Spoilers The Flash - Season 3

[Christopher]

This was an episode that showed the limits of their budget and/ or imaginations. It's amazing that we can see CGI Gorillas fighting on network television. But that seems to be the extent of their idea. So after the setup of assistance of the Police force they have no involvement in the finale.

I suppose it could be that they didn't want to risk the police being mind-controlled as hostages again, but it would've helped if they'd said so. And why couldn't the speedsters be mind-controlled?

I think it's a waste of Grodd to have him stage a physical attack like this. I've said before, he should be the behind-the-scenes Big Bad for an entire season, an unseen manipulator using his mind control to influence people and events, to take over from the shadows, and only gradually be revealed to the audience and the heroes as the mastermind. It'd be a nice change from Yet Another Evil Speedster.

 

[dahj]

We have yet another new speedster coming to town. The Accelerated Man.

Can't wait.

Aaaaaand he's gone...

So was that it for the Accelerated Man?
Because he accelerated out of the show faster than he arrived...

 

[Dick Whitman]

I agree. With Grodd back on Earth 1 hopefully he will be used that way. They said he is evolving but we did not really see him do anything he had not or could not have done in the past.

 

[Dick Whitman]

It's ironic or odd that Grodd's animated super villian team on JLU was not allowed to be called the Legion of Doom by DC. Even though it was a direct homage. But Legends is now able to use that exact name for a group that has little connection to it. I am not expecting it but with Grodd back on Earth 1 I would be happy for an appearance in the Legends season finale.

 

[Gryffindorian]

Actually, all punning aside, the gorillas should have used guerrilla warfare. Seriously. Sure, they're big and strong, but they're a few hundred soldiers on foot with medieval weaponry going up against a whole city in a highly technological civilization. Realistically, marching in with a conventional military formation would've been suicide. They would've needed to wield asymmetrical warfare tactics to have any hope.

?

I would prefer gorilla warfare.

The army of gorillas reminded me of the Urukhai warriors from LotR: The Two Towers. The CGI was decent, at least not as rubbery as some of the fight scenes on Supergirl. It seemed like Gypsy had a very small role to fulfill, which was mainly to find Solovar. She wasn't even involved in combat, and neither was Cisco.

 

[Nerys Myk]

HR is Savitar. That's my new theory.

 

[Snaploud]

I suppose it could be that they didn't want to risk the police being mind-controlled as hostages again, but it would've helped if they'd said so. And why couldn't the speedsters be mind-controlled?

I had the same thought. They really needed a tech solution here. Otherwise, the fight scenes make little sense.

Though, one wonders if his powers work on fellow apes like Solivar.

 

[Christopher]

So was that it for the Accelerated Man?
Because he accelerated out of the show faster than he arrived...

I bet it was to set him up for a later appearance. I suspect we're heading for a season finale where Barry unites the speedsters from multiple Earths to stand against Savitar. Which could be a way to introduce some of the other alternate speedsters from the comics like Max Mercury.

It's ironic or odd that Grodd's animated super villian team on JLU was not allowed to be called the Legion of Doom by DC. Even though it was a direct homage. But Legends is now able to use that exact name for a group that has little connection to it.

Odd. I wondered if maybe that's because Hanna-Barbera was still a separate corporate entity from Warner Bros. at the time, but WB bought them up in 2001 and JLU was in 2004-6. Still, maybe there was some lingering rights-clearance issue. Or... do you know for sure that they weren't allowed to use the name, as opposed to choosing not to use it because they thought it sounded too silly? The Berlantiverse shows are totally unafraid of appearing silly.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

wait, when and where did we see another speedster? I completely missed that!!

 

[Jax]

Luke Starkiller reference, love it

 

[Commander Richard]

wait, when and where did we see another speedster? I completely missed that!!

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[Christopher]

The speedster here was based on The Accelerated Man, the Flash of Earth-19 from relatively recent comics. In Grant Morrison's Multiversity, apparently, "Earth-19" was the designation given to the universe of the first Elseworlds graphic novel, Gotham by Gaslight, and its sequel(s) -- because they're set in the 19th century. So it's a steampunk Victorian world in the comics, hence his retro costume -- although the show's Earth-19 clearly isn't steampunk.

 

[Gryffindorian]

Luke Starkiller reference, love it

Dead Man reference - love it too.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

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Thanks.
Damn those speedsters. Blink and you'll miss them. Literally!

 

[Dick Whitman]

I bet it was to set him up for a later appearance. I suspect we're heading for a season finale where Barry unites the speedsters from multiple Earths to stand against Savitar. Which could be a way to introduce some of the other alternate speedsters from the comics like Max Mercury.




Odd. I wondered if maybe that's because Hanna-Barbera was still a separate corporate entity from Warner Bros. at the time, but WB bought them up in 2001 and JLU was in 2004-6. Still, maybe there was some lingering rights-clearance issue. Or... do you know for sure that they weren't allowed to use the name, as opposed to choosing not to use it because they thought it sounded too silly? The Berlantiverse shows are totally unafraid of appearing silly.

If my memory is right the producers wanted to use the name Legion of Doom but DC Comics did not let them because it's too silly.

 

[Jax]

I assume Accelerated Man will be involved in the future at somepoint? Also he had blue lighting effects right.

I have to admit, this episode didn't do as much for me as I thought it would. Ape on Ape was cool but the final battle was underwhelming and why doesn't Grodd just mind control or at least cause pain via that way to the 3 speedsters instead of fighting them directly? Also 90,000 combo's, how did Barry remember the ones he had already tried? between Arrow and Flash, the writers have a real thing for just shoving nukes into stories. They didn't talk about Earth 2 being left vulnerable with Jessie staying on Earth 1.

I know they really like to push Barry as the non killer hero and while I agree with it 99% of the time, some threats are too big and Barry needs to realise this. I know the show wants to play the fantasy landscape where the hero can keep all his morals and still save everyone but I don't buy such reality for a second.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

He doesn't need to remember alle the codes he already tried. He just needs to try them systematically.
From 00000 to 99999.
Fun part is we can exactly measure how fast he can punch in those numbers, if we assume he did it that way.

 

[Christopher]

I know they really like to push Barry as the non killer hero and while I agree with it 99% of the time, some threats are too big and Barry needs to realise this. I know the show wants to play the fantasy landscape where the hero can keep all his morals and still save everyone but I don't buy such reality for a second.

I don't agree with this; a refusal to kill is a basic part of many superheroes' characters in the comics and has been for generations, even if screen adaptations usually gloss over it. Superheroes are supposed to be aspirational, and part of that is giving us hope that there's a better way, that we don't have to be stuck in the primitivism of violence for all time. And if you can suspend disbelief about the "Speed Force" and "vibing" into other dimensions and other such fantasy nonsense, how is it harder to suspend disbelief about human beings having basic compassion and decency? There actually are plenty of people in real life who refuse to kill under any circumstances. It's not some magical fantasy. It's a real philosophical choice that many people have made. You may not agree with it, but it does happen.

The only thing that bugs me is that I think it may be a continuity error. I had the impression that the Flash had killed at least one or two villains in the early days, even if inadvertently. I'd be fine with them saying he refused ever to do it again, but the implication was that he'd never done it at all, and I'm not sure that's correct.

 

[dahj]

Also 90,000 combo's

There's a 100,000 combinations for a 5 digit code, so supersmart Harry was wrong there.

I had the impression that the Flash had killed at least one or two villains in the early days

I don't think he killed anyone in Season 1, but he started off season 2 by killing the Atom Smasher in a horribly gruesome way, and maybe a few other Earth-2 villains, though I don't recall if the others were actually killed or "accidentally" died.

 

[Christopher]

I don't think he killed anyone in Season 1

I looked up summaries of the first few episodes, where I though he'd killed people. Turns out it's more like the villains died due to other factors. The first Weather Wizard in the pilot was shot by Joe. The villain in episode 2 basically committed suicide while Barry was trying to save him. I thought the Mist in episode 3 had been killed by the Flash, but apparently he came back a couple of times, so I guess I remembered wrong.