Have you lost your goddamned mind!?!?
Early Review of Picard Season 3
- Thread starter Omegaphallic
- Start date
Have you lost your goddamned mind!?!?
Who is that?
See I have to seriously disagree with these statements.
SNW in ten episodes has probably the most developed over character based cast to date in Trek's history. I mean seriously 10 episodes. Now of course, characters like Pike and Spock seriously give the production a significant amount of work already done, so the aspect of building a character especially for those two doesn't need to be done. But even with that both characters have shown significant character exploration (especially Pike who in ten episodes, might very well have the most character exploration of any character to date in a span of 10 episodes in Trek's history).
And then we have Discovery at what 56 episodes so far. We certainly have a more developed cast overall, including bridge crew then what TOS had at 56 episodes, more so then TNG had a 56 episodes, ect, ect. Now that doesn't mean I connect with those characters, but thats a whole different discussion.
Discovery did the same for me. I was born in the early 80s so grew up on new run TNG and TOS reruns (my dad was a fan) and watching TNG reruns on daily syndication and my recorded VHS tapes. I absolutely loved DS9 as well and that has remained my favorite Trek since about season 5 of that show's run. I gave Voyager a few shots off and on until season 4 and then stopped because it never kept my interest. I didn't even made it through the first season of Enterprise's original run. Like you, I felt Star Trek had become really stale with Voyager and especially Enterprise - Farscape was already a few seasons in and was doing new things with creature design, music, and makeup - while Trek was reusing the same types of nose ridges for alien species over and over again, reusing plots, reusing the same "wallpaper" type music. Other serialized shows I loved around this time like BSG, Sopranos, The Shield, 24, and Lost were just more interesting.
I disliked Enterprise so much that I basically gave up on the franchise and, save for the occasional rerun of a movie or show on cable TV didn't rewatch a whole lot. Maybe I'd go back and rewatch City on the Edge of forever or some of the TOS movies from time to time but that was pretty much it. I watched the JJ movies - I didn't like them mainly from a writing standpoint and it being a reboot. They were ok as action movies, but pretty forgettable for me. I absolutely hated Into Darkness. Again, I felt the Star Trek franchise was gone.
Fast forward to the Disco announcement - another prequel with reboot type effects, trailer didn't look good, and I did not intend to sign up for the new streaming service but I figured I'd at least check out The Vulcan Hello part 1 since it was airing on CBS for free. I actually liked it! And signed up for CBS All Access to continue watching weekly. I started getting more interested in Star Trek again!
After season 1 of Discovery I went back and did a rewatch of most of TOS, then did a rewatch of TNG. I remembered why I loved the franchise in the first place and became a huge fan again! After season 3 I did my first ever rewatch of DS9. Last year I did a selected watch of Voyager, and watched the later seasons for the first time.
I've enjoyed each of the new Star Trek shows (and all of them more than Enterprise and I think all of them are more consistent than Voyager - although VOY has better highs). Do I love every episode or story point that's been done? No, but the things I do enjoy have continued to outweigh the things I don't.
I remember him saying several months ago that parts of it were good, but didn't really count because it was animated. He felt it was limited in that it didn't have a human POV character and Star Trek has always been about the human condition. He also said it was inoffensive.
I think sometime in the last few months he also said it was great. But the guy streams a ton, so I may be misremembering as I only skim every few stream. So please please don't quote me quoting him as it's not like I can just link to a 15 minute video on a specific topic. Fine, good, great are all different words.
Thanks.
It's a bit of a strange conceit of him about the human POV character, since the Prodigy characters (like most Star Trek aliens) are really just humans represented in alien form and touch on various issues for real life children, teens and even adults. It's good though that he - grudgingly maybe - came to like it anyway. IMO that bodes well for Picard S3 - if he had continued to dismiss Prodigy I would place less stock on his assesment.
I think he disliked that none of the characters were human. Because Trek is suppose to about the human adventure. Which I think is a sound complaint if Trek went this route to much. But it seems okay IMO to focus a show on a bunch of aliens from time to time to me. Especially when you got multiple Trek shows on at once.
As a white guy 11 from 50, I feel I'm allowed to say that.
Sounds as if his dislike of Prodigy is based on principle, not quality. He's not the target audience (none of us are), but he "needed" to grab onto something, so that's what he came up with. I didn't even think about none of the main characters being from Earth until I read this post just now.
If that's the best he's got, then that says a lot about Prodigy. All of it good.
Yes, SNW does well and the hour long run time goes a long way to deal with this. Thing is, outside of interactions which we already know the end point of, characters haven't had as deep a chance to shine, and as you say, in some parts its easy because we know the fate of at least six of the characters shown on screen which fills in probably too much we need more and deeper time with the "original for the show" cast apparently that's coming in Season 2.
I'm not watching TOS and its 1960s expectations of characters and audiences though, I'm watching in 2023 my demands as an audience member, or expectations are going to be different. Fact is, a show 30 years old did characters development better, I can barely cite to you any bridge members except Tilly, Burnham and Saru. They're just not getting the same impact on my brain as characters did 30 years ago. SNW's cast and crew does. Picards does, Lower Decks and Prodigy's does. Which suggests something is still likely a bit wonky somewhere with the writing.
I actually went to look at the Discovery Personnel list over on memory alpha and I haven't got a damn clue who any of them are without clicking into the pages. I've watched all 56 episodes and can name about five. Yet I can rattle the folks in SNW with far, far less episodes characters off. Same with the other shows.
I mean it is innofensive, it's a kid's show. One thing I enjoyed with the fact it's an animated show they can shove a lot more aliens in it per square inch since the actors dont have to do makeup chairs. Like they really took advantage of the fact their show was CGI and it's really refreshing to see.
With how blurry (and scarily accurate) Hologram Janeway was she was the Human POV standin and the guy's splitting hairs, and a really nice sendup to the concept of The Doctor. Be nice if we could have Picardo in Prodigy too if the rumours of him in S3 turn out to be true.
Interesting. So, if I tell you in 2023 that I can rattle off four non main cast members names and that I remember them does that change this statement?
Detmer.
Owo.
Rhys.
Bryce.
All characters I enjoy, aside from Burnham who is my favorite. The fact is, shows are doing characters differently and some work while others don't. For example, do I recall the TNG crewmembers without looking them up? Not really. TOS though I recall people like Tomlinson, Stiles, Giotto, and Gavorick (not sure on spelling). Characters are an interesting bench mark when some leave their mark on some people, and others don't care.
And I think they're jaded and cynical. So it's the pot calling the kettle black.
This thread wouldn't even exist if people hadn't become so jaded. "We hate New Trek, but Picard Season 3 is actually good, so give it a chance!" I can get behind it, because I agree with the message of, "Don't automatically hate all New Trek!" So I'm biting my tongue a little bit on this one for the greater good.
Some shithead on the internet who has an opinion about something.
You named the bridge characters who are main characters. The ones not making an impact on your brain aren't main characters so it makes sense they aren't making an impact on your brain. Just like the same helm ensigns that were in TNG for dozens of episodes have no impact on my brain either and we also don't know who all those officers standing in the back of the bridge in TNG were or what they were doing.
If TNG were airing now would we have posts saying "we've seen the same helm officer on the enterprise-d bridge for over 50 episodes and we know nothing about her!"?
I really enjoyed seasons 1 and 2 of Discovery. Seasons 3 and 4 just really went off the rails in terms of quality, in my opinion. Those two seasons, along with season 2 of Picard are some of the worst in the franchise. Again, in my opinion.
I think there's a huge difference between "STD Sucks!!!!" and "Discovery isn't good." The latter group I can argue with them and disagree with them about it, when it strikes my fancy (not here, not now). The former group, I'm done with those people.
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