This argument also falls apart because "Yesterday's Enterprise' is one of the best episode of TNG.
Thrawn said:
I'd argue the same since we literally see Wesley resurrected mid-book. But I'm willing to bet you a Galaxy-class starship that I'm right.
Spoilers Coda: Book 1: Moments Asunder by Dayton Ward Review Thread
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This argument also falls apart because "Yesterday's Enterprise' is one of the best episode of TNG.
I'd argue the same since we literally see Wesley resurrected mid-book. But I'm willing to bet you a Galaxy-class starship that I'm right.
Yes, because there were characters who had arcs and said and did interesting things in that episode.
I guess there's no sense arguing over already decided facts that neither of us has access to yet, but I'll be shocked if you're right. Guess we'll both find out together.
Children ageing up suddenly is a very common sci-fi trope.
Even if the whole “Let Kurtzman be king over charred bones and cooked meat. Let him be the king of ashes” vibe is ultimately a fake-out, that doesn’t make Moments Asunder any more rewarding a reading experience.
The irony is that Wesley’s fakeout death is a more effective sequence than any of the “real” deaths, because it’s at least the culmination of a narrative progression and is given a little buildup instead of being yet another “and then they turned to dust.”
The irony is that Wesley’s fakeout death is a more effective sequence than any of the “real” deaths, because it’s at least the culmination of a narrative progression and is given a little buildup instead of being yet another “and then they turned to dust.”
I was - and remain - a big proponent of doing a litverse ending, after all we’ve been through over 20(!!!!!) years together. And I suspect that no ending would satisfy all parties… but I am glad we’re getting it.
Firstly on my impressions, a sidebar… Rene Picard reads like a Nexus child. He slept through the night even as an early boy… reading his real paper books… ever so well mannered. I feel parents reading the books might think we’ve gone from science fiction to high fantasy reading about him. And do the Picards drink anything other than wine from their own vineyard?!?! Anyways…
Destiny #1 this was not. I agree that it took far too long to get going and by the end of the book I’m still not convinced about the threat or the direction of travel. There’s lots of interesting foreshadowing that I hope gets a pay off - I haven’t seen too many folks comment on the asteroid that apparently hit the baddies home planet only five or so years previously (hinting at another true villain?).
I’ll read all 3 before making a final judgement, but so far… ok setup, wait and see.
Firstly on my impressions, a sidebar… Rene Picard reads like a Nexus child. He slept through the night even as an early boy… reading his real paper books… ever so well mannered. I feel parents reading the books might think we’ve gone from science fiction to high fantasy reading about him. And do the Picards drink anything other than wine from their own vineyard?!?! Anyways…
Destiny #1 this was not. I agree that it took far too long to get going and by the end of the book I’m still not convinced about the threat or the direction of travel. There’s lots of interesting foreshadowing that I hope gets a pay off - I haven’t seen too many folks comment on the asteroid that apparently hit the baddies home planet only five or so years previously (hinting at another true villain?).
I’ll read all 3 before making a final judgement, but so far… ok setup, wait and see.
Alternatively, I maintain she's just taken up body tattooing in place of hair dye. I imagine that's a thing that's easy to put on and off in the Federation.
Riker: Christine?
Christine: I had a little too much on Risa and woke up with this tattoo.
Would there be any legal issues preventing LD from just flat-out saying that it's Christine?
I admit -- I have entertained the idea since 1994 that Picard never left the Nexus and that all of subsequent 24th-century Star Trek is Picard's Starfleet Nexus fantasy -- he believes he left the Nexus with an imagined Kirk, he believes he and Kirk defeated Soran, etc., but he's actually still inside the Nexus, Soran was never defeated, and his crew died when the Veridian star went nova. It's an interesting concept -- is late 24th-century Star Trek just a phildickian mindfuck? -- but I don't know what you do with it.
No. CBS owns Christine Vale lock, stock, and smoking barrel.
Well we know that's not possible because of DS9. Though a part of me actually thinks that Picard and Kirk might still be there and only sent out Nexus clones (because we're already in the realm of space magic).
How so? Worf's assignment to Deep Space 9 and the appearances of Barclay and Troi on Voyager don't disprove the idea that everything post-Generations is a Nexus-induced fantasy for Picard; they'd simply be part of that fantasy. It's a thought experiment, not a serious idea for a direction of the franchise.
Though it does give rise to the idea of who exactly Picard thinks he is. He lived an entire life in "The Inner Light," he has fragmented memories of a future that didn't happen ("All Good Things..."), he had the Borg Collective directly in his brain. What makes the Enterprise any more real than his life as Kamin? How does he know that Picard is the reality and not just Kamin's dream? It's the Benny Russell question about which is real and sends us, again, into phildickian territory.
I'm wondering if Rene might turn out to be the ultimate bad guy.
Aged up and missing his childhood, he's trying to find a timeline where that doesn't happen, but he's creating paradoxes by doing so.
Aged up and missing his childhood, he's trying to find a timeline where that doesn't happen, but he's creating paradoxes by doing so.
Rene will become Pariah?
By God I think you have it.
Either that or ‘old’ Wesley that died becomes ‘old’ Rene. Sucks to be Beverly.
I’ll be honest, I am reconsidering my purchase/pre-orders. There were things pissing me off in the re-launch already for years, and some things started to look up, but now it’s just doubling down with this book. The only real high spots were the Voy books for the most part (and they’re basically done) and anything by Una. My frustration is best summed up by the phrase ‘everyone is O’Brien now’ because they have just been miserable.
I guess I will see what the next ones like. Will send it back if it’s tut.
Reflecting on the first part of this trilogy, I'll say that my biggest gripe with ANY multiversal threat in science fiction is that there only ever is just the ONE multiversal threat.
Our litverse friends should be facing countless Devidians from multiple realities trying the same shit, or Thanos, or ultimate Ultron...
Hell, when you wander into the multiverse, even the fourth wall becomes more of what you call "guidelines", and nothing except the multiversal version of Russian Roulette prevents the Devidians from popping up in my living room to fuck up my day while I'm reading.
Overall, I'll say that I thought this was a better than decent book that was swimming upstream against 20 years worth of literary baggage and expectations, so I'd hardly expect it to land perfectly with everyone.
I appreciate that these authors and fellow treklit geeks committed to a send-off trilogy for the rest of us.
Our litverse friends should be facing countless Devidians from multiple realities trying the same shit, or Thanos, or ultimate Ultron...
Hell, when you wander into the multiverse, even the fourth wall becomes more of what you call "guidelines", and nothing except the multiversal version of Russian Roulette prevents the Devidians from popping up in my living room to fuck up my day while I'm reading.
Overall, I'll say that I thought this was a better than decent book that was swimming upstream against 20 years worth of literary baggage and expectations, so I'd hardly expect it to land perfectly with everyone.
I appreciate that these authors and fellow treklit geeks committed to a send-off trilogy for the rest of us.
I dunno. Pam Ewing not only dreamed a whole season of "Dallas" until Bobby stepped out of that shower, she even dreamed a few episodes of "Knot's Landing", although Bobby seemingly stayed dead in that show. And Miss Elly still had the new husband that Pam dreamed up.
I listened to the unabridged audio in 90-minute chunks, but I never found myself getting bored or impatient. Admittedly, there were a few characters and ships new to me, because I have some gaps in my reading of the past few years, but I still found those new characters engaging.
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True. I stand corrected regarding Picard in the Nexus living out his fantasies.
Mind you, now I'm imagining Q showing up and going, "Yep. Enough of this now."
Mind you, now I'm imagining Q showing up and going, "Yep. Enough of this now."
