Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x04 - "The Butcher's Knife Cares Not for the Lamb's Cry"

[Jadeb]

What I do not get is why did the Klingons not help T'Kuvma's flagship sooner. For six months, they left a weapon of both high strategic and tactical value abandoned in the field. How stupid is this race? This would be equivalent to leaving a Gerald Ford-class aircraft carrier, one of the most advanced ships in the US Navy, stranded while the rest of the Amercan fleet goes off to war. This would never happen. What's worse - it now seems the Klingons had only two ships with cloaking technology. The other was sacrificed to make a point. I have heard it said recently that writers who write about war now for Hollywood, that many of them know next to nothing about war. This episode is a prime example of that. No nation at war would leave a ship this valuable abandoned in the field. It's lucky for them that the Federation never made an attempt at acquiring this ship.

The Federation was busy leaving their own ship abandoned. Though they had time to go back and get a telescope.

The odd thing is that they showed Lorca destroying the Glenn, so it's not as though the writers are unaware of this. It's just another example of the writers opting for what's convenient rather than what makes sense, like Burnham's actions in the first two episodes.

 

[Mudd]

I don't think she was being a dick to Tilly.

Actually, Tilly's been just as much of a 'Dick' to Burnham as Burnham has been to her - it's very much a Spock/McCoy like dynamic.

No. Tilly is friendly, awkward and the sort of silly character who can't carry off a social lie - and she tries, god knows. She's not a dick. Burnham is a world-class dick to most everyone.

I suppose she comes by it honestly, given that most Vulcans we've met other than Spock over the last half-century veer pretty quickly into asshole territory - Sarek's walked the rim of the crater more than a few times.

 

[Timo]

I'm not sure who would have been supposed to "rescue" the Klingons from the binary system after the battle. Sure, T'Kumva demonstrated his cloak to everybody present. But he then went on to have a fight in which everybody present either died or got stranded aboard the sarcophagus ship. For all we know, interstellar comms were down for good, too.

Kol bailed out before the battle, having been told that the cloak existed, but not actually having been given a demonstration. He probably saw no reason to believe T'Kumva - until his own war started going badly for him, after which he decided to grasp at straws and returned to the battlefield.

Really, we should never mistake these Klingons for a "nation" at war. They're basically the exact opposite.

As for the scuttling thing, Starfleet never scuttles except if there's clear and immediate tactical advantage (inflicting losses on the enemy, say). Lorca blew up a state secret. There were no state secrets aboard the Shenzhou. Or the Stargazer, say.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[rahullak]

For a long-titled Trek episode, this one is reasonably good. Felt more like old Trek than the previous three, but they are pretty good for current times too. Abrupt red-shirt departure of the Sec chief was a bit illogical and jarring. Excited for next week's Lorca torture episode (watch for signs of Chain of Command! )

 

[CardassianAssassin]

I was thinking of getting Enterprise and giving it a chance. I'm struggling with the dismal tone of Discovery. I give it this season and I believe it may get another.

I just started watching it, and while it’s no B5 or TNG I find it way better than Voyager.

The first season has a dynamic that can get a little tiresome at times:
(Tpol: “I recommend against this captain. It’s not Vulcan protocol and also pretty stupid.” Archer: “Noted. Send an away team to meddle with a situation we don’t know a lot about. It’s the right thing to do!”)

But overall it’s a pretty good show, has a crew that’s a lot more appealing than on STD, and is more optimistic without being b/w about it.

The crew on the Enterprise would certainly never willingly commit war crimes or cut off the claw of a sentient animal because it might be useful for killing.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

The Federation was busy leaving their own ship abandoned. Though they had time to go back and get a telescope.

The odd thing is that they showed Lorca destroying the Glenn, so it's not as though the writers are unaware of this. It's just another example of the writers opting for what's convenient rather than what makes sense, like Burnham's actions in the first two episodes.

I enjoyed the episode thoroughly but the telescope thing was one of my problems with the it. I can understand Starfleet not destroying the Shenzhou, compared to the Glenn it didn't have top secret tech and it was an old ship. I just can't see starfleet coming back to the battle site, checking for survivors and then taking the time to grab personal items of the crew. The only thing I can think of is that maybe Saru grabbed it when the crew abandoned ship, maybe he's given it to burnham on georgiou's behalf. I dunno, but i'd like it explained.

 

[Tesophius]

I think his point is while it's defensible to argue that this is below-average Trek, it's certainly not in the "worst of Trek" category.

To be fair, half of all Trek episodes are around 3/10, so STD is similar to the worst of Trek. In the 50 years of Trek there's been maybe fifteen 10/10 episodes, I think people are fooling themselves giving this snoozefest such high praise.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Are we sure it was the same telescope?

Maybe crew quarters are escape pods?

Maybe personal items get sucked through a trap door, and collected into the escape pods?

If that was the same telescope from the pilot, and ancient design using dozens of glass lenses... It's probably hela broken.

Philipa must have recorded the message, when she packed the crate... it that is the same telescope, then it's most likely that she recorded the message while Burnham was recovering from radiation exposure and communications were being jammed.

 

[XCV330]

A species that HAS To have live food to eat wouldn't really make a good conquering race. The logistical nightmares are too much. Maybe that ship is too old to have whatever equivalent Klingon's have of gaach-ramen packets.

 

[Shalashaska]

Klingons eat every animal under the sun. Lumping some human meat in there isn't all that crazy.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Voyager was on the air for seven seasons and was followed by Enterprise.

Had Voyager been put under Moonves' microscope, it probably would have been cancelled as well.

 

[BlueStuff]

She was going to cut off its claw (?). The poor thing was defending itself.

She was. A terrible plan.

 

[Charles Phipps]

No. Tilly is friendly, awkward and the sort of silly character who can't carry off a social lie - and she tries, god knows. She's not a dick. Burnham is a world-class dick to most everyone.

I think she's as friendly as she can be to Tilly given she's a traumatized war veteran.

I suppose she comes by it honestly, given that most Vulcans we've met other than Spock over the last half-century veer pretty quickly into asshole territory - Sarek's walked the rim of the crater more than a few times.

I like how the Vulcan High Command is technically the one which did the Vulcan Hello.

 

[McDuff]

Pretty good episode. I love the cinematography in this series. Each week, I feel like I'm watching a big blockbuster movie. Nice to see a guest star from Starship Troopers, except less gooey. I prefer episode 3 but it's not a competition. I felt there was a better set up for the mystery in episode 3. I think it was a bit slow in the first 20 minutes but then it got better. I like the Klingon dialogues but I would prefer if they spoke faster, more conversational and were a bit less "theatrical" in their delivery. They pause between each sentences, speak slowly and it's very slow to get to the point. I would prefer if they were more fiery, feisty and passionate. But beyond that, what happened on the Klingon side was ok to set up the situation. I like that they attempt to make them different than previous series. It's pretty nice how they use the blink drive to save the colony (using the vessel as a bait).

I'm rewatching at the moment random TNG remastered episodes (they look absolutely stunning in HD), The Chase, Suspicions and Rightful Heir (the return of Kahless episode) and you can see a big difference in the depth of the dialogues. Discovery do feel like a summer blockbuster action movie compared to the TNG drama, depth of dialogues. It's all good fun. I'm a fan of Spartacus and it's not all Shakespeare either (beside the episode Victory of course ).

With Discovery and The Orville on the air, it's a great moment to be a Star Trek fan.

 

[CardassianAssassin]

What’s the point of the rotating saucer section anyways?

Was Discovery originally built to be a restaurant ship or something?

 

[Jadeb]

What’s the point of the rotating saucer section anyways?

Was Discovery originally built to be a restaurant ship or something?

The Saturday Night Live sketch from the '80s was ahead of its time.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

What’s the point of the rotating saucer section anyways?

Was Discovery originally built to be a restaurant ship or something?

Cause the effect looked cool, also in conjunction with the seemingly needless rotating.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

The Federation was busy leaving their own ship abandoned. Though they had time to go back and get a telescope.

The odd thing is that they showed Lorca destroying the Glenn, so it's not as though the writers are unaware of this. It's just another example of the writers opting for what's convenient rather than what makes sense, like Burnham's actions in the first two episodes.

It'd be one thing if it was just completely abandoned but it seemed odd to presumably go back for the telescope and what not and then leave the ship intact like that.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

I liked the episode a lot, they make this silly idea of a "spore" drive seem less silly. And officer what'shername getting Leo Dicaprio'd was pretty legit. She had it coming to her.

Tacoma though, what a jackass. If the show is trying to paint Tacoma as someone I'm supposed to care about or fear in some way they've done a poor job. He really sucks at being both a Klingon and a fanatical religious leader.

 

[Tuskin38]

Not going through the last two pages, but Corvan II is another callback (Callforward?) it was a planet mentioned in TNG.

It was mentioned in the episode with that lizard Alexander tries to save from a fire.