw those simple moral lessons when they were 8, and somehow expect to be challenged to an equal extent as an adult.

TNG wasn't ever particularly profound, it was a popular weekly drama series with plenty of action, adventure and joy.

This season of Picard has captured that quite well overall. There's been some nice themes throughout of loss, grief, parenthood etc. That's about par for Star Trek throughout it's existence.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

I think this sort of highlights the problem with modern serialized Trek, in that the real strength of Trek as a concept is that it could be a little bit of everything: Junky space opera, deep character study, comedic farce, high-concept SF. But once you commit to a serialized plot for a single season (and given modern short seasons), you're pretty much locked into one mode the whole way through. You can't just say "fuck it, we're going to have a lighthearted casino heist on the holodeck" in the middle of deep heavy shit.

Yes I can agree with you here! There are some properly great episodes of Star Trek with a nice tight scifi plot (I think Yesterday's Enterprise is my favourite there). But trying to stretch that out over a whole season like s2 of Picard just doesn't work, you see too many joints and the tone shifts are jarring.

 

[jaime]

I think I know your problem. You think Star Trek is about the intellectual exploration of ideas. Except for the odd episode, no it never has been. It's always been entertaining junky space opera.

It can be both. I think this series is also both.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

I think it's because people saw those simple moral lessons when they were 8, and somehow expect to be challenged to an equal extent as an adult.

Right, I think this is exactly it. I think a lot of people enjoyed the moral utopia lessons in TNG when they were 8-10, then got challenged by the deeper edginess of DS9 as they were teenagers. That stops them from looking at either with clear eyes.

 

[bob saget]

There's room for lots and lots of light entertainment in the world. It justifies its existence in that people are willing to pay for it. Now I'm done responding to you because I need to go outside!

No actually there really isn't. There is far too much noise out there. We're already suffering from media overload. We need LESS--not more.