Poll What fans of the other Star Trek series are enjoying Discovery so far?
- Thread starter The Habs Fan
- Start date
And yet ENT is the only one with more dislike votes than likes. (Even if only by one vote.)
In some ways, though Sisko was pretty well fleshed out in terms of his personal life right off the bat.
ENT actually changed its formula in Season 3, and then again in Season 4.
I'm a Niner and so far I like DSC. I think it's all individual anyway. You may not like DS9 for the same reasons I do, whatever they may be.
Very true. We learned fairly early on about his motivations and demons largely driven due to the events at Wolf 359 in general and his wife's death in particular. We still don't quite know what drives Lorca. Is it what happened with the Buran or something else entirely? I'm very much looking forward to seeing more of his backstory. Hopefully we'll get to see some of it before the season ends.
I love ENT and also love DSC. I think they are similar and so it feels like DSC is a successor to ENT. They are both meant to be grittier and more morally ambiguous. I also believe as DSC goes on it will continue to evolve in the direction of TOS. I am okay with TOS but a lot of it didn't date well. I'm kind of curious to see how DSC dovetails not so much into TOS proper but into The Cage.
I cannot wait to find out more of what drives the characters. I want to know if Lorca had a wife or a sweetheart on the Buran and had to be instrumental in causing her death. I want to know how Burnham lost her parents, and also how she went from stiff quasi-Vulcan when she first meets Georgiou to the fully-realized and all too flawed human she is in The Vulcan Hello. I want to see what keeps Stamets and Culber together - they are obviously in love but Stamets is awfully prickly and maybe eventually Culber will decide he's had enough. I want to know how Saru grows into the challenges of working with the people around him and how he confronts and defeats the fears he probably lives with every day of his life. I want to see Tilly bickering with her mother and trying to get her mother to acknowledge that she's not a screw-up - and to also see her communicating with her fellow cadets remotely and see if she has friends she left behind or if she is 100% happy about leaving all of that behind. Plus I would like to see if she ever gets imposter syndrome. Is Tyler who he says he is? Does his story check out? I also want to know what happens to the Klingon fanatics. Do they pull their Empire into a radical direction like they want to? Or do more moderate factions crowd them out?
I cannot wait to find out more of what drives the characters. I want to know if Lorca had a wife or a sweetheart on the Buran and had to be instrumental in causing her death. I want to know how Burnham lost her parents, and also how she went from stiff quasi-Vulcan when she first meets Georgiou to the fully-realized and all too flawed human she is in The Vulcan Hello. I want to see what keeps Stamets and Culber together - they are obviously in love but Stamets is awfully prickly and maybe eventually Culber will decide he's had enough. I want to know how Saru grows into the challenges of working with the people around him and how he confronts and defeats the fears he probably lives with every day of his life. I want to see Tilly bickering with her mother and trying to get her mother to acknowledge that she's not a screw-up - and to also see her communicating with her fellow cadets remotely and see if she has friends she left behind or if she is 100% happy about leaving all of that behind. Plus I would like to see if she ever gets imposter syndrome. Is Tyler who he says he is? Does his story check out? I also want to know what happens to the Klingon fanatics. Do they pull their Empire into a radical direction like they want to? Or do more moderate factions crowd them out?
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It boggles my mind that a plurality like DS9 the best (more than TOS & TNG combined). It think it reinforces the idea that the forum itself is skewed towards DS9ers, who are more likely than other subsets to like Disco. Thus skewing the sample.
Results back this up, though small sample. ENT fandom is 50/50. VOY is 2/1 for it. TOS/TNG are roughly 3/1 for it. DS9dom is almost 10/1.
To answer, I like TNG the best, by a hair over TOS. I like the other shows, but they fight for a distant third.
As for Disco, other than TOS is has had the best first five. Wuth TNG at the bottom.
Results back this up, though small sample. ENT fandom is 50/50. VOY is 2/1 for it. TOS/TNG are roughly 3/1 for it. DS9dom is almost 10/1.
To answer, I like TNG the best, by a hair over TOS. I like the other shows, but they fight for a distant third.
As for Disco, other than TOS is has had the best first five. Wuth TNG at the bottom.
"What is dead can never die!"
Which brings up an interesting point: WAS there a specific "jump the shark" moment in Voyager that spelled the beginning of the downward spiral? Certainly within Enterprise SPECIFICALLY the consensus seems to be the "space nazi aliens" cliffhanger at the end of Season 3. But when did Voyager truly jump the shark? I know that for the Next Gen films it was basically "First Contact" but for Voyager I have to think it was either "Scorpion"or "Year of Hell"
I think it was a slow burn with Voyager for most folks. It was drawn out over time, had the same old tired stories, and never really caught fire in a compelling way like I felt the others had.
Specific episode? For me, it was "False Profits", with the lost Ferengi out in the Delta Quadrant, exploiting local populations in the way that only Ferengi can. Janeway just couldn't stop being Starfleet, pursued them into the Barzan Wormhole (something that was set up from TNG's "The Price") and it closed when the Ferengi went into it and before Voyager could catch up to them. It was a GUARANTEED way home for her crew and she whiffed it for the sake of trying to capture a pair of corrupt Ferengi (which she ALSO failed to do for all their troubles in the end), who likely would have eventually been captured or killed by the Borg or the Kazon, or by any number of the other uber-hostile Delta Quadrant species floating around out there that they had already run into. The Ferengi disappeared, the wormhole closed and everyone was completely gobsmacked. If ever there was a time for mutiny against the shitstain command staff of that ship, that should have been it. I was completely disgusted by how that episode played out and I think that was my own personal shark-jumping moment. Never really much cared about it after that.
And, from a bit of a "meta" POV, several of the actors were apparently quite unprofessional with their jobs and with each other during the show's run - more-so than was ever reported on any of the other shows IIRC. It's really like they didn't care about what was going on. Just a job. And maybe that's how a lot of the fans felt about it. There was no chemistry or interest. You had Garret Wang coming in late or drunk or whatever and having problems with his lines, and at the same time demanding he get to direct an episode. You had Robert Beltran complaining about the show damn near every opportunity he got - sometimes with legitimate grievances, sometimes just to whine. You had the daily cat fights between Kate Mugrew and Jeri Ryan (mostly in one direction, from the former directed at the latter after she joined the staff) and constant reports of a generally unpleasant working environment. You had Ron Moore leave the production fairly early on because he hated the fact that every episode had a reset button and there were no lasting consequences on the ship or crew stranded all out on their own (an attitude that would heavily inform his writing in NuBSG) - and he was right, IMO. Then there was Jeri Taylor who retired at the end of S4 - I'm not entirely sure what happened there, but I think it was an extension of the Mulgrew/Ryan drama and I recall there being some fallout there, but not 100% sure.
And Nelix was completely, utterly, thoroughly worthless as a character, IMO. More ridiculous than Wesley in many ways. At least much of Wesley's annoying traits could be rationalized through the awkwardness of youth and the strange position he found himself on the flagship of the Federation. Neelix was, ostensibly, a grown adult individual, but constantly throwing rage-fueled temper tantrums almost every other episode and being really hyper-sensitive and hyper-jealous about Kes, another fairly useless character. But to be fair, the way they treated Jennifer Lien wasn't terribly cool, either.
So...Whew! Lots of reasons there, in retrospect. YMMV, but I'm sure there are a lot of folks out there who have their own "shark" moments with that show too.
Enterprise, to me, was never as bad as Voyager, but it certainly did nothing to elevate itself to greatness much, either.
I had more patience with Voyager, but looking back on it now, the decline started when Jeri Taylor left. There a few jump the shark moments, like Lyndsey Ballard and those shitty Fair Haven episodes. But the main jump the shark moment for me was the 6th season finale when Voyager fights the Borg Tactical Cube. The Cube is supposed to be stronger than a regular cube but voyager fights it and doesn't get blown to smithereens in two seconds. After that it was like, why the fuck should i care any more.
There were issues like that on every series. It just happens when the same group of people spend 18 hours a day together every day.We weren't there, and you aren't painting a balanced picture of what we do know.
For instance, most of the Voyager actors have said that their time on the show was the greatest, and/or most fun seven years of their life. They've also said that they were and are closer than family. The male cast members get together at a certain LA restaurant every month to this day(including Wang and Beltran). When one can't make it, they join on speaker phone. They are still very close.
We could paint a negative picture of any of the shows, like Shatner's alleged treatment of his costars, Avery Brooks difficulty to work with, or the "chaos on the bridge" the first few years of TNG. Michael Dorn has said that he felt unwelcome when joining the DS9 cast, that they thought he was some overpayed actor from the last show brought in to save ratings. He has also said that the DS9 set was always dead serious, that they never laughed, or had fun. Marina Sirtis has said similar things.
Voyager produced seven wonderful seasons. It is many a fans favorite, as seen in many a polls, and even on TrekBBS. Activity on the Voyager forum surpassed the DS9 forum years ago, and has now surpassed the TNG forum.
#Voyagerrocks
For instance, most of the Voyager actors have said that their time on the show was the greatest, and/or most fun seven years of their life. They've also said that they were and are closer than family. The male cast members get together at a certain LA restaurant every month to this day(including Wang and Beltran). When one can't make it, they join on speaker phone. They are still very close.
We could paint a negative picture of any of the shows, like Shatner's alleged treatment of his costars, Avery Brooks difficulty to work with, or the "chaos on the bridge" the first few years of TNG. Michael Dorn has said that he felt unwelcome when joining the DS9 cast, that they thought he was some overpayed actor from the last show brought in to save ratings. He has also said that the DS9 set was always dead serious, that they never laughed, or had fun. Marina Sirtis has said similar things.
Voyager produced seven wonderful seasons. It is many a fans favorite, as seen in many a polls, and even on TrekBBS. Activity on the Voyager forum surpassed the DS9 forum years ago, and has now surpassed the TNG forum.
#Voyagerrocks
I've noticed that
Honestly I think it's just one of those insecurities that come through when a new show has its outing and its not universally embraced. There's this need to find comfort in undermining something else - you know misery loves company. Also when we talk about another show it means avoiding facing the flaws in Discovery.Discovery has already had a few jump the Tardishark moments.. already. Doesn't mean there are not some aspects to hope for but .. yeah.
It's a nine-step program, dude.
Steps one two and three were sabotaged and destroyed step four vanished without a trace and was never seen again. Step five was our last best hope for peace, but failed. Step six went off on some damn fool idealistic Crusade and got canceled for its trouble. Step seven is the same thing as step four, and steps eight and nine are actually the first two steps because for Niners there is no such thing as linear time.
the war, the imperfect characters, the unpredictabilty, and the dialogue.
Optimism, CaptainI've noticed that
Discovery has already had a few jump the Tardishark moments.. already. Doesn't mean there are not some aspects to hope for but .. yeah.
Deep Space Nine was willing to look more deeply into the ideas that made the Star Trek universe rather than take them at face value. Past Tense, for instance, tried to look at how human societies started to make the turn that led to the Earth culture in the 24th century. There were also at least three episodes that dealt with how economics worked without currency.
As a TNG fan, I'm drawn to DSC because of its essentially bright, optimistic vision of the future.
Wait, what? No, really. In a dark time, Burnham, Tilly, and Stamets are already choosing to be their better selves, to honor life, to long for exploration, to care for those who need caring. I will wager that, by the time this season ends, we'll see those who hold those values dear win and those who reject or compromise them lose.
That said, I also like it because the setting and climate of the show are, yes, dark. I'm a DS9 fan second only to TNG.
Wait, what? No, really. In a dark time, Burnham, Tilly, and Stamets are already choosing to be their better selves, to honor life, to long for exploration, to care for those who need caring. I will wager that, by the time this season ends, we'll see those who hold those values dear win and those who reject or compromise them lose.
That said, I also like it because the setting and climate of the show are, yes, dark. I'm a DS9 fan second only to TNG.
Jump the Tardishark. Wow. Can we use that...permanently?I've noticed that
Discovery has already had a few jump the Tardishark moments.. already. Doesn't mean there are not some aspects to hope for but .. yeah.
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