• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x11 - "Perpetual Infinity"

Hit it!


  • Total voters
    225
Control becomes so advanced that it outwits all of them?

IMHO Control's tech doesn't seem advanced enough to destroy all non-corporeal races. I mean, we know it has limitations. It can't track down Gabrielle Burnham in the Red Angel suit in its own time. And it doesn't have the ability to time travel at will, even though Gabby does.

Edit: Actually, that suggests something happens to destroy Control only a little bit further into the future. After all, even if it can't defeat her in its present, future Control should have eons to perfect itself and travel back in time to find her. Yet somehow it doesn't.
 
Or the red signals are Control. When Pike took a shuttle into one they immediately got attacked by that probe.
True but it only happened that one time so I do not think Control is behind the red lights it just took the opportunity to plant a saboteur on board.

Whoever it is clearly knows the future and is making sure certain things happen in a certain way, in other words whoever it is has already lived through it as the changes seem to me to be very personal ones, like we saw with Saru and his people.

Its possible it could still be Michaels mom having found some way to survive in the future but I dont think it is as I cant see her sending Discovery to the Kelpien homeworld.

It could be the effects of an altered timeline on reality as it slowly coalesces from many small cumulative changes rather than all at once.

Its definitely something the Preservers would have a hand in, I think we will have a much better idea of who is behind it when we find out where the other red lights will show up, as @eschaton said above there are three more remaining.

That was Michaels moms mistake, if you want something big to change go back further and make small adjustments, her mom was instead going for single big changes which wont work especially if another entity with similar abilities like Control is working against her they just end up cancelling each other out.
 
Why not go back in time and never create Control in the first place? If Control is never created, it can't become the future Control that becomes sentient and wipes out all life. The only problem with that plan is that it might screw up the Federation if the Federation relied on Control for threat assessment of key events. So maybe they could go back and just alter Control in some way rather than not create it?
 
That's one thing we haven't seen yet, the actual moment that Control was created and who did it.
Could that be a key piece of information?
 
I enjoyed this one, after finding the last to be quite frustrating.

Sonja Sohn is great, and Leland is finally interesting!

Me too. Sometimes all disbelief must be suspended, even if it shouldn't make any sense. Best not to overthink things too much with this show.

That tends to be true for any Trek series.

I re-watched The Wounded last week, often hailed as one of TNG's best episodes, and the ending makes no sense at all. Wrath of Khan has giant plot holes, and it's treated by many fans as if it's Citizen Kane. It can be fun to debate these things, but they don't bother me.
 
I think Control will become aware that it needs an organic component, and that it can only works when they are operating as one unified mind... I think that in the final episode, control takes lt Nilsson thousands of years in the past to the Delta Quadrant, and make her the first Borg Queen...
 
Just about the only Trek Trope we haven't seen in DISCOVERY so far, is a God-like Being.

Perhaps in Season-3?
:biggrin:
b7Msy8C.gif
 
So Michael's mother basically saved the 21st century humans from WWIII Indiana just to prove to herself that time wasn't immutable and things could indeed be changed? Not as noble an act as I really envisioned, but...okay, then.

At least she had a strong in-universe motivation to abduct them to Terralysia.
 
They didn't. Someone transported back to the Section 31 ship, which is heavily implied to be "Leland." The Section 31 ship then escaped. Thus Control is still at large.
Oh, OK I missed that.
I really don't see how Control has anything to do with the Borg, it's capabilities and motivation is totally different from the Borg.
I would think if it was going to be the origin of the Borg there would be at least a few more similarities, like at least hints of interest in creating a hive mind, or ranting about perfection or something.
 
Why not go back in time and never create Control in the first place? If Control is never created, it can't become the future Control that becomes sentient and wipes out all life. The only problem with that plan is that it might screw up the Federation if the Federation relied on Control for threat assessment of key events. So maybe they could go back and just alter Control in some way rather than not create it?
Too many knock on effects if they go back that far and make such a fundamental change.

Although I must say it would not surprise me but it would mean the resulting changes would be very far reaching.

Anything is possible at this point, in the original timeline the war with the Klingons never happened so that could be undone, it all depends on just how big a reset we are talking about and exactly where the change is made in the timeline.

You have to be careful when messing with time as you can very easily erase yourself if you are not protected from the knock on effects, presumably the suit is also able to do that.

Its interesting to note that the Discovery is found roughly 1000 years into the future which is the exact same time range that Michaels mom and the suit were returned to, I do not think that is a coincidence.

I can understand why some really do not want a big reset but its looking like a real possibility now with the potential for the Klingon war itself to be undone, Michael would definitely attempt that if she got to wear the suit.
 
Well that was quite a mixed bag. I loved a lot of the character interactions. Dr Burnham and Georgeau, Spock and Michael. I think Sonja Sohn is fantastic, and how the whole Control plot has me very engaged.

But... the show needs a science advisor. There have been a few instances this season where they take real scientific concepts and miss-apply them. The Newtons third law bit in this episode really broke my immersion, which was a real shame, because there was a lot to like here otherwise.
 
"Hey, chin up. I know the night just got darker. But it won't last forever." I felt it appropriate to start with this quote from Fallout 4, and we're thematically at a similar point in this season to where this quote was said in the game. During the data-upload sequence I was feeling a gradually building sense of dread and I knew this was going to be a big win for Control in the end. 54% is terrifying, no matter how we put it.

I wasn't even halfway through the episode where I already rated it 10 and I don't see any reason to retract it. It was dramatic, emotional and tense all the way through, and I've even felt glee when they were theorizing how to stop Control, because so many things were brought in as potential elements to their plan that I've thought about using (sending the Sphere's data to the future, using dark matter, etc). Not to mention a bit of pride when at least one bullet point of my theory came kind-of true about Dr. Burnham intentionally putting the Sphere in Discovery's path. My thoughts were racing with new theories and possibilities the whole time and it'll take quite a while to sort everything through.

I had no problems with the probably intentional parallels between Control and the Borg. It might already have access to the NX-01's databanks so it's possible it already knows about them, even if it didn't learn their name. It doesn't necessarily have to be a Borg origin story. Even before acquiring more than half of the Sphere's data, it was becoming smarter and more dangerous with every second, as was shown by his decision not to push Tyler too hard when he began suspecting something was up. Its chilling description of Leland's habit of moral compartmentalization reminded me of Nineteen Eighty-Four, specifically Double-Think. I found the parallels between the Inner Party and Section 31 frighteningly appropriate.

The last scene with Burnham and her mother was absolutely beautiful. I'm convinced I had something in my eye as she started to recount how she's seen the important moments of Burnham's life despite her hostility before. Now that she's seemingly gone, I wonder if the red bursts are caused by someone who takes her place 1000 years in the future. But now I think one thing's for sure: the Prime Timeline is the one where Control's eventual victory is averted. To erase everything Dr. Burnham has done would inevitably lead to Control destroying sentient life. So I think in the 'final', 'correct' timeline, Burnham will have survived into adulthood.

Observations:
  • OMG, Saru just namedropped the Bibliotheca Corviniana! Finally, my country gets recognized in international media for things other than goulash, Béla Lugosi and right-wing populism.
  • Count on Spock to use the native pronounciation for Lǎozǐ. I loved that bit.
  • "Struggle is pointless." - it's almost like they wanted to make a parallel to the Borg but they didn't want it to be too obvious so they took a thesaurus to it. I honestly found it funny.
  • Poor Tilly... I can't help but love how Saru doesn't even bother to tell her to shut up anymore and just goes back to the subject without a word. Other than this however, she's steadily retreating into Mandatory Line Mayweather territory and I definitely don't like this development.
 
Last edited:
I can understand why some really do not want a big reset but its looking like a real possibility now with the potential for the Klingon war itself to be undone, Michael would definitely attempt that if she got to wear the suit.

Again I should note my frustration, considering the Spore Drive itself is also a time machine, more or less, meaning they could have undone the Klingon War last season.
 
I've enjoyed Discovery so far but the logic behind this season confuses me. The Temporal Cold War was one of the least liked stories of the last Star Trek show. So the showrunners decide to have a new time travel war as a major storyline in Discovery?

It's not... logical... :vulcan:
 
This is one freaking fantastic story, I'm gonna have to binge the entire second season the day after episode 14 premiers!
:techman:
that's probably a good idea - tried to watch thisone while working :thumbdown: a really bad idea
 
Last edited:
Again I should note my frustration, considering the Spore Drive itself is also a time machine, more or less, meaning they could have undone the Klingon War last season.
Or Kirk could have saved his son...time travel.
I've enjoyed Discovery so far but the logic behind this season confuses me. The Temporal Cold War was one of the least liked stories of the last Star Trek show. So the showrunners decide to have a new time travel war as a major storyline in Discovery?

It's not... logical... :vulcan:
Whoever said the human race was logical?
 
I've enjoyed Discovery so far but the logic behind this season confuses me. The Temporal Cold War was one of the least liked stories of the last Star Trek show. So the showrunners decide to have a new time travel war as a major storyline in Discovery?

It's not... logical... :vulcan:
Overall, it wasn't the actual Temporal Time War that was the problem, it was the way it was eventually handled that became the issue.
(Nazi's invading the USA and so forth)
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top