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Middle-Easterners in "Discovery"

So they assumed people in Africa don't migrate to other parts of the continent? BTW Ethopia is not in the North, have such folks even met an Eastern African, they come in all shapes, sizes and looks.
To be fair if Earth is as united and global migration is as normal as moving across town, there is no reason why in a reboot Star Trek, white skinned Kirk McCoy and Scotty could not be African born citizens, brown skinned Uhura be born in Australia and Sulu have an English accent. Chekov can stay Russian lol
What part of Africa Uhura was from wasn't the real issue back then, it was that Saldana's Uhura did not appear to have the same lineage as Nichelle's original Uhura. The complaint was that Saldana was cast in the role because she had a more, shall we say "commercial" look.

The problem is that casting Saldana in the role gave the impression that the producers didn't feel the need to pay as much attention to detail when casting Uhura as was paid to casting of the other roles.

Personally, I had no problem with Saldana's casting as Uhura, but I do recognize that there were several actors out there at the time who would have been much more appropriate in terms of looking the part.
 
Star Trek canon never states that America was involve in the 3rd world war.

Trek canon hardly said ANYTHING about the third world war. Literally all we know is that one of the factions was called the Eastern Coalition (which was centered around China and its allies), and that the war took place in 2053. That's IT.

We know absolutely nothing else about the war - who started it, who the other factions were, how exactly the hell Earth managed to recover so quickly, etc.

Yes, you're right, there's no conclusive proof that the USA was involved in WW3, but I can only ask this: How could it NOT be?
 
Star Trek canon never states that America was involve in the 3rd world war.
DS9 Past Tense, Part 1:
WOMAN: You're lucky. We had to cancel our trip to the Alps this year because of the student protests in France.
CHRIS: I thought the Neo-Trotskyists were going to put a stop to that.
WOMAN: They're not having any more luck that the Gaullists did.
MAN: Europe is falling apart.
WOMAN: Well, at least we don't have to worry about that kind of thing here.
DAX: Don't count on it.
Presumably Dax's comment implying the social collapses plaguing Europe will eventually happen in America is in reference to WWIII.
 
As a half-Iranian, I hope they have Middle-Easterners in "Discovery". Or at least actors who portray them. Preferably in a positive light. To show that we're not all terrorists. And yes, there are bigots who think this.

One time, at a high school reunion, someone was talking to me, a veteran who was in Afghanistan who suffers from PTSD, forgot what I am and casually said, "I tense up whenever I see a middle-easterner". Of course, I'm "different" but I did my best not to say anything. It wasn't the time or the place.

There was Bashir on DS9 but that was Pre-9/11. We need something Post-9/11. If it's something where I'd have to explain why, you wouldn't understand.

I appreciate where you are coming from.

What I love is when the people I encounter are just people. All races, genders, LGBT etc. People. No one looking down their snout or pushing anything on anyone. Just being people. Having a good time, conversation, business dealing, working relationship etc. Sir, Ma'am, my friend, respect.
 
And the people who were building a starship were "poverty-stricken?"No. Deanna said the the Earth was recovered in sixty years following the 3rd world war., that sounds like there wasn't a general collapse of Earth's governments, societies, and general economy. In the nations directly engaged in the war yes, the rest of the Earth considerably less so.
Sixty years is a long time... We bombed both Germany and Japan into the ground during WWII and it only took something like 20 years for their recovery.

Further I didn't say a "General collapse of Earth's governments" just those in India, China, the Middle East, Africa, and South America.

The EU, Canada, Australia, Russia, Cuba, Taiwan, and Japan probably would have been fine.

Well maybe the EU, depends if they were stupid and tried to take in endless refugee's instead of saving themselves during the collapse of the world economy.

And well Canada would kind of depend on if the US invaded it to speed up it's own recovery or not.


Going by Riker's statement of six hundred million dead, while absolutely terrible that's still a lower percentage of the world population than the USSR took in WWII. If there really was as complete a collapse as some people are stating, you should see multi-billion causalities from famine alone. Also, Cochrane made it very clear he expected to sell the warp drive and get rich, which is pretty hard when there's no money and no one to buy things.
600 million dead in the war itself, the death count from the aftermath is never mentioned.


What I love is when the people I encounter are just people. All races, genders, LGBT etc. People. No one looking down their snout or pushing anything on anyone. Just being people. Having a good time, conversation, business dealing, working relationship etc. Sir, Ma'am, my friend, respect.
Why do things like Race, Gender, or Orientation even matter in the world of Trek?

After all, from what we have seen Trek medical technology is at the point where you could change any of those things on a personal whim.
 
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My point here really is I'm just a liiiittle bit concerned about the rah-rah-America subtext in some of these comments. I think it's pretty obvious that the triumph of the Federation and the Earth government is that we're past stuff like jingoism and borders and us/them thinking. Our achievements are humankind's achievements, not the exclusive property of imaginary lines.
You do understand that (even with TNG) - STAR TREK was a show produced in the U.S. and it's primary audience was expected to be U.S. residents watching TV for entertainment, right?
 
This was obviously funny when it was first made, but these days it's edging into Poe's Law territory.

I thought that it was a POS when I first saw it in theaters, and I still believe that now; I wished that I'd asked for my money back and left the theater. It wasn't satire, but jingoistic bullshit disguised as satire.
 
Given the alternative in the last election, Trump was the correct choice.

Of course the ultra right love him, so does the KKK, he is a KKK wet dream come true.

Personally, I had no problem with Saldana's casting as Uhura, but I do recognize that there were several actors out there at the time who would have been much more appropriate in terms of looking the part.

That is because we all look the same,
 
Yes, you're right, there's no conclusive proof that the USA was involved in WW3, but I can only ask this: How could it NOT be?

Lily Sloane thought the Borg attack was coming from the ECON. So I imagine there were attacks before.
 
The problem with the whole Star Trek WW3 scenario--and much of the assumption in this thread--is it's based on Cold War paradigm. But that's not how it's going to go. Or rather, the pop culture image of a swarm of arcing ICBM contrails and Roland Beyheimer style mushroom clouds over New York is mostly fantasy at this point.

Any coordinated existential-event level attack--either first strike or retaliatory--will be a panoply platform, where nukes are just one component. Most of the physical damage will still come from "conventional" missile salvos and the actually killing fields will come from chemical/biologics. In fact, it's likely nukes will factor very little in actually blowing shit up.

The whole of the post-industrial West/first-world/whatever-you-want-to-call-it is utterly dependent on electricity. [For more information, consult George Carlin.] As such, the most long-term damage potential would be from neutralizing a target's power infrastructure. And, while this can be done in part by directly attacking the power grid, much greater immediate damage can be achieved with focused EMP strikes at key breaking points. There's a lot of speculation (impossible to know since it's all classified, obviously) that a lot of the more recent weapons development (especially in China) has been focused on increasing the efficacy and range of EMP rather than doing actual damage. None the less, any attack against the United States or the EU or Japan etc. will be with the intent to disable the power network. Not only with this have immediate economic destruction, but it will make it nearly impossible to distribute emergency information or even govern.

This also have global implications. The biggest bugger about this electronics thing is how banking is done globally. And gold depositories really don't mean anything when global infrastructure is collapsing. More importantly, the key players (US, EU, China) in this theoretical event are all economic linchpins. The finical stability of all countries around the glob will fall like domino. There are only a few countries left in the whole world who aren't intrinsically dependent on the global market. No money means no governing. At that point the notion of "nations" becomes theoretical at best. Several will be able to hold it together for awhile--even a few years--but inherited tribalism doesn't hold a whole lot of weight when the sky if falling.

The next phases of an attack will focus on damaging fuel stores, water supplies, and transportation networks.

Next come the biologics, of which the US is particularly vulnerable. Americans exist in a near sterile environment because of everything from the fluorine in the water to the cleanliness of food to wiping the handle on your grocery shopping cart with a wet wipe. There's also antibiotics in everything. This sterilization collapses in a post-apocalyptic environment. For one, it becomes increasingly more difficult to create sustainable herd immunization because the baseline is so naturally weak. So, even if the biologics dissipate, there will a lingering vulnerability to naturally-born pandemics.

As far as other long-term effects famine is the other big one. Again, the US is particularly vulnerable because of the agro-industrial complex. While it's true the US produces a lot of excess foodstuffs, it's a bit misleading. Much of that excess is just byproduct. Crops are intentionally grown to produce over-yields. This is for a lot of reasons that aren't that important. But farms are able to do this because of how the system works thanks to both the technology and the economics (sic government subsidies.) You can do that, though when the technology is all borked and the economics of the government are essentially null.

Also, most of that over-yield is either corn or soy. Much of that is intended to be feed and not really edible. And even if it were, humans can't survive on corn and soy.

All that corn and soy in the US is grown in a crop-rotation cycle with wheat. This works great when you have the infrastructure, economics, and technology to support it. The problem is, once that stops, it becomes nearly impossible to grow anything.

Most of the farmland in the US is dying and is just limping along on the crop rotation system and the chemicals used to supplement it. The soil itself has become devastatingly nitrogen-deficient. While the soy and corn is still limping a long. It's causing huge problems with the wheat. This is why there's been such an increase of Celiac disease. It's not that people are just magically becoming allergic to gluten; it's that the wheat is now of such poor quality.

This is problematic when wheat is the only caloric-heavy crop you produce, especially when the population is under constant biological threat.

However, in other parts of the world, the wheat is of much higher quality. There's also rice and various other grains. The people growing them are also much more accustomed to and adaptable to traditional farming techniques. They also have much higher naturally immunities to protect from "dirty" crop yields.

As far as nuclear winter, that's not so much of a thing either. Or rather, the amount of fire-storm detonations needed to create the classic ice-age like conditions is completely unattainable-especially in the modern geopolitical climate. . More importantly, though. the effects aren't really localized. The real damage comes from the toxic aerosoled particulates that accumulate in the stratosphere and disperse across the glob. And, while they will have their own anti-greenhouse effect, it will only be a matter of a few degrees--which, ironically, will only be negated by climate change, anyway. So the most important thing to figure here is it will render higher altitudes nearly inhabitable. Which gets us to the heart of the matter.

With all nations falling, disease everywhere, infertile lands and large chunks of land inhabitable, humans will become mass-exodus migratory. This means that it's much more likely any would-be Zefram Cochrane would come from either the Amazon valley, central Africa or south-central Asia.
 
Presumably Dax's comment implying the social collapses plaguing Europe will eventually happen in America is in reference to WWIII.
The social collapses mentioned didn't seem to be attached to war, but rather politics and protests. So Dax's comment could mean something of a similar sort coming to America.
Sixty years is a long time... We bombed both Germany and Japan into the ground during WWII and it only took something like 20 years for their recovery.
But both Germany and Japan (and others) received considerable outside aid in order to rebuild their society. Also both countries immediately after the war were under foreign political control.
600 million dead in the war itself, the death count from the aftermath is never mentioned.
I do take the 600 m. figure to mean the total death count as a consequence of the war. During and after.
Mr Trump being the correct choice for you?
Of the choices on the ballot, the best choice.

I didn't feel from her campaign that Clinton would be a good president, often she seem vague as to her plans for the country, and I didn't take any of the third party candidates seriously.
Lily Sloane thought the Borg attack was coming from the ECON. So I imagine there were attacks before.
I took the exchange between Cochrane and Lily to mean that Cochrane's project had been directly attacked before. Not America in general.
This means that it's much more likely any would-be Zefram Cochrane would come from either the Amazon valley, central Africa or south-central Asia.
Except he didn't.
 
But both Germany and Japan (and others) received considerable outside aid in order to rebuild their society. Also both countries immediately after the war were under foreign political control.
You mean like the Vulcans did?

I do take the 600 m. figure to mean the total death count as a consequence of the war. During and after.
The was the number listed for the war however, it was never said to include the aftermath.
 
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