Tasha's big mistake was not stunning her daughter. In the future, that's what the stun setting is for.
I'm not sure Romulan disrupters have a stun setting...
Was AU Tasha Yar Stupid for trying to take Sela?
- Thread starter WesleysDisciple
- Start date
I'm not sure Romulan disrupters have a stun setting...
It's pretty horrible to condemn a beloved character to that sort of ignominious end.
Especially since Tasha Yar was ALREADY a survivor of sexual assault.
Especially since Tasha Yar was ALREADY a survivor of sexual assault.
Do we know that Sela's father was all about having sex with Tasha? Sela said the Romulan officer was enamored with her, perhaps there were feelings involved. In that case it might not have been a physical assault but the Romulan officer wanted a relationship with her? That led to sex and Sela was born.
Was the "relationship" between Tasha and the Romulan general strictly sexual or was there more to it? We don't know. I'm pretty sure Tasha would have liked to be somewhere else but if she had a home and a child, was it almost like family life? Until she tried to escape. But it's true that it was the only way she was allowed to live, a companion to a Romulan general. Some sort of slavery almost?
And he was so nice to her that she didn't mind being his concubine and never being allowed to leave?
Come on! What is this? "Code of Honour"?
It is not "almost" a form of slavery. It IS slavery. She only had the choices of either pleasing him or something horrible happening to her. if she had been free to leave, she wouldn't have had tried to escape.
I was just thinking that was her life that bad on Romulus? At least she was alive.
On the other hand, being a love slave isn't much to live for.
Irrelevant.
Tasha was a prisoner, pure and simple. She had every right to want to get away.
Although I can't entirely blame Sela for crying out, either...she was being yanked from the only life she'd ever known. And was probably too young to understand Tasha's POV.
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I'm not going to pretend to be able to seee every angle of a complicated situation. It's entirely possible that a woman would have ambivalent feelings, even outright hatred, toward a child who is the product of that sexual slavery under the threat of deaht. It's possible that a woman would love the child and see it as innocent. It's possible that Tasha took Sela to rescue her, just as it's possible Tasha took young Sela as a potential bargaining chip that didn't work out. Hell, it's possible that none of what Sela described happened. For all we know 60ish Tasha Yar was still alive on Romulus or somewhere at the time Sela was introduced.
Tasha should have killed Sela.
She had to extract the kid "as is" but they were still looking at years of gruesome reprogramming to straighten the girl out before you don't have to lock her in a cell for the night.
Leaving her behind was unthinkable, but what about giving the child a mercy killing?
She had to extract the kid "as is" but they were still looking at years of gruesome reprogramming to straighten the girl out before you don't have to lock her in a cell for the night.
Leaving her behind was unthinkable, but what about giving the child a mercy killing?
I don't think Tasha Yarr had Stockholm Syndrome but was probably good enough to keep herself as well as her crew alive. Star Trek Online actually followed up this rather hideous mess by showing her and the other Enterprise survivors transplanted to a prison colony. Denise Crosby gave her own written version of how she viewed her imprisonment, Sela, and other subjects.
That would be an honor killing. "She'll be fine here but she doesn't fit my morality."
That would be an honor killing. "She'll be fine here but she doesn't fit my morality."
The Romulan officer may not have forced himself on Tasha physically but coercing her to give consent is still rape. Since we don't know what happened to the rest of the survivors we don't know if the Romulans upheld the deal or not, maybe they were kept alive and forced into hard labour, or interrogated for every piece of information they could possibly have to offer, maybe they were all put to death after Tasha's failed escape attempt, or maybe they're all still alive somewhere on Romulus or Remus by the time of the 2360s. The fact remains Tasha had an impossible choice and though she didn't know the E-C crew (other than Castillo), she sacrificed her body to save the survivors--that isn't the same as giving free and unimpeded consent.
What if.... Tasha was on some level grateful to the Romulan officer for saving her life, then Stockholm syndrome kicks in and she develops (strong) feelings for him. For a time she doesn't even want to leave? In that case would sex be consensual? Then she gives birth to Sela and wants to get the baby away from Romulus?
I Dont disagree with the statement that the situation was essentially rape.
am curious though I got the impression from selas outrage at her mother that she was trying to hide from feelings of guilt.
And only by villifying her mother could she be safe from them.
am curious though I got the impression from selas outrage at her mother that she was trying to hide from feelings of guilt.
And only by villifying her mother could she be safe from them.
This. As Picard said, human parents are prepared to die for their children.
No. Because she's still a prisoner dependent on him for her life. Same with a vampire and mind-control for a silly non-real world example.
Romulans would have access to plentiful contraception, and rape is a crime. Prisoners can't legally give consent. Its statutory rape, even if the prisoner insists that they did give consent. The Romulan legal system would throw any Romulan making whoopy with a prisoner into a different jail.
Tasha would have to have been "freed", and become a Romulan Citizen, for Sela to have not been evidence in a trial that led to her daddy's complete and total ruin.
If that's true, then she was legally allowed to go home... Without the kid.
Okay.
One way the daddy wouldn't be in Trouble for statutory rape, is if Tasha Raped the daddy. Not seduced him, out right beat him up, forced him down and took a baby from inside of him.
Even if he's raped, in this situation, ironically the Romulan commandant is still guilty of statutory rape.
Why would Tasha do this?
1. Tradition. It's just how she was raised.
2. Power. As mother to his child, it's likely that Tasha would get a lot more amenities than a windowless cell and gruel.
Tasha would have to have been "freed", and become a Romulan Citizen, for Sela to have not been evidence in a trial that led to her daddy's complete and total ruin.
If that's true, then she was legally allowed to go home... Without the kid.
Okay.
One way the daddy wouldn't be in Trouble for statutory rape, is if Tasha Raped the daddy. Not seduced him, out right beat him up, forced him down and took a baby from inside of him.
Even if he's raped, in this situation, ironically the Romulan commandant is still guilty of statutory rape.
Why would Tasha do this?
1. Tradition. It's just how she was raised.
2. Power. As mother to his child, it's likely that Tasha would get a lot more amenities than a windowless cell and gruel.
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Dont forget the old Testament EXPLICITLY Allows forcing a woman captured in battle into a marriage...
You don't seriously believe the Romulan courts would be on Tasha's side, do you?
I mean, the mere fact that Sela's father Volskiar is a Romulan would be enough. He gets all the rights, and Tasha (as a human prisoner) has none. And of course since Volskiar is a respected General in the Romulan military, that would stack the deck even more in his favor.
So therefore, under the Romulan legal system, Volskiar can do anything he wants to Tasha without fear of consequences. These ARE Romulans, after all; on their world, prisoners (of any species) have absolutely no rights whatsoever.
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Whatever type of corruption may be at work, the Romulan legal system probably started off identical to the Vulcan legal system, and they are the virtuous goodies.
I'm convinced this situation is what led to the Romulans cloning Picard. I think Yar wasn't just given a choice but they basically brainwashed her and she told them about Picard and the future stuff and her life with the Romulan on the outside did look happy to young Sela but eventually the programing wore off and she tried to escape so young Sela saw her trying to ruin their happy family lives. Which was no doubt one of wealth as well because your not talking about them being poor. Which is something that likely also helped Sela achieve high in that society despite being half-human.
Jason
Jason
Oh, I doubt that very much.
Remember, the Romulans began as a group of Vulcans who rejected Surak and his philosphy of emotional control. Romulus was colonized by ex-Vulcans who were every bit as savage and brutal as the Vulcans of old. So it stands to reason that whatever legal system evolved on Romulus would bear little resemblance to present day Vulcan.
Vulcan, being a member of the Federation, would naturally abide by Federation law regarding the humane treatment of prisoners. Romulus would have no such protection. Hell, prisoners on Romulus are probabyl no better off than they would be on, say, Cardassia...
Rejected Surak?
Why would pacifists have atomic weapons?
In the Savage Curtain, that version of Surak said that he sent peace emissaries to the several factions in the ongoing war to stress the need for peace, who were murdered dead.
So?
Saurak's People did nothing.
They didn't fight, they didn't nuke, and they didn't leave.
I think we are dealing with some serious revisionist history.
The Romulans fought other Romulans until they frakked the planet.
The planet became uninhabitable (for 5 billion people) so billions of surviving Romulans went out looking for a new homeworld.
They saw no value in taking a bunch of useless hippies with them.
The tiny cult thrived.
17 hundred years later, that cult met Zephram Chocrane.
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