When did the Janeway hatred truly start to coalesce?

I meant it as an allegory on abortion in the sense that he was inconvenient. Two people had to give up THEIR lives (temporarily) to bring him into existence.

Now that he's become a nuisance, Janeway wants him gone.

 

I think the whole reason the episode is compelling is because there is no right answer, just a choice of the lesser of two evils. It's basically the trolley problem. I think people who want there to be a clear, straightforward right answer are missing the point. If there had been one, it wouldn't have been as powerful a story.

 

I think TNG's Up The Long Ladder is a more obvious allegory for the Pro-Abortion Option stance.

 

You mean pro-choice. Calling it "pro-abortion" is inflammatory. Nobody wants abortions to happen as an end in themselves; the principle is that the choice has to be the mother's, not the state's.

 

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That's an interesting take on it and I wouldnt have minded some form within the theme, but from what I understood the GOAT and Tuvok has been friends for a long time; I can understand where she's coming from and why she made her decision. The one thing about the notion of abortion which doesn't support the theme is where a human life didn't eliminate the two people, what was done on VOY was to restore what was instead of keeping that abomination around. The context of the bad writing made her appear stone cold even though Mulgrew portrayed some sympathy behind closed doors but I don't believe the writing needed to make her look that way. If I wrote it I would've had Tuvix doing whatever he could to make things right while the Voyager crew including the GOAT go through hoops to try to stop him.

There just wasn't enough time went by for the GOAT and the crew to have much value for Tuvix; the story doesn't make any sense. From their stand point this person is not the people they knew and there's an investment among the viewer who wants those characters back. This reminds me of Louis Tully from Ghostbusters where he's running for his little life from the demonic dog and ends up by the window of a NYC restaurant where customers were watching him sliver to the ground. After, they went back eating and having conversation. That's how I felt about Tuvix and that stupid episode. I personally felt the crew should've acted the same way, who cares? He was a stranger who consumed their friends and now problem solved - move on.

 

Riker shot a pre-term Riker clone, because the galaxy is only big enough for one Will Riker... Or one Will Riker and one Thomas Riker. He aborted a Pulaski too, but no one cares about that.

Abortion is murder.

But that's fine.

Quality of life for an adult is more important than a parasite.

Kill them all.

The sophistry of trying to contend that abortion is not murder is exhausting.

 

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I don't understand your contradictory position. "Pro-Abortion," no matter what word you put after it, is every bit as imprecise and blatant and is used by the exact same people who use "Pro-Life." So if you reject the latter misrepresentation, you should reject the former misrepresentation as well, because they're two sides of the same coin. The term is "pro-choice," because that is what it actually is -- defending a woman's right to choice over what happens with her own body, which is about more than just abortion.

 

Pro-life and pro-choice have been in use for decades, probably because both sides take pride in the label associated with them.

 

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Pro choice is a great way to say it..

As long as you have a choice it's good.

The pro no choice people got ##cked over last week.

The fda approved sending the abortion pill in the mail.

No clinic required.

Oh no.

Zoom conference/assessment, and then it's in the mail.

Out sourcing.

Even mild racists are not going to be happy about calling Mexico or India to talk about their sexual history.

 

I agree with you entirely about "Pro-Life," so I don't know why you're focusing on that side of it. I just don't understand your hostility to the use of "pro-choice."

 

It's a generalization anyway. I identify as pro-life, but I'm fine with abortion to safeguard the mother's life. Others might identify as pro-choice, but oppose certain types of abortion, or abortion for certain reasons.

 

Or, being a single male and not a doctor, consider it none of their business at all.

 

If we want to talk abortion, let's start a topic on the subject in Miscellaneous. Assuming that's even allowed.

More potential Janeway rules...

17. Avoid sickbay unless absolutely necessary.
18. Leave sickbay as quickly as possible.
19. If the EMH complains because you're avoiding/leaving sickbay, just ignore him.
20. If the EMH tries to relieve you because you're avoiding/leaving sickbay, see Rule 19.
21. If a flesh and blood doctor tries to relieve you because you're avoiding/leaving Sickbay, see Rule 19.
22. Never underestimate the power of the Janeway Death Glare.
23. When the captain removes her uniform top and grabs a phaser rifle and a knife, you'd better run.
24. Logic can be used to justify anything. That's its power, and its flaw. (awesome line)
25. Every now and then, surprise people with a hidden talent (playing pool, dancing ballet, and gutting Borg with a bat'leth all apply).

 

I'm going to have to make a notation: "Continued Next Meme"

 

Are all 93 of Gibbs's rules listed anywhere? Or are they like the Ferengi Rules of Aquisition (they say there are 285, but there are actually only 70 or so)?

 

CBS sells drinkware with the rules printed on them:

https://www.cbsstore.com/collections/ncis/Drinkware


Another list:

https://ncis.fandom.com/wiki/Gibbs's_Rules


They list all the rules that have been mentioned on the show (there aren't actually 93 of them in total).

 

Some of these can actually go over.

26. Never date a co-worker.
27. Never screw over your crew.
28. Never be unreachable.
29. Don't mess with the captain's coffee if you want to live.
30. Don't break up the family (derived from "always work as a team")
31. Sometimes you're wrong. Unless the writers feel like you have to be infallible because you're Captain Frickin' Janeway, in which case you'll only be wrong when you think you're wrong.

A third of the way there.