Not to mention they have to find the correct take for any given scene where multiple takes exist. It's a pretty big time expenditure just finding the correct footage, let alone scanning it.
DS9 on blu ray?
- Thread starter borgboy
- Start date
Basically this means once there is a way to do it that ensures a profit, then let's do it.
Actually there really is no excuse why the later season of DS9 and Voyager were not future proofed for HD because by the mid to late 90s most networks and studios has switched over to HD even if shows still aired in SD. CGI FX often remained in SD until the earlier 2000s (I think ENT didn't use HD CGI until season 2 so all it's FX shots in the season one Blu rays are unconverted).
Not sure what you mean. Most shows in the late-90s were still mastered on standard-definition NTSC video.
Where do you see that 39 million figure? IMDB says that Enterprise had a cost per episode of $5 million; I can't picture a new show being less than $8 m.
Most modern tv shows, DS9 and Voyager included I believe; have that information in the master - it will tell you what scene/take number. So all you need to do is look for the correct reel.
it's not happening
That all sounds great in theory, but the reality is that with almost 25,000 reels of film to go through, the archivist for TNG could spend hours and hours just looking for one reel containing one scene. I imagine DS9 would have a similar problem.
My hunch is it likely will happen at some point IF Discovery turns out to be a hit and renews interest in Trek. The real reason CBS hasn't committed is cost and as technology gets better it's likely those costs will decrease. There's always the possibility that they could go for a possible HD/Up converting combo where all the filmed scenes are rendered in HD and CGI footage is up converted.
My guess for the cost of DS9-R is twice as much as TNG-R. I think some people have actually figured out estimates.
$8m per episode is not an estimate; it's just MY ballpark guess - about 150% the cost of Enterprise.
It's not going to be easy, simple or cheap; if it's ever done at all. Many people believe it will never happen for good reason - TNG-R had anemic sales and barely broke even. Unless Amazon or Netflix cough up a lot of money upfront for a DS9-R, I can't see it happening anytime soon.
But even with Netflix or whatever, you run into the same problems: it's just way too expensive for the gain they'd ever get out of it.
Look at what they did with something like Gilmores, for example. For starters, since the later seasons were in HD already, the cost was automatically cut in half. Plus, the show was shot on super 16mm and well preserved. So they had good material to work will. Some cheap rescans and light DNR later, they're good to go.
It was comparatively pennies to what it would cost to do something like DS9, but they were still able to advertise as the only place to get the whole shot in full HD. And, in return, they created so much interest in it, that they had enough reason to do a revival series.
Look at what they did with something like Gilmores, for example. For starters, since the later seasons were in HD already, the cost was automatically cut in half. Plus, the show was shot on super 16mm and well preserved. So they had good material to work will. Some cheap rescans and light DNR later, they're good to go.
It was comparatively pennies to what it would cost to do something like DS9, but they were still able to advertise as the only place to get the whole shot in full HD. And, in return, they created so much interest in it, that they had enough reason to do a revival series.
Netflix and other streaming services have proven time and time again that they're just fine with SD content.
CBS would be alone in remastering DS9 and VOY.
CBS would be alone in remastering DS9 and VOY.
I understand the special effects shots are cost prohibitive. But couldn't they clean up the other shots to at least HD quality? Sorry if this was covered somewhere else in this long thread.
Which brings me back to testing the waters with "Emissary."Basically this means once there is a way to do it that ensures a profit, then let's do it.
I've recently acquired complete box sets of TNG and ENT on Blu-ray and have been watching some episodes on my brand new front projector (1080p, as 4K projectors are way out of my budget). TNG looks fantastic. It's clear they went back to the source material and did a proper restoration and post-production. It has never looked as good as it does now on Blu-ray. ENT looks...okay. They have not remastered it (it originally was mastered at 1080i for eventual HD TV broadcast, with early 2000s level PQ). Also, the first two seasons' effects were rendered at 480p, with the last two rendered at 720p. The final season was shot on HD digital cameras rather than film, to save costs. Ordinarily, this would look worse than the 35mm film used for seasons 1-3, but the latter has not been re-scanned, so the HD digital stuff looks best.
In each case, I got a very good deal on the box sets (a one-day Amazon sale at 75% off list for TNG and a very good, post-Brexit exchange rate deal for ENT from Amazon.uk--ENT is not available as a box set from a N. Amer. source as far as I can tell). For the price I paid, TNG is a steal in terms of A/V quality and ENT is a fair price. For either at list--I don't like them enough to pay full list (I can afford them, but there are few A/V purchases I consider worth list price--about 20 of the 1200 or so titles in my collection).
TOS and TNG were worth the studio's gamble on remastering from original source material for HD at the time the decision was made, based on their respective popularity. ENT was an easy task, though clearly comes up short despite being the newest material (if treated the same as TOS and TNG, it would be the best looking/sounding of all the extant series, but clearly there was no incentive to make such an effort). DS9 and VOY would, very best case scenario, cost as much as TNG to do it right--and probably more. No way that is ever considered a viable proposition if TNG is not proving a success (for the quality, and the price it sells for now, any fan of TNG with decent A/V HD gear should grab up the series--I've compared it to HD on Netflix and the Blu-ray looks way better). In another decade, when technology makes the transformation much less expensive, it might happen for DS9 and VOY--but the people with the original source materials better keep them stored properly. Otherwise, the age-induced degradation in the film or video source will offset any savings of cheaper transformational tech. The ability to make things look spectacular, even with less than pristine source elements, is rather impressive (I have a blu-ray of The Birth of a Nation, which I use in class on occasion, that looks excellent for its century old source and outshines much that is 15-20 years old). But such restorations are NOT cheap. For a movie, the justification is difficult at times. For a 170+ episode TV series, there better be some deep pockets.
In each case, I got a very good deal on the box sets (a one-day Amazon sale at 75% off list for TNG and a very good, post-Brexit exchange rate deal for ENT from Amazon.uk--ENT is not available as a box set from a N. Amer. source as far as I can tell). For the price I paid, TNG is a steal in terms of A/V quality and ENT is a fair price. For either at list--I don't like them enough to pay full list (I can afford them, but there are few A/V purchases I consider worth list price--about 20 of the 1200 or so titles in my collection).
TOS and TNG were worth the studio's gamble on remastering from original source material for HD at the time the decision was made, based on their respective popularity. ENT was an easy task, though clearly comes up short despite being the newest material (if treated the same as TOS and TNG, it would be the best looking/sounding of all the extant series, but clearly there was no incentive to make such an effort). DS9 and VOY would, very best case scenario, cost as much as TNG to do it right--and probably more. No way that is ever considered a viable proposition if TNG is not proving a success (for the quality, and the price it sells for now, any fan of TNG with decent A/V HD gear should grab up the series--I've compared it to HD on Netflix and the Blu-ray looks way better). In another decade, when technology makes the transformation much less expensive, it might happen for DS9 and VOY--but the people with the original source materials better keep them stored properly. Otherwise, the age-induced degradation in the film or video source will offset any savings of cheaper transformational tech. The ability to make things look spectacular, even with less than pristine source elements, is rather impressive (I have a blu-ray of The Birth of a Nation, which I use in class on occasion, that looks excellent for its century old source and outshines much that is 15-20 years old). But such restorations are NOT cheap. For a movie, the justification is difficult at times. For a 170+ episode TV series, there better be some deep pockets.
Why that particular episode? Sure it's the first one, but it's not in most peoples' Top Ten lists and with newbies you'd likely encounter the same issues they had when the episode was first broadcast.
"Way of the Warrior" or "Trials and Tribbleations" seem to me likely more likely episodes TPTB would use if they wanted to dip their toe in. But frankly, I don't think they want to.
Agreed. IF they do a test-the-waters release (and it's a very big 'if'), then IMHO "The Way of the Warrior" would be the way to go.
Actually, "Trials and Tribbleations" would be an easy one to do, due to the TOS footage, but it wouldn't make much of a Fathom Event (unless they pair it with "The Trouble with Tribbles" and, possibly, "More Tribbles, More Troubles," both of which have already been remastered; they could call it the "Tribble-ogy").
Similar threads
