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Spoilers The Flash - Season 4

I wonder if Barry will zip in and out of the prison at super speed to still be the flash or if he really will leave the flash alone for a couple episodes until he gets out. If the Flash suddenly stops showing up when Barry goes to prison, it will look very suspicious. Of course, characters never seem to make the obvious connection. Heck, Supergirl just did an episode where Supergirl was incapacitated and they had to fake sick-Kara to explain Kara's absence from work. I wonder how Team Flash will explain the Flash's sudden disappearance. But again, maybe Barry will only be in prison for 1-2 episodes so the disappearance won't be long enough for anyone to notice?
 
It would have been nice if Barry's line about expecting to be cleared had included the phrase: "Just like my father was.".
 
like Jay? Hard to imagine the writers missing the opportunity to show Jay visiting Barry in prison. The reverse imagery of Barry visiting Henry.

it would be cool..but wasn't Earth 1 Henry declared dead (i.e. gotten a death certificate)? It would be way too suspicious/impossibe for him to visit.. especially since Henry was locked up there.

But if he's that honest that he won't lie about his secret identity under oath, then he wouldn't pull a fraud like that off in court either. It's an even bigger and more elaborate lie.

I would agree...and way too dangerous if it failed. And since the Thinker is free and walking, he could easily sabotage that (like they did with the photo evidence)

Was Barry's help really necessary to contain Fallout's meltdown? I thought all that was needed was for Cisco to breach him into a different Earth, which was exactly what he did.

I admired Ralph Dibney for dissuading Joe from planting evidence into Marlize's house. He really has come a long way from being a shady private detective to a crimefighting team member.
Yeah, that was definitely a great moment..where he is teaching from experience. Glad Joe listened.
The sentencing scene was nicely done while Captain Singh was simultaneously giving an accolade to the Flash for having saved the city from certain nuclear destruction.
Yeah..that was well done.


All I can say is that Cecile is the worst defense lawyer since John Gibbons in My Cousin Vinny. They really did a disservice to the character. And Barry couldn't have been more stupid with his defense. Yes I get that Joe is dating Cecile, but maybe with your life on the line, it might make sense to hire a better lawyer.

I now there is lawyer-client privilige..but can they really trust the Team Flash identities with an outsider? And since this is TV court trials, they had a couple of days to prepare...so i think it just made sense. Cecille knew all of the background, so she could see what they could and could not do...and Barry has some sense of ethics, so he thought it better to not call Saul.

It would have been nice if Barry's line about expecting to be cleared had included the phrase: "Just like my father was.".

well, we got something similar by the writing in his cell.
 
I thought Henry's writing in the cell was a little too on-the-nose.

It was pretty stupid of Joe to consider breaking into the DeVoe house, since they'd already used hidden cameras there to implicate Barry.

It strikes me that Barry could have just revealed his identity to the judge in closed chambers...then he could have told the whole story and maybe the judge could have declared a mistrial.
 
I thought the same thing, but it would have been ex-parte (because Brad Chase couldn't attend such a meeting).

I suppose they could have brought the prosecutor into the secret too, but they seemed to be playing the "untrustworthy" vibe a bit too much for such a scenario.
 
The one smart thing about Barry not revealing his identity, though not acknowledged on the show, is that if he had and it had backfired, they'd have been putting him in a meta cell. As it is, he can can out whenever he needs to.
 
It's all but been confirmed that Kid Flash is going to be joining Legends. I am guessing Ralph Dibny/Elongated Man is joining him. I believe it was one of the CW executives who said hat Firestorm's leave created two open seats on the Waverider. Replacing both Martin and Jax.

Elongated Man's intro this season is very similar to how the Atom was setup on Arrow and Firestorm on The Flash before Legends was created. His powers and personality would fit the humorous tone of that show.
 
Just had a thought, and this is not a spoiler, because this is really just me thinking of it.

If Ralph can distort his body, then wouldn't he be able to change his appearance so he looks exactly like Barry? And if he does that, couldn't he sneak into Barry's cell and replace him if The Flash is needed?
 
Holy contrived trial, Batman! :eek:

I liked the Speedforce scene, and the Joe/Ralph talk, but that trial just murdered any suspension of disbelief dead. How did they manage to make the "grounded" part of the show way more ridiculous than the meta of the week, the glowstick factory accident guy?

I'm not really versed in judicial proceedings, I've never even watched any of the bajillion courtroom TV shows apart from an episode here or there, but I could have come up with a better defense for Barry than the "best lawyer in Central City" did.

I mean, he was convicted for murder one, that's premeditated murder, right? An expert CSI expertly and deviously plans a murder that somehow has all evidence pointing to him? How hard is it to introduce reasonable doubt to at least that, and then work from there? :shrug:
 
No -- Harry said that dropping Fallout into a breach would trigger an explosion before he could pass through, so they couldn't send him to another Earth. All Vibe did was to open a breach in the sky overhead to allow the energy/radiation to pass through to the vacant Earth-15 once the Flash channeled it upward with the vacuum (and there is nothing about that sentence that makes physical sense, but whatever). Once Fallout's energy burst was spent, he was still there in Central City, and there was a line later about him being taken into custody, presumably in Iron Heights' meta wing with his powers damped.

You're right. I had forgotten that Barry redirected all the radiation from Fallout into the breach, though I wasn't clear on why Cisco couldn't simply breach Fallout to a deserted island or some other remote place. Makes sense now.
 
I mean, he was convicted for murder one, that's premeditated murder, right? An expert CSI expertly and deviously plans a murder that somehow has all evidence pointing to him? How hard is it to introduce reasonable doubt to at least that, and then work from there? :shrug:
This was my exact thought as well.

BerlantiCo. really needs to hire some legal consultants. This wasn't the first time (Moira) that they completely butchered the court.

*And really, this is just another example of why the "Don't write villains who are way smarter than you are rule" exists, because the whole conceit was that it was such a perfect frame-up or whatever.
 
BerlantiCo. really needs to hire some legal consultants. This wasn't the first time (Moira) that they completely butchered the court.

To be fair, that's pretty commonplace in TV, even in shows about lawyers. The trial of the Punisher in Daredevil season 2 made a mockery of legal procedure even worse than this episode did.

But really, if SF and superhero TV is willing to use nonsense physics on a regular basis, why should they do any better with the law?
 
By definition, science fiction is allowed to take liberty in science. If that liberty is extended to anything, then the story loses all structural credibility.
 
By definition, science fiction is allowed to take liberty in science. If that liberty is extended to anything, then the story loses all structural credibility.

No, that's absolutely not how it works. There's a huge, huge difference between engaging in plausible and informed extrapolation from known science -- the kind of hard science fiction I write -- and just making up random gibberish that would flunk a 3rd-grade science test. Science fiction is not a license to be lazy or ignorant. It demands more research from the writer, not less, because the audience is savvy enough to recognize the mistakes.

Taking liberty the right way is to propose something unreal but to keep everything around it as plausible and accurate as possible -- for instance, propose an impossibility like faster-than-light drive but otherwise apply accurate physics to calculate how things would realistically behave if that one thing were possible, or depict an irregular courtroom procedure but work with legal consultants to find an argument or precedent that just might make it remotely possible that a judge would okay it. There are ways to fudge things intelligently, so that an informed audience knows you're doing it by choice rather than out of ignorance or laziness. Taking liberty the wrong way is just not bothering to do your homework and getting things wrong because you just don't know or care what you're doing. The two could not be more profoundly different. There's a difference between, say, a movie that's set in Paris and takes care to research its geography and architecture and culture but takes the liberty of postulating that there's actually a secret spy headquarters right under the Eiffel Tower, and a movie that's set in Paris but claims it's the capital of India and is across the Thames from Mt. Kilimanjaro. A lot of the nonsense in supposedly science-fiction TV shows and movies falls into the latter category, and it is not the same thing as the liberties taken by an intelligent and well-researched work. The former is The Martian making Mars windstorms a lot more powerful and noisy than they really are for dramatic effect while otherwise getting almost everything right; the latter is Total Recall having people's faces blow up in the Martian atmosphere and claiming the planet has a core made of ice. Huge, huge difference.

All fiction is about bending reality, making things work differently than they do in real life -- more dramatically, more linearly, more consistently, more dangerously, whatever. But what matters is how effectively you sell the illusion. If you're lazy and just don't bother to make it make sense, then any savvy audience member will see through it. If you do your due diligence, research the things you need to research, and make your departures from reality as minimal and as convincing as you can, then even audience members who do see the artifice will still understand that you know what you're doing.

And the science fiction audience is generally a lot sharper and harder to fool than a lay audience. Hal Clement liked to say that writing hard SF is a competition between the writer trying to convince the readers an unreal idea is plausible and the readers trying to spot the flaws in the illusion. So you have to know your stuff -- make as few departures from reality as you can, and make them sound credible enough that the audience is willing to believe they might just be possible.
 
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