Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x13 - "Such Sweet Sorrow"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Well, if the timeline is reset (by the RA/Michael/Whoever) to bring DSC in line with TOS (so there is no spore drive, no DSC, etc...), then Pike would have never touched the Time Crystal (or Chroniton Crystal for those inclined). So he doesn't have to go on with the (fore)knowledge of Delta Burke Rays.
Not necessarily. I'm now leaning towards the possibility that the Enterprise as a whole travels through time with the Discovery crew onboard in order to fix the timeline. When they get back there is no duplicate Enterprise, but the Discovery crew - since the ship never existed without a Klingon War - have doppelgangers hanging about. Pike, Spock, #1, etc promise to never tell anyone what happened, while the Discovery crew skips off into the future.
For Whom the Bell Tolls.
"... parting, is such sweet sorrow..."
I like that this idea combines a couple of the big theories about what happens over the next 2 episodes.
After Valley aired both my kids (who have yet to see Menagerie) independently asked me, "Pike doesn't end up in that chair, he gets killed in the shootout with Khan, right?"
With that in mind, I'm leaning towards Kurtzman's statement of "alignment with canon" as all of the pieces on the board will eventually fit with TOS (such as Pike in the chair, Spock on Enterprise, everyone in TOS-colored uniforms, etc.), rather than some broadly sweeping timeline reset.
With that in mind, I'm leaning towards Kurtzman's statement of "alignment with canon" as all of the pieces on the board will eventually fit with TOS (such as Pike in the chair, Spock on Enterprise, everyone in TOS-colored uniforms, etc.), rather than some broadly sweeping timeline reset.
I like some of those ideas, but is it really a given that the ship wouldn’t have existed without the war? I thought it was built before the war got underway, along with its sister ship.
Yeah, I agree. That seemed to be broadly what he was suggesting. It makes more sense than some huge reset.
I also think he means alignment in terms of all the characters and events ending ups where and how canon "history" says they are supposed to be. I think it's a fair bet that the updated aesthetics for ships / uniforms / technology will broadly remain, even if they choose to shoe-horn in some sort of "must-exclude-the-AI" rationale for rowing back on all the clever holographic comms and displays that clearly weren't around during TOS (or any of the later incarnations for that matter).
Nevertheless, very much looking forward to seeing how they wrap up this season over the next couple of episodes -- and how it ties into Calypso, because surely it will. Somehow.
I'm going on record saying there will not be any reset. One certainly is not required.
The spore drive will be forced into disuse for some other reason (they break something in the mycellial network that prevents them from using it for travel again, or something like that). Pike does go on with the foreknowledge that something accident will befall him sometime in the future, and needs to live with that knowledge.
Burnham remains Spock's foster sister, but he just never had reason to mention her (like he never mentioned Sybok), or maybe he did mention her, but he simply never had any reason in any of his onscreen dialogue to mention her.
Things look more advanced for the same reason Roddenberry gave the Klingons better makeup in TMP, and then told us that they don't really look any different in-universe because we are to imagine the TOS Klingons always looked like TMP Klingons. His reason being that times change and makeup gets better, so he went with a different look for the Klingons because he could, and to keep up with what the modern viewer in 1979 expected to see, production value-wise.
Using Roddenberry's reasoning, the tech on this show looks different because it's what a 2018-ish viewer expects to see, production value-wise -- but we are all just meant to imagine (just like with Roddenberry's Klingon change) that the tech of the TOS TV era always looked like this.
This. One hundred and ten percent this. One of the main conceits of Trek is that it is based upon contemporary knowledge to imagine a future of present humanity.
I don't think there's going to be any "fix the timeline" business to remove things that some fans don't like about DSC, like design details or the spore drive. It's not going to go BAM and turn into Star Trek Continues.
I *do* suspect the ship will get shot forward in time, maybe to the time of Calypso, and leave the Enterprise behind. Just where the crew ends up in all this, I dunno. But the title makes it seem like we will be saying goodbye to some of the cast tonight.
Ever since I saw this sort of thing suggested in the old Starfleet Technical Manual, I've always thought it's a great way to remain sane about continuity issues. More people should adopt this, and save themselves the cost of antacid.
I *do* suspect the ship will get shot forward in time, maybe to the time of Calypso, and leave the Enterprise behind. Just where the crew ends up in all this, I dunno. But the title makes it seem like we will be saying goodbye to some of the cast tonight.
Ever since I saw this sort of thing suggested in the old Starfleet Technical Manual, I've always thought it's a great way to remain sane about continuity issues. More people should adopt this, and save themselves the cost of antacid.
I think something big is going to happen. Most likely a time jump to the far future. And I believe this jump to be permanent. Maybe we'll meet up with Burnham's mom. I don't think we'll be seeing the Discovery and crew back in the 23rd century.
unheard dialgue a few years later
Kirk "Spock, this is awkward but I was wondering. Is your sister seeing anyone?'
Spock "Do not ever mention my sister again"
McCoy "easy there fella, he was just asking a question"
Spock "you as well"
there. the end to that nagging thing that keeps coming up but yeah, I don't think we'll be revisiting this century for awhile. Could be wrong.
Kirk "Spock, this is awkward but I was wondering. Is your sister seeing anyone?'
Spock "Do not ever mention my sister again"
McCoy "easy there fella, he was just asking a question"
Spock "you as well"
there. the end to that nagging thing that keeps coming up but yeah, I don't think we'll be revisiting this century for awhile. Could be wrong.
Like that would stop Kirk! He would just start pushing harder for that forbidden fruit!
Kirk: Spock, this is awkward, but I was wondering. Is your sister seeing anyone?
McCoy: What are you talking about, Jim? Spock doesn’t have a sister.
Kirk: Yes he does. You know...the one who saved all sentient life about 10 years ago?
Spock: Technically, Captain, Dr. McCoy is correct. I do not have a sister.
McCoy: There. You see?
Spock: I have a foster sister.
McCoy (eyeroll): Oh for the love of...(whispers) damned pointed-eared hobgoblin.
Kirk: But is she seeing someone?
I'm super stoked to be seeing the Enterprise in action alongside Discovery!!!
...also, I know a lot of people are hoping Control doesn't end up being the creation of the Borg. But, does anybody want to place any wagers that in the face of defeat in battle against the Enterprise, the remaining Section 31 ships merge together, pooling their resources, into an interlocking cube-shaped formation?
...also, I know a lot of people are hoping Control doesn't end up being the creation of the Borg. But, does anybody want to place any wagers that in the face of defeat in battle against the Enterprise, the remaining Section 31 ships merge together, pooling their resources, into an interlocking cube-shaped formation?
