• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Spoilers Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Grading & Discussion

Grade the movie.


  • Total voters
    290
Rotten Tomatoes gave the Ghostbusters reboot a 74% score. That was in total contrast to the public's views, so it suggests that the RT rating was so wildly out of the step of reality that it suggests the score was based on other motivations, and not some genuine view of quality. That might not be isolated to the Ghostbusters disaster.

The average critic score on RT was 6.5. Which aligns pretty well with nearly every other way of measuring the ‘public consensus’ on the movie. (For eg. The average audience rating on the same site is 6.2.)

And of course, I was on these boards when that movie came out. I do remember certain voting idiots-of-the-public trying very hard to convince others:

(1) That a 1/10 score was totally objective.
(2) So objective, that those votes were popping up before the public release.
(3) But they were still logical, ya see. Because people were taking a stand against remakes. That it was this remake (and not say, the frigging remake of Ben-Hur) which sparked such a ‘stand’ is a total coincidence.
(4) And all that being said, everyone should rip it to shreds and not to see it as ‘the movie is sexist against men, because they’re all presented as villainous idiots!’​

The last being a blatant lie, btw.

Funny how one ‘agenda’ supposably needs to be taken into account, but not others.
 
Last edited:
I'm not liking the spoilers I've read but that means nothing really. I can dislike things that happen in a movie but still enjoy the film. There's a lot more to making a good movie than just the events. It's how they are done that really matters. I didn't like Han Solo dying but the way it was done in the movie was really good. I was sad to see him go but it was well executed.
I can dislike the outcome of a sporting event but still appreciate the game itself.
 
Last edited:
It's still kind of amazing to me that, even now, it's impossible for some people to comprehend that their expectations regarding Rey were never going to be met, to the point that I've seen talk that Abrams had made her a legacy character only to have Rian change things. I don't know what's more sad, not accepting that Rey was never anything other than some "random scavenger girl" from Jakku with off-the-charts Force abilities or trying to rationalize that denial by saying that she might've been a legacy character at one point only to have that status changed.
 
You know, I was wondering why you linked to the reddit thread and not the actual review.

Then I read it.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/12/12/entertainment/star-wars-the-last-jedi-review/index.html

In summation: they didn’t find it bad. They certainly didn’t seem angry, although it’s possible overexposure to the rage of Internet manchildren means I now grade that sort of thing on a curve.

They just said it had some great moments, there’s some enjoyable revelations. the returning characters are still engaging, and it sets up some fantastic hooks for VIII. But it suffers from the usual bout of middle-of-the-trilogyitis, and wasn’t as satisfying as TFA.

Hence, ‘disappointing’ and ‘more AOTC than ESB.’

I’m more concerned that some of their critiques mirror my major issues with R1, Although I was in the minority on that one, and - as their final line points out - no SW film has ever been flawless.

PS: Dude, what do you hope to achieve by ‘proving’ there’s people that didn’t like the movie? Even if literally everyone in the world loathes this thing, all you did was pick a 1/2 guess.

PPS: Also, what happened to ‘don’t pay too much attention to commercial critics, they have incentives to be positive?’ Is CNN no longer on the fake news list? Have twitter and reddit lied to me?!
 
Last edited:
You know, I was wondering why you linked to the reddit thread and not the actual review.

Then I read it.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/12/12/entertainment/star-wars-the-last-jedi-review/index.html

In summation: they didn’t find it bad. They certainly didn’t seem angry, although it’s possible overexposure to the rage of Internet manchildren means I now grade that sort of thing on a curve.

They just said it had some great moments, there’s some enjoyable revelations. the returning characters are still engaging, and it sets up some fantastic hooks for VIII. But it suffers from the usual bout of middle-of-the-trilogyitis, and wasn’t as satisfying as TFA.

Hence, ‘disappointing’ and ‘more AOTC than ESB.’

I’m more concerned that some of their critiques mirror my major issues with R1, Although I was in the minority on that one, and - as their final line points out - no SW film has ever been flawless.

PS: Dude, what do you hope to achieve by ‘proving’ there’s people that didn’t like the movie? Even if literally everyone in the world loathes this thing, all you did was pick a 1/2 guess.

PPS: Also, what happened to ‘don’t pay too much attention to commercial critics, they have incentives to be positive?’ Is CNN no longer on the fake news list? Have twitter and reddit lied to me?!

The point is there's both sides..it's gonna be up to you to decide whether you like it or not. I don't care who likes it or not. But with others saying only positive reviews exist and how can you say you don't like it, you're in the minority, well I just like to challenge that, so I gave some examples. I love how people try to break everything down to, how can you say not to take critics fairly, there are other considerations, then here's a article by CNN and what aren't they fake news anymore. Nice try..it's not as simple as all that. Every review or commentator has their own biases and experiences. Some legit, and some maybe influenced by other factors. It's called an opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own, unless you subscribe to group think. To boil it down to this proves this, or that in simplistic terms is disingenuous.
 
You seem hell bent on trashing this movie without having seen it.

Much like you posted to The Box Office thread with the sole contribution of: 'I'm not a fan of Disney Star Wars'
No, I think there are good points in the movie, why are you so intent on defending it? Why does it matter if some other fan doesn't like it..? Is that important or discussing the movie, why and how it was good or bad more important? I've seen 40 mins. Of the movie in clips so far. The ones I've seen are all in pivotal spots. From that and the synopsis, I made up my mind. I don't like the story. I think Finn did a good job. I think Kylo and Rey suck, and I'm upset they killed Luke. Force projection? Really? And the movie didn't feel like a star wars movie from other reports. Overall, there's enough data to make a good guess..I'm not gonna like it. I can't for the life of me understand why some fanboys have to be so Damn defensive of everything to go all out to try to verbally twist themselves into a triggered mess of berating gotcha statements to make themselves feel good. Condescension and snark seem to be the best use of intelligence regarding your responses. So what if I don't like the story behind the movie. Whether I've seen it or just 40mins. What is the difference if I bought a ticket and walked in and out at key spots? It would be the same feeling regardless. The scenes haven't changed. Luke's death hasn't changed..so like I said, I'm not a fan. Let people have their opinions, and let's debate the merits of the story, not the motivations someone has about it.
 
No, I think there are good points in the movie, why are you so intent on defending it? Why does it matter if some other fan doesn't like it..? Is that important or discussing the movie, why and how it was good or bad more important? I've seen 40 mins. Of the movie in clips so far. The ones I've seen are all in pivotal spots. From that and the synopsis, I made up my mind. I don't like the story. I think Finn did a good job. I think Kylo and Rey suck, and I'm upset they killed Luke. Force projection? Really? And the movie didn't feel like a star wars movie from other reports. Overall, there's enough data to make a good guess..I'm not gonna like it. I can't for the life of me understand why some fanboys have to be so Damn defensive of everything to go all out to try to verbally twist themselves into a triggered mess of berating gotcha statements to make themselves feel good. Condescension and snark seem to be the best use of intelligence regarding your responses. So what if I don't like the story behind the movie. Whether I've seen it or just 40mins. What is the difference if I bought a ticket and walked in and out at key spots? It would be the same feeling regardless. The scenes haven't changed. Luke's death hasn't changed..so like I said, I'm not a fan. Let people have their opinions, and let's debate the merits of the story, not the motivations someone has about it.

I'm not defending it. I haven't seen it.

Oh and thanks for using the spoiler tag there. Jesus. I know it says 'Spoilers' at the top of the thread but couldn't you have been a little more considerate, you know, like other posters have? You've just ruined it for me, and I suspect a few other people on here.
 
It's called an opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own, unless you subscribe to group think. To boil it down to this proves this, or that in simplistic terms is disingenuous.

YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE MOVIE. You CHOSE to watch these scenes out of context and now have a bias against how they may play out because you don't like things that happen. You rated a film without seeing it. You're absolutely entitled to your opinion but damn, WATCH THE MOVIE FIRST!!!
 
It's funny, I was just looking through old posts on The Cantina. Apparently I posted something right before TFA came out about not letting people's opinions sway your own. That seeing something through someone else's lens, particularly when they're negative, is not a good world view to have. I think this is even more important to remember now.
 
Getting back to talking about Rey, going the direction they have - which, again, was confirmed well over a year ago for anyone who didn't insist on "living in Egypt" - means that we get both an "outsider's perspective" AND a focus on the Skywalkers in a way that we haven't before and broadens the Star Wars universe and Canon in ways that we haven't seen in film before, which is good for storytelling overall.
 
No, I think there are good points in the movie, why are you so intent on defending it? Why does it matter if some other fan doesn't like it..? Is that important or discussing the movie, why and how it was good or bad more important? I've seen 40 mins. Of the movie in clips so far. The ones I've seen are all in pivotal spots. From that and the synopsis, I made up my mind. I don't like the story. I think Finn did a good job. I think Kylo and Rey suck, and I'm upset they killed Luke. Force projection? Really? And the movie didn't feel like a star wars movie from other reports. Overall, there's enough data to make a good guess..I'm not gonna like it. I can't for the life of me understand why some fanboys have to be so Damn defensive of everything to go all out to try to verbally twist themselves into a triggered mess of berating gotcha statements to make themselves feel good. Condescension and snark seem to be the best use of intelligence regarding your responses. So what if I don't like the story behind the movie. Whether I've seen it or just 40mins. What is the difference if I bought a ticket and walked in and out at key spots? It would be the same feeling regardless. The scenes haven't changed. Luke's death hasn't changed..so like I said, I'm not a fan. Let people have their opinions, and let's debate the merits of the story, not the motivations someone has about it.

I’ve now seen the movie.

I can certify that most of your ‘critiques’ - especially of Rey - were objectively wrong.

Not your opinion was wrong, mind. It’s the supposed ‘facts’ you used to try justify said opinions that were just flat out incorrect. Which kinda makes the whole damn thing a total wash.

Guess that’s what happens when you try to criticise something that you haven’t seen. One wonders why someone would even bother.

Don’t see the movie. Spare any potential movie goers of your presence, and everyone will be happier for it. But stop peddling bull crap. Both the lying, and the embarrassing attempts at being playing the victim.

For anyone who cares: I liked the movie, but it does follow that habit of mid-trilogy movies being somewhat overlong and ‘shapeless’ when they come to structure. However it’s also unpredictable (for anyone who hasn’t purposefully spoiled themselves,) still very much a Star Wars movie, has fantastic character development for nearly everyone, is full of humour, looks great, and there’s plenty of moments that get you right in the feels.

And the people who dug R1 should really like it.
 
Last edited:
Because I'm a nice guy, I'll put this behind spoiler tags...

People are whining about this Force projection thing. Most of them are EU fanboys, it would seem. Does anyone remember when Luke used Force projection in Dark Empire? Apparently not.

And yes, you can say it was portrayed as a Dark side power then. Doesn't mean it has to be now.
 
All this stuff demonstrates that, unlike JJ Abrams, Rian Johnson wasn't influenced/motivated solely by nostalgia and instead clearly let a number of different sources from both the present and past of Star Wars help shape the story he was telling, which bodes extremely well for the future of the franchise.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top