ST Continues "To Boldly Go": A Fan Edit

[STEPhon IT]

^Saavik and David travelling space with Kirk, Spock and McCoy was as unlikely as Marvel Comics aquiring DC Comics, or vice versa (for one, Merrick Butterick didn't want to play David Marcus forever, for two, most likely Robin Curtis also didn't want to play Saavik forever, so that shoots down your whole idea right there.) Nobody at Paramount was ever going to not have the rest of the crew there for the movies, as cool and amazing as you or others like you wanted this to happen (and what you just mentioned is only going to happen with the Kelvinverse characters, in particular Chekov not coming back in a future movie due to the untimely passing of Anton Yelchin.)

Shaka Zulu, I was born 6 years after the release of The Undiscovered Country, I started watching Star Trek with my Dad and my older brother in the early 2000's. After bearing through the very underwhelming The Search for Spock, I knew my expectations were gone. Saavik was different and not the same character or motivations and David spared that Saavik and was killed. Glad in TVH the crew dumped her right on Vulcan.

 

[Matthew Raymond]

STC had a ''writer's room''?

I was speaking metaphorically. I'm sure there was a kitchen table or a private Facebook group or something.

Then again, looking at IMDB, Vic has a writing or story credit on all but one episode ("Still Treads the Shadow", written by Judi Burns). Perhaps it wasn't so much a writers' room as Vic's desk and a couple of chairs.

However like most other amateur productions they fell prey to established characters acting out-of-character, lapses in story logic, excessive fanwankery and lack of true danger in their storylines.

While I do think that, for STC in particular, the writing was the biggest issue, you have to consider that fan films in general have an uphill climb in that they're trying to recreate elements artificially that came naturally from the talent and character of the actors and writers of the original show. Trying to create someone else's lightning in a bottle can be far more difficult than creating your own.

Glad in TVH the crew dumped her right on Vulcan.

Well, then we got Lt. Valeris in Undiscovered Country instead of Saavik, which meant we were supposed to care about some total stranger's betrayal instead of an established character, which I don't think worked as well.

 

[STEPhon IT]

STC is not a failure, despite the lack of story narration in their projects, it successfully raised money for their projects, completed 11 movies and came out on time. It was a well produced production and had a solid crew to accomplish them, it just shows when you pay professionals to work on a fanfilm series a lot can be accomplished.

 

[albion432]

STC hit one out of the ballpark, writing wise, with their first episode. I enjoy the series as a whole immensely. I did not care for the White Iris or the civil war episode.

We all have our favorites and least favorites, sometimes they overlap and sometimes they don't. While "Pilgrim of Eternity" nor "The White Iris" fits in neither category for me, "Divided We Stand" is perhaps my least favorite, right down there with "Embarrassing The Winds." I find both overbearing beyond the point of annoyance and bordering on anger. At the top of my list would have to be the aptly titled "Fairest of Them All."

The McKenna character was always going to run into Cousin Oliver problems. I think Specht did a good job with it, anyway. I did not like the way they killed her off, but it was a pretty star trek way to do it. I like to think that it would have stayed in Scott's mind and given him an idea one day many years later.

I like the connection you made with "Relics," I wouldn't have thought of it myself. McKenna was a problem, and probably created as a way for Vic to include his wife in the cast. I liked that they wrapped up her character in the end, explaining why we never see her in future Trek and keeping her confined to their production. It's unfortunate that the edit I started this post with has since been made private or removed as it ended on her death, making it, for me at least, much more poignant, to the point of actually being moved by it, something the regular edit, again for me at least, fails to accomplish. As I recall, that edit also removed several annoying and/or borderline unintentionally humorous moments while she's trapped in the transporter beam.

 

[Matthew Raymond]

STC is not a failure, despite the lack of story narration in their projects, it successfully raised money for their projects, completed 11 movies and came out on time. It was a well produced production and had a solid crew to accomplish them, it just shows when you pay professionals to work on a fanfilm series a lot can be accomplished.

I think we'll continue to see fan films get better production values because the cost of cameras and equipment will continue to go down while people find new and innovative ways to stretch a dollar. However, because a lot of people who worked on STC were highly skilled professionals, we likely won't see films of the quality of STC in terms of acting, camera work, lighting, et cetera, because now that productions are prohibited from using professionals, it just can't happen.

Of course, even then, there will be tutorials out there for things, and techniques will get refined, so maybe I'm wrong. Maybe people can teach themselves to make something equally as good as STC. Either way, fan films will make professionals, not the other way around.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Matthew, how cool it could've been if STC retrieved Dorothy Fontana's script for "The Secret of Vulcan Fury" and spent their expensive efforts of something fruitful like that?

 

[Matthew Raymond]

Would it have commercial breaks with ads for Quaker Honey Graham Oh's?

 

[STEPhon IT]

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

 

[Maurice]

Matthew, how cool it could've been if STC retrieved Dorothy Fontana's script for "The Secret of Vulcan Fury" and spent their expensive efforts of something fruitful like that?

Good luck anyone finding it. It's been presumed lost for decades.

 

[Timewalker]

Chris Pine equals Shatner in his portrayal of Kirk, but then again, he's a professional actor like Shatner.

In three movies, he never gave me any other impression than "Captain Frat Boy."

The actors in the fan films might not have been perfect, but I liked them a lot more than Pine (has to do with portraying Kirk as an adult, not a cocky, obnoxious kid).

The way I see it, fan films are like amateur theater, and should be regarded that way.

There are times when amateur theatre can pull off a production every bit as good, or better, than the pros.

I thought one of the biggest mistakes of the movies were having those supporting actors around when they should've wrote them off after TWOK.

So... Kirk should have broken McCoy out of custody all by himself, operated the starship all by himself, and assuming David wasn't killed in TSFS, trusted him not to screw up in 20th-century Earth society?

I don't think so. And we'd have been saddled with a cardboard cutout version of Saavik with less personality than a section of drying paint on a wall.

...most likely Robin Curtis also didn't want to play Saavik forever...

Mutual. I couldn't stand her.

 

[STEPhon IT]

So... Kirk should have broken McCoy out of custody all by himself, operated the starship all by himself, and assuming David wasn't killed in TSFS, trusted him not to screw up in 20th-century Earth society?

I don't think so. And we'd have been saddled with a cardboard cutout version of Saavik with less personality than a section of drying paint on a wall.

I completely hate TSFS, and the whole execution of the movie I thought it was weak. I thought the sub-plot with McCoy was bland, and I didn't care what involvement Scotty, Sulu, Chekov, and Uhura did. That movie should've been something far more interesting than what it was.

 

[Timewalker]

I completely hate TSFS, and the whole execution of the movie I thought it was weak. I thought the sub-plot with McCoy was bland, and I didn't care what involvement Scotty, Sulu, Chekov, and Uhura did. That movie should've been something far more interesting than what it was.

I agree with most of your assessment. I did like that Scotty, Sulu, Chekov, and Uhura each got a couple of scenes in which to shine. What a shame you don't seem to appreciate that. I guess it makes more sense that Kirk can pull off a jailbreak, steal a starship, pilot a starship, and do everything himself, with absolutely no help from anyone.

 

[STEPhon IT]

I'd rather Kirk not pull off a jailbreak, or steal the Enterprise but be looked upon as a valid starfleet officer who has served the military with shining honors, colorful decorations of valor. His colleague - the Black Fleet Admiral - don't trust Kirk's instincts or his many years of experience. This was not some Captain who lost his way, this was Admiral James T. Kirk who toppled a serious super villain who wanted to threaten space with a world destroying weapon. That enough should grant him the Enterprise, for full repairs and do what's necessary... with a crew. Scotty, Chekov and the bunch can move on, get their well deserved promotions and closed the book. Bad plot, incoherent story, a very retarded villain, bizarre executions, that movie was so stupid that it was beyond logical sense.

 

[fireproof78]

Not that this is the thread for this, but Admiral Morrow's concerns were for Starfleet and continued tensions with the Klingons, while Kirk seemed rather personally focused. I don't see it is Admiral Morrow thinking Kirk "lost his way" but that Kirk was failing to see the larger picture.

Kirk's reputation doesn't supersede larger political concerns.

 

[STEPhon IT]

I don't care. I didn't like the movie or the intentions and whatever you say will not change my mind at all.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't care. I didn't like the movie or the intentions and whatever you say will not change my mind at all.

Of course.

 

[Timewalker]

I don't care. I didn't like the movie or the intentions and whatever you say will not change my mind at all.

Nobody said you had to like it. But grant the rest of us the right to like some of the second-tier characters getting a chance to have special scenes that show them as intelligent and competent officers, rather than that abomination that was STV.

 

[fireproof78]

Nobody said you had to like it. But grant the rest of us the right to like some of the second-tier characters getting a chance to have special scenes that show them as intelligent and competent officers, rather than that abomination that was STV.

Indeed. It's OK to like or dislike a film/series/short/etc. I like ST 09 and think its great. Others think it is an abomination before the lord Gene Roddenberry.

So, yes, grant me the right to enjoy such films.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Nobody said you had to like it. But grant the rest of us the right to like some of the second-tier characters getting a chance to have special scenes that show them as intelligent and competent officers, rather than that abomination that was STV.

The comment I made was directly at fireproof78, and not about our discussion.

As for our discussion, I thought Scotty, and the bunch were not passed their prime at all but I felt they were too old to be subordinates to Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. Of course you can like them, as well as I do, I'm expressing what I saw after the movie's initial release. I agree TFF did not show them in a good light as well and I thought TVH like wise TWOK was a nice jumping off point to give those "second-tier" characters their final bow and to move on. What was given in TFF would've been appropriate for a young, new brass of Starfleet actors/ characters. VI did of course gave the actors their due, with the exception of Takei who should've had more or equal screen time. For the character of Sulu and Scotty, I thought the rank was appropriate, but I wish the rest were given a promotion or at least there a hint they would have something to do after their long and well earned career on board the Enterprise.

 

[fireproof78]

The comment I made was directly at fireproof78, and not about our discussion.

Never once did I argue that you had to like it. That was not the point of my discussion nor do I go in to discussion change minds.