Safety is not honorable.
First look at Klingons in 'Star Trek: Discovery'?
- Thread starter JacksonArcher
- Start date
Search for images of "science fiction armor" on the internet and you will see what difference it makes. Ridiculous spiky armor is typically found in a medieval fantasy setting. Even as such an armor, it is impractical and dangerous to the wearers and their group mates.
Science fiction is primarily defined by science and technology of the future. That means the armor's primary function would be to give the wearer some protection against ranged weapons, including ranged energy weapons, if necessary. We know that ranged energy weapons are common in Star Trek and that Klingons have them. What are the armor spikes for, except an attempt to inflict melee damage at close range? Moreover, have you seen Klingon armor ever resist or reduce a ranged energy weapon blast?
The way Klingons have been portrayed throughout the franchise is also ridiculous. They are supposed to be a warp-capable faction but they do not look futuristic.
And why would Vikings take pride in wearing such a ridiculous spiky armor, especially in a science fiction setting?
Speaking of safety and logic, why would Deep Space Nine, in "The Way of the Warrior", allow Klingons with their spiked knuckle gloves and spiky boots aboard the station on shore leave, including in Quark's bar? Bar fights, spiked knuckle gloves and spiky boots are a bad combination, especially for other bar patrons, including Starfleet officers. It's just plain stupid.
I've been reading and watching SF for 50 years. I've see all sorts of SF armor. So, I don't need a Google search.
I also know what Science fiction is and know it comes in a wide variety styles. From Science Fantasy to Hard Science. Trek leans toward the Science Fantasy end.
The function of SF armor in a lot of visual SF is to look cool.
Ranged energy weapons are irrelevant to what the armor will look like or whether or not it will be useful against an attack by such weapons.
Klingons love a good melee. That's why they have bladed weapons.
The typical Klingon getup isn't really even "armor" at all! It's just softer material that has an armor-looking design. Think about it... how many times has that Klingon garment utterly failed to protect the wearer from a bladed weapon? Duras, Gowron, etc., etc.
Klingon "armor"... 0% of the time, it works every time!
Kor
Klingon "armor"... 0% of the time, it works every time!
Kor
My view on sci fi is that there is scientific fiction and fictional science. Star Trek has almost always been the latter.
aka. Exactly the same thing as 'magic,' depending on the story and writer.
Beings like Apollo and Q, are no more 'scientific' than characters like Sauron and Gandalf. The 'explanation' of their existence is even exactly the same: natural inhuman beings, from a species with abilities beyond human comprehension.
Actually spiked armour may dissipate an energy blast more than flat no? Fractal surface areas and all that. Fur and hair dissipates heat and...
Yeah. I don't like the spikes either, but I don't think much of this is a concern. You may have a point on the bar fight scenario, but odds are Quark, Odo and Bashir can handle the fallout, and I believe all three complained about it at some point. Except Quark maybe. Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack...maybe he feels the same about contusions.
I've been reading and watching SF for 50 years. I've see all sorts of SF armor. So, I don't need a Google search.
I also know what Science fiction is and know it comes in a wide variety styles. From Science Fantasy to Hard Science. Trek leans toward the Science Fantasy end.
The function of SF armor in a lot of visual SF is to look cool.
Ranged energy weapons are irrelevant to what the armor will look like or whether or not it will be useful against an attack by such weapons.
Klingons love a good melee. That's why they have bladed weapons.
It is only your claim. A search proves that the wide variety of science fiction armor does not look like the ridiculous spiked armor in the leaked photo. There is a common theme to science fiction armor, just like there is a common theme to fantasy armor. The spiked armor does not look like something that was made for science fiction.
Science fantasy is under the umbrella of speculative fiction, not science fiction. Star Trek was pitched as a science fiction. Memory Alpha: Star Trek is. . . :
A one-hour dramatic television series.
Action-Adventure-Science Fiction.
The first such concept with strong
central lead characters plus other
continuing regulars.
Action-Adventure-Science Fiction.
The first such concept with strong
central lead characters plus other
continuing regulars.
If Trek leans toward science fantasy, then it is a bad science fiction. Ranged weapons are relevant because the armor will be designed primarily to protect against ranged energy weapons or for multiple purposes. Moreover, even as an armor designed for melee combat, which Klingons are shown to practice, the spiked armor in the leaked photo is impractical and dangerous to the wearers themselves and their group mates.
Let Lloyd explain it to you: "Spiked armor" ("In summary: no")
The typical Klingon getup isn't really even "armor" at all! It's just softer material that has an armor-looking design. Think about it... how many times has that Klingon garment utterly failed to protect the wearer from a bladed weapon? Duras, Gowron, etc., etc.
Klingon "armor"... 0% of the time, it works every time!
Kor
"Attack of the Klingons", time index: 3m51s
Even if you go with that theory, what exactly are they protecting, considering where the spikes are? Otherwise, see the linked video above about spiked armor.
That depends on if you are trying to make good science fiction or not.
Contusions? Try lacerations and puncture wounds for starters.
And what is this common theme? SF armor can be literally anything. From basic body armor to fancy battlesuits.
Science Fiction is the umbrella that Science Fantasy falls under. Speculative Fiction is a phrase someone embarrassed by the term "science fiction' came up with.
Who's this "Lloyd" when he's at home? The impracticality of such armor is a different issue than whether its "SF" or nor.Let Lloyd explain it to you: "Spiked armor" ("In summary: no")
So let me get this straight. If we disagree with somone using sweeping generalisations, in effort to give their subjective opinion the impression of undeserved 'objectivity', then we're either:
a) ignorant, or
b) lying about not being ignorant.
Yeah. That sounds like a riveting conversation. Totally worthy of people's time.
And BTW, I did your search. Unsurprisingly, 'scifi armour' does all look the same ...when half of the photos results are Stormtrooper and Metal Gear fanart. 'Alien armour', brought up a lot more variety. Turns out aliens like the Predator and Sarris from GQ, have lots of sharp objects on their armour.
Last edited:
Sarris from GQ? Oh, you mean the bad guy from Galaxy Quest? Isn't that a parody? And a parody of bad Trek at that? Has Star Trek started copying it's own parodies/homages? Oh, never mind.
Last edited:
It was a parody of TOS/TNG. All of TOS/TNG, and Trekkies to boot. Sometimes the mirror is a mean bitch.
And no, I wouldn't say 'copied.' Besides erring precariously close to an accusation of IP theft, correlation simply does not equal causation. What I am saying is: 'there's plenty of frigging precedent for spikes in Sci-Fi, ergo spikes are part of Sci-Fi."
Tempting as it is, we don't get to rewrite history so we can claim 'more nerdier than thou.' Not until the Borg make us a super convenient time tunnel anyway.
Last edited:
It is only your claim. A search proves that the wide variety of science fiction armor does not look like the ridiculous spiked armor in the leaked photo. There is a common theme to science fiction armor, just like there is a common theme to fantasy armor. The spiked armor does not look like something that was made for science fiction.
Science fantasy is under the umbrella of speculative fiction, not science fiction. Star Trek was pitched as a science fiction. Memory Alpha: Star Trek is. . . :
A one-hour dramatic television series.
Action-Adventure-Science Fiction.
The first such concept with strong
central lead characters plus other
continuing regulars.
If Trek leans toward science fantasy, then it is a bad science fiction. Ranged weapons are relevant because the armor will be designed primarily to protect against ranged energy weapons or for multiple purposes. Moreover, even as an armor designed for melee combat, which Klingons are shown to practice, the spiked armor in the leaked photo is impractical and dangerous to the wearers themselves and their group mates.
Let Lloyd explain it to you: "Spiked armor" ("In summary: no")
"Attack of the Klingons", time index: 3m51s
Even if you go with that theory, what exactly are they protecting, considering where the spikes are? Otherwise, see the linked video above about spiked armor.
That depends on if you are trying to make good science fiction or not.
Contusions? Try lacerations and puncture wounds for starters.
He is Quark! He has his own house! And a bar. Ask Grilka. Check his medical records. And they really didn't seem to worry too much in Ds9.
For a more interesting take on your concerns about armour and ranged energy weapons, try reading the early Ds9 novel 'Fallen Heroes' which interestingly foreshadows some of the Dominion war stuff. Though if you are from the UK, like me, the bit with Molly burning her fanny on hot deck plates is going to raise an eyebrow.
You ignore a couple of other things about Klingons and Armour.
First...Klingons prefer to fight hand to hand if they can, their armour likely reflects this and their tendency towards blades. Maybe ancient Klingons preferred to wrestle.
Second...armour can also be ceremonial, decorative, or based on a historically significant design...because it's not armour, functionally, it's a uniform.
Third...armour evolves in relation to the main armaments of opponents...silk padding to pop out arrows, steel plate to deal with swords...spikes like that are great if they are fighting an enemy that usually grabs you.
(This post was written hours ago but eaten and left sitting by an internet error.)
'It doesn't look like sf armour' is silly. We talking post Spirits Within (As co opted by Mass Effect) stuff? Aliens and James Cameron's Vietnam in space? Landmates? Gundams?
Alien armour? Human Armour?
How much actual armour is there common in SF?
Most armor in science fiction follows a fairly common pattern, which was originally informed by the "rule of cool" not practicality. Alien armor, especially, needs to be visually distinct on the scene so that they can quickly be identified from the humans.
So, armor design comes from a variety of places, including visual aesthetics, budget considerations, and storytelling concepts, with practicality not usually being high on the list.
The idea that spikey armor is not "science fiction" is a fallacy. If it serves the purpose of the story then the design will get put in.
So, armor design comes from a variety of places, including visual aesthetics, budget considerations, and storytelling concepts, with practicality not usually being high on the list.
The idea that spikey armor is not "science fiction" is a fallacy. If it serves the purpose of the story then the design will get put in.
Seconded.Don't nobody diss Galaxy Quest, one of the best Star Trek films ever made.
Personally, I think the photo is first thing to give me any real hope and ignite any amount of interest.
Well, other than Michelle Yeoh.
Well, other than Michelle Yeoh.
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
