Supergirl and Superman and Lois don't use the same VFX house. So one of the reasons for not reusing Supergirl's Fortress may be due to them not using the same 3D software.
Spoilers "Superman & Lois" Season 1 spoiler discussion!
- Thread starter The Realist
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It might have been, but didn't they cancel the crossover due to COVID?
I don't know much about CGI, but isn't it possible to import a 3D item from one program into another? Plus I've seen Donny over in the Fan Art forum create accurate 3D reconstructions of Star Trek sets in a matter of weeks in his spare time, strictly from photo reference. So a team of artists working on the clock could do it even faster. So it seems like a design choice to go in a completely different direction.
If there is a reason beyond S&L wanting to be different for difference's sake (and I'm not saying there is, but I think it's likely), a considerable amount of the SG fortress was a set (it's not the kind of show that has entire dramatic scenes on blue-screen with spectacle constantly happening in the background. I'm pretty sure everything you can see in this screengrab, for instance, is a physical set, while establishing shots like this show the larger scope of the CG version, with the giant statues, visible ceiling, and the flat, nonreflective floor), and if they can't share production materials or stages due to COVID, then S&L would have to make something different. The SG set was larger and more intricate, while the S&L version was a single pedestal and a bunch of very simple CG ice-tunnels greenscreened in). The VFX companies not playing nice probably wasn't as much of a factor, if they already couldn't use the SG Fortress set. An optimistic take on it would be that this compromise was intended to suggest the S&L Fortress was just a side-chamber or something (hence the lack of technology or memorabilia or giant ice-statues), and S&L is planning to inherit the SG Fortress materials when that show ends or the pandemic winds down and quietly start using the "main" area next time Superman needs to come by to pick up a space-gun he confiscated years earlier or something. If it was really a desire to retcon the Fortress, the new one probably would've included some of the iconic Fortress features, instead of the set being a smallish ice cave, and the CG aspects being a somewhat larger ice cave. It's also possible the simpler background rather than using the main Fortress atrium was to keep things on an intimate scale between Clark and Jordan, or the make the VFX faster and less expensive to make up for the entire sequence being on greenscreen, and there being a number of action sequences elsewhere in the episode where they couldn't just put a wall of glittering ice in the background and call it a day.
That's not to say inconsistencies because of different VFX suppliers don't happen. Stargate: Atlantis was a notable case, having two or three radically different models for the city and the Puddle Jumper shuttlecraft depending on which studio was providing the VFX for a given episode (or even switching between them from one shot to the next, for big episodes that used multiple venders or lots of stock footage).
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Hmm... looking at the photos there actually eases my mind about the differences. I'd thought that the SG Fortress was more angular and blocky while this version was more rounded, but while it's true that a lot of the screencaps there show set pieces with elongated ice crystals suggestive of the Donner design, the wide CGI establishing shot you link to shows that a lot of the cavern is just carved straight out of the ice. It's got more ornate features, like the statues and stairs and columns, but the bare walls and ceiling aren't that different from the S&L version. So yeah, I guess I can buy that the cave Clark & Jordan visited is some kind of side annex.
That's plausible.
See, that's why I was thinking it would be faster and less expensive to borrow a CG background from SG and match it with whatever set they built. Or if they were really pressed for time and money, just stick in a stock establishing shot from SG and then cut to the tighter set.
I never noticed that. Again, I really thought that different digital FX houses would just be able to share each other's models, rather than having to create their own separate ones.
Kara still used a suit in space as recently as last season.
I think it’s clear S&L is doing its own thing continuity-wise, with little regard for what might have been established on Supergirl or elsewhere. “Crisis” is the hand-wave excuse, but to the extent it doesn’t plausibly account for the changes, I suspect they give few if any shits.
I think it’s clear S&L is doing its own thing continuity-wise, with little regard for what might have been established on Supergirl or elsewhere. “Crisis” is the hand-wave excuse, but to the extent it doesn’t plausibly account for the changes, I suspect they give few if any shits.
I still think those scenes can be rationalized as taking place in the upper atmosphere, where the air is thin enough that the sky is black but it's still not complete vacuum.
The not flying in space stuff from Supergirl was dumb anyway so I'm glad to see it ignored TBH
I don't see what's dumb about it. I mean, the way Kryptonians fly has no good explanation, but we can assume it requires pushing against something, whether it's the air or the Earth's surface or the Earth's magnetic field or something. Just magically moving in vacuum without any source of thrust makes no sense. A human-shaped being flying in the atmosphere doesn't make much sense either, but it's slightly less nonsensical than flying in vacuum.
Also, I think the Arrowverse follows the precedent of the post-Crisis comics and the DC Animated Universe in having Kryptonians require air to breathe, so they couldn't operate out of the atmosphere anyway.
A lot of superpowers have no real good sense. So in that case I'd rather stick to something that had been shown repeatedly in the comics and on film as to what Kryptonians could do in space. Superman flew in space in the comics, cartoons, movies. We saw other Kryptonians as well (even ones who JUST got their powers like the Zod and his group freed from the Negative zone in Superman II)
Kryptonians can't fly in space because they need to breathe and there's no air in space.
As I said, it depends on the era -- the post-Crisis comics and the DC Animated Universe said they couldn't fly or breathe in space. And so has the Arrowverse, which should stay consistent within itself, no matter what other things have done.
A little correction. Immediately post-Crisis Superman coulnd't breath in space but he could fly (sometimes he used a breathing apparatus).
Okay.
I liked the way the DCAU did it -- Superman couldn't fly in space under his own power, so STAR Labs adapted Kal-El's space pod into a one-person spaceship that Superman could use for interstellar flight. Supergirl went with a similar approach.
Honestly that aspect has never been consistent in any TV medium. In Superman the animated series, they had Superman in a space suit providing life support; yet later and the Justice League and Justice League unlimited animated series, they often had the Superman flying outside the Watchtower in orbit without a spacesuit.
It just seems to be a "needs of the plot" aspect.
"Logic clearly dictates that the needs of the plot outweigh the needs of the fanboys." -- Spock
There's still a lot of mixed reactions to this series. I do feel this version of Superman is not the favorite or type audience would like to see, and as this thread has revealed, some do not like the "darker" cinematography, or its lack of being a grinning type of Suprerman.
That was Arrow's ratings for the finale? That's significant disinterest for the series that seeded most of Berlanti's shows.
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