Sure, but the maquis crew members were civilians too, that's my point.
Uniform Code Not So Uniform
- Thread starter Bry_Sinclair
- Start date
Actually we don't really know how many of the Maquis WERE civilians. Some of them, like Chakotay, actually had Starfleet careers.
It's generally accepted the only ones of Voyager's Maquis crew who had prior Starfleet careers are the ones who were automatically given officer's rank right away, which aside from Chakotay is just Ayala and Seska.
Granted, we know Seska definitely was not a Starfleet officer, since she was a Cardassian spy. Which could suggest she was at first undercover posing as a Starfleet officer and when the Maquis situation started, the Obsidian Order wanted her to use her cover to become disgruntled with Starfleet as a means of infiltrating the Maquis.
Either that or she was just given an officer's rank because she was sleeping with the XO.
It could also be that she was (posing as?) an officer in some other organization, either Bajoran Militia or just a senior official in one of the Bajoran terrorist cells. And maybe was high enough on the food chain that she was declared Ensign worthy by Chakotay when doling out ship assignments.
That's a moot point because Janeway points out that the ones Tuvok's trains have no starfleet training, making them civilians. That's why Tuvok sets up his mini academy in the first place.
^ But that doesn't necessarily apply to ALL the Maquis. Just the ones that Tuvok was training. They were special cases.
Tuvok was on them because they were openly rebellious and angry. They weren't as ready to assimilate as the other Maquis were.
Tuvok was on them because they were openly rebellious and angry. They weren't as ready to assimilate as the other Maquis were.
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JANEWAY: That's why Commander Chakotay and I have agreed that this should be one crew. A Starfleet crew. And as the only Starfleet vessel assigned to the Delta Quadrant, we'll continue to follow our directive to seek out new worlds and explore space.
So, the Maqui commander agreed for his crew they would live as a Starfleet crew. This means one uniform. It was a sign of unity.
Of course, they had different rank "pips" than the regular Starfleet crew. So much for uniformity.
So, the Maqui commander agreed for his crew they would live as a Starfleet crew. This means one uniform. It was a sign of unity.
Of course, they had different rank "pips" than the regular Starfleet crew. So much for uniformity.
Probationary ranks vs. commissioned ranks.
Shouldn't Tom have been sporting the provisional rank bar as well then?
In principle, perhaps. But I still think him having real pips was proper.
The one difference between him and the Maquis was he was recruited before the Badlands as an observer. He had a uniform on... without a rank, but still a uniform. So I suppose he was technically a part of the crew when they arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
Plus, when Chakotay first saw and berated him on the bridge when they initially beamed over, Janeway got in Chakotay's face and told him to treat a member of her crew with respect in the same way he would have her treat his crew. So at the very least, she already considered Paris as part of the crew.
Additionally, Paris did acquit himself well when they first arrived. Without being asked, he took over the helm when Stadi was killed, he went to sickbay with Harry to help there, and he volunteered to search for Harry. At that point, none of the Maquis were on board, so it's easy to see her giving him an actual commission with real pips. She said, "You earned this, Tom." And I agree with her.
The one difference between him and the Maquis was he was recruited before the Badlands as an observer. He had a uniform on... without a rank, but still a uniform. So I suppose he was technically a part of the crew when they arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
Plus, when Chakotay first saw and berated him on the bridge when they initially beamed over, Janeway got in Chakotay's face and told him to treat a member of her crew with respect in the same way he would have her treat his crew. So at the very least, she already considered Paris as part of the crew.
Additionally, Paris did acquit himself well when they first arrived. Without being asked, he took over the helm when Stadi was killed, he went to sickbay with Harry to help there, and he volunteered to search for Harry. At that point, none of the Maquis were on board, so it's easy to see her giving him an actual commission with real pips. She said, "You earned this, Tom." And I agree with her.
There's also a disconnect between dialogue and wardrobe for Seska. Although she's refered to as Ensign Seska her rank bar has the same single black slash worn by most of the Maquis designating senior Crewman/Petty Officer/Chief (inline with the single black pip), whereas based B'Elanna and Ayala's insignia, she should be wearing a single metallic slash on hers.
Not necessarily since he was brought on as essentially a mission advisor and former Starfleet. So, Janeway would easily field promote him as active again.
They are consistently inconsistent. If the Office of Standards and Practices ever got a hold of Star Trek they would be keel hauled.
Yes you can argue the situation in game all you want, but the costuming and writers are inconsistent enough to make any real discovery of Standards of the Uniform code impossible.
Yes you can argue the situation in game all you want, but the costuming and writers are inconsistent enough to make any real discovery of Standards of the Uniform code impossible.
Yup. That's a feature, not a bug of Star Trek and a lot of fictional organizations.
But, it doesn't stop technical manual writers from trying
My fan theory is for a four-tier system:
- Commissioned Ranks: Granted by the President or C-in-C or a top admiral in their name based on recommendation boards and the like. Higher ranks get more scrutiny. This is most every Starfleet officer in the various series, except for some unique exceptions.
- Field Ranks: Given "on the field" by a commissioned Captain or Admiral, outside of approval of any commissioning authority. Nog, Tom Paris, and Ensign Wesley Crusher are notable examples of this. BOBW Captain Riker as well. When the battlefield or mission necessities allow, their rank will return to prior status or be revoked (or, potentially, they will receive a full commission).
- Provisional Ranks: Granted by a Captain or Admiral, similar to a field rank, but to non-Starfleet officials, and with certain provisions. Namely, they do not retain this rank outside of the mission objective (Chakotay is a Lieutenant Commander in the Voyager hierarchy, *not* a Lieutenant Commander in Starfleet) and they are not necessarily bound by all of Starfleet's rules and guidelines, merely the ones demanded of them by the mission. They often (but not always) wear rank insignia to denote this. Examples include the Maquis on Voyager, but also warp specialist Lt. j.g. Kosinski and Officer Exchange Program members like Commander Kurn and Ensign Mendon.
-Acting Ranks: Similar to a Provisional Rank, an Acting Rank denotes a non-Starfleet officer placed in a position of authority by a Captain or mission commander for a specific mission. They may be in training or just only qualified for a specific task that would otherwise need an officer of that rank to hold it. They often wear specialized uniforms, but not necessarily so. They do not wear rank insignia. Examples include Acting Ensign Wesley Crusher.
- Commissioned Ranks: Granted by the President or C-in-C or a top admiral in their name based on recommendation boards and the like. Higher ranks get more scrutiny. This is most every Starfleet officer in the various series, except for some unique exceptions.
- Field Ranks: Given "on the field" by a commissioned Captain or Admiral, outside of approval of any commissioning authority. Nog, Tom Paris, and Ensign Wesley Crusher are notable examples of this. BOBW Captain Riker as well. When the battlefield or mission necessities allow, their rank will return to prior status or be revoked (or, potentially, they will receive a full commission).
- Provisional Ranks: Granted by a Captain or Admiral, similar to a field rank, but to non-Starfleet officials, and with certain provisions. Namely, they do not retain this rank outside of the mission objective (Chakotay is a Lieutenant Commander in the Voyager hierarchy, *not* a Lieutenant Commander in Starfleet) and they are not necessarily bound by all of Starfleet's rules and guidelines, merely the ones demanded of them by the mission. They often (but not always) wear rank insignia to denote this. Examples include the Maquis on Voyager, but also warp specialist Lt. j.g. Kosinski and Officer Exchange Program members like Commander Kurn and Ensign Mendon.
-Acting Ranks: Similar to a Provisional Rank, an Acting Rank denotes a non-Starfleet officer placed in a position of authority by a Captain or mission commander for a specific mission. They may be in training or just only qualified for a specific task that would otherwise need an officer of that rank to hold it. They often wear specialized uniforms, but not necessarily so. They do not wear rank insignia. Examples include Acting Ensign Wesley Crusher.
He should have. But then, his dad's an admiral, so...
Yup. That's a feature, not a bug of Star Trek and a lot of fictional organizations.
But, it doesn't stop technical manual writers from trying
Someone needs to fill the mental wards.
Does the name "James Dixon" ring any bells?
Yeah, it's an American show, and in the end Americans had to watch it or it would be cancelled.
Someone needs to fill the mental wards.
Does the name "James Dixon" ring any bells?
I thought I fooled everybody by changing it, and even having arguments with myself over the transitioning period? Oh, well.
As regards Tom Paris, Janeway may well have signed official forms on pardoning him for services provided, long before the Maquis crew situation arose. Possibly this deal included giving Paris a promotion to boot, to full Lieutenant - something Janeway soon retracted, Paris being Paris, so he goes back to junior LT but still is senior in that rank to junior LT Torres in the relevant episodes such as "Day of Honor". (It wouldn't work that way if we pretend Paris "always" wore the junior pips, because he would then have gotten them simultaneously with Torres and wouldn't enjoy the seniority.)
Indeed it's possible that Janeway never felt she had the right to promote anybody, except when relenting on field demotions she herself had inflicted. Even Tuvok may have been one of those cases, having been demoted due to "Prime Factors" and then restored to LCDR - in this theory, his collar pips during the first season tell the true story, and the verbal references to him as mere Lieutenant are assorted errors, odd Starfleet usage, or informal references to his status as Janeway's trusted lieutenant aka sidekick...
Timo Saloniemi
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