Sorry. My post was meant to be tongue-in-cheek. I guess my sense of humor doesn't post well on this board.
--Sran
So name a Star Trek moment that you just didn't "get".
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Sorry. My post was meant to be tongue-in-cheek. I guess my sense of humor doesn't post well on this board.
--Sran
I'd always assumed that Soren, being an alien, simply had greater strength or something. like Vulcans do. I mean, even Kirk and Picard together don't exactly manage to paste him to the floor... they do a better job than Picard alone, sure, but Soren is pretty agile for his (apparent) age and he eludes them until the final moment.
I dunno, I rewatched the movie a few weeks ago and it seemed to me that Kirk definitely had the upper hand in terms of fisticuffs to Soren (though they still needed two captains because there were two different objectives -- keep Soren busy, and destroy the machine).
But I also saw Picard move rather stiffly in the first fight, too. Yeah, Soren was pretty agile and quick, and he was simply too fast for Picard. My thing, however, is that the Picard in Generations and the Picard in Nemesis were two very different fighters, as if Nemesis Picard got an upgrade.
I didn't get why Kirk waited to raise shields until reliant had locked phasers, especially when Spock told Kirk they were lying about their overloaded coil messing up their communications and about 10 seconds elapsed between reliant raising her shields and firing.
What baffles me though is why Spock cut savvik off so curtly when she tried to remind him of general order 12. I know the knee jerk answer is a cadet has no place telling an admiral what to do and he knows the regs.
But he wasn't following them in a situation that seemed suspicious. Savvik wasn't being rude or insubordinate, she was stating something that, by regulations should be done but wasn't. Spock himself should have seen Kirk's not following the reg as illogical and either let Savvik finish or Spock himself should have said something.
Telling Savvik to basically shut it was a pretty emotional response, not a logical one.
What baffles me though is why Spock cut savvik off so curtly when she tried to remind him of general order 12. I know the knee jerk answer is a cadet has no place telling an admiral what to do and he knows the regs.
But he wasn't following them in a situation that seemed suspicious. Savvik wasn't being rude or insubordinate, she was stating something that, by regulations should be done but wasn't. Spock himself should have seen Kirk's not following the reg as illogical and either let Savvik finish or Spock himself should have said something.
Telling Savvik to basically shut it was a pretty emotional response, not a logical one.
^ Kirk was probably waiting until the last minute to raise shields because he had a hard time conceiving that a fellow Starfleet vessel like the Reliant would ever open fire on the Enterprise.
As for Spock, maybe he's being extra strict with Saavik because she is a fellow Vulcan and should know even better (than most cadets) not to interrupt.
As for Spock, maybe he's being extra strict with Saavik because she is a fellow Vulcan and should know even better (than most cadets) not to interrupt.
Ten seconds may have elapsed during the film, but that doesn't mean ten seconds passed for the characters. Films are edited in order to create suspense--the cuts back and forth between the Enterprise and the Reliant--but that doesn't mean that's what actually happened as far as the characters who experienced those moments are concerned. It's likely that only a few second at most passed between Spock's report about Reliant's coil emissions and Khan's order to fire.
--Sran
Every once in a while you just have to take yourself out of the film and admit it happened that way because it's the only way the writer could think of to get Shatner and Stewart together as Kirk and Picard. Not exactly organic storytelling, is it.
^Another way to look at it might be that Picard rededicated himself as far as his physical conditioning was concerned after Kirk's death. Perhaps he decided he wouldn't allow anyone working with him to risk his or her life because of his limitations--as I'd imagine seeing a Starfleet legend who'd beaten death many times under more dangerous circumstances die in front of him made a lasting impression on Picard.
--Sran
--Sran
What were all shown inside a brown cabin?
^I wonder if perhaps English is not that poster's first language.
--Sran
--Sran
Yeah true. Khan probably gave the order to raise shields and lock phasers simultaneously to Spock telling Kirk about them. So I'll give you that point.
Still though you had a situation that was already suspicious with carol's message. Reliant doesn't respond on any channel including emergency ones. Savvik sensed the whole thing smelled fishy and was giving a reminder of actions that should be taken. Spock clearly thought that nothing short of a total failure in their comm system couldn't explain reliant's actions. Kirk called it "damn peculiar " and went to yellow alert. Then the one voice message they do get is immediately revealed by Spock to be a lie.
You think between Kirk' experience, Spock's logic and Savvik's adherence to regulations the shields would have gone up at some point.
I know they couldn't raise shields or the scene would have been boring. It would have made more sense if Khan had Terrell and/or Chekov with him (I know they were back at regula I) respond visually make up some bs, put Kirk at ease, and say they're pulling along side and then kapow.
It was a great scene and all, but it just made Kirk and Spock look like they'd gone temporarily stupid the way reliant got the drop on them after so many foreshadowed clues.
Like, when they ``energize defense fields'' before getting Reliant's message about the chambers coil, perhaps?
All that did was power up their weapons which isn't going to do much good if the other guy shoots first and you have no protection.
It'd be like a soldier loading his gun because he thinks combat might be imminent, yet he doesn't bother to put on a flack jacket, helmet or any other protective gear. A loaded machine gun isn't going to be worth much if the enemy shoots you unprotected first. If you have protective gear you have a chance to get hit and still be able to respond.
It makes no sense to power up your weapons and not activate defensive measures like shields at the same time if you sense something might go down soon. W
I agree with this. Saavik is saying just the sort of thing that Spock would say, and Spock responds by getting territorial in a most illogical way. It's one of those "because plot" moments.
Star Trek: Generations. The Nexus can destroy a planet. Kirk was in a brown cabin.
You are confusing things just a little though. The two ship captains were not responsible for the Nexus, nor did they have the power to control it. The villian, Soran, wanted to use a missile to alter the course of the Nexus, but he couldn't really control the Nexus, either.
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