Yeomen in the 24th Century? Cannon & Your Speculations?

[Redshirt214]

Here's a question for my fellow TNG fans: do you think there are still Yeomen in the 24th century? Certainly Picard has no Yeomen, I don't recall anyone else having one either though that might be a personal choice, like picking a first officer (it seems to me that as Captain\Commander you have your pick of the senior officers of all departments when selecting a FO). I wonder if the combination of PAADS and the replicators was supposed to have made the position redundant, but then again I would imagine having someone to help manage scheduling, office work, ect. would be useful. I do somewhat wonder if a Yeomen might be particularly useful to a staircase commander, over a starship commander, given how many different tasks a base commander must handle, since they'd be managing multiple ships coming and going, military and civil affairs, and ect., which sounds like a lot of work for just one person.

I don't recall seeing any Yeomen, but correct me if I'm mistaken. I figure it's more a position than a rank, one I imagine is a "first job" for ensigns, perhaps, or maybe NCOs?

 

[Christopher]

I don't recall seeing any Yeomen, but correct me if I'm mistaken. I figure it's more a position than a rank, one I imagine is a "first job" for ensigns, perhaps, or maybe NCOs?

Yeoman is an enlisted rating, never an officer's posting. Part of the reason we don't see yeomen in the 24th century is because we don't see that many enlisted personnel (O'Brien being the main exception). Though part of it is probably that such subordinate functions were meant to be handled mostly by computers.

 

[Redshirt214]

Interesting... I think I remember reading somewhere that in real militaries Yeomen was an enlisted position... it is kind of odd that, say, Wesley holds the rank of Ensign when there are other people who have been working of a while that might technically be outranked by him... he should have been a cadet or something strictly speaking, just more not great writing I guess. I have been pondering lately what an Yeomens eye view of Star Trek would look like, inspired by Lower Decks (as it strikes me as a easy way to include a low-ranking crew member in the adventure without too much plot contrivance).

 

[Vger23]

I’m sure in the intervening 70 years, the role was re-structured and duties split / absorbed elsewhere in starfleet. If I recall correctly, we only see one Yeoman in the whole TOS movie era...so it may have been in the phase-out stage by the late 23rd.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I assume yeoman typically work in the ship's admin section, dealing with all the day-to-day administrative and clerical duties needed to keep the ship running smoothly.

 

[FederationHistorian]

There isn’t really a need for yeoman, at the time of TNG. Much like how a comms officer isn’t needed anymore. Roles either evolve or die out, depending on what the needs of the times are. I do not see why anyone who is the captain of a Galaxy-class starship would need one. Seems to me that there would be an administrative assistant role in place of a yeoman, and those administrative assistants have their own office that they work out off, rather than reporting to the captain on the bridge.

The real question is: are there still yeoman during Captain Harriman’s and Captain Garrett’s respective times on Ent-B and Ent-C? Those captains are still connected to the TOS era, just based on the uniforms and ships they captain alone. For that matter, did Picard have a yeoman when he was the captain of the Stargazer?

 

[Herbert]

There isn’t really a need for yeoman, at the time of TNG. Much like how a comms officer isn’t needed anymore. Roles either evolve or die out, depending on what the needs of the times are. I do not see why anyone who is the captain of a Galaxy-class starship would need one.

And also armory officers aren't needed anymore. This really seems like the most reasonable explanation. Roles change or morph into other roles or are eliminated. I'm not sure even TOS captains needed a yeoman.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

^ I'd say armoury officers are still a thing, they just work in the ships armoury, keeping an eye on weaponry, explosives, and tactical gear, as well as ensuring all personnel are certified and regularly put in the necessary practice needed to meet competence qualification. They'd be in the security department, under the Chief of Security, but would still have an important role to play.

 

[Christopher]

"Armory officer" was just the 22nd-century version of "security chief," it seemed to me.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

There isn’t really a need for yeoman, at the time of TNG.

Well, that depends on the definition of the role of Yeoman. Even the USN can use them in wider roles than they usually do (because they also have other ratings for that):

The duties performed by YNs include preparing, typing and routing correspondence and reports, and organizing and maintaining files. They receive office visits and handle telephone communications.
YNs operate personal computers, word processors, duplication, audio-recording and other office machines. They perform office personnel administration, maintain records and official publications, and perform administrative functions for legal proceedings.
Yeoman serve as office managers and perform other various clerical and administrative duties.

Therotically, YNs can perform any equivalent duties to the Aviation Maintainence Administrationman (AZ) or the broadly equivalent RN rating of Writer Logistician (one of only three "admin" roles in the RN, the other two being Supply Chain Logistician [mostly Army Quartermaster/Navy Logistics Specialist/CG Storekeeper] and Catering Services Logistician [Culinary Specialist], with various "ship's serviceman" jobs sharing between the last two):

The smooth running of a ship is about much more than on-point kit. Our people’s welfare needs to run smoothly, too. As an HR Administrator (Writer), you’re in charge of Human Resources (HR), handling legal matters, financial admin, and looking after the welfare of your crewmates. Whether you’re advising your Captain about promotions or organising your crewmates’ pay, it’s up to you to make things happen. It’s a unique job in a unique environment, and a great opportunity to discover what makes us tick – and how we keep ticking, all over the world.

Much like how a comms officer isn’t needed anymore.

A dedicated comms officer is rarely assigned to the bridge (Kim is more of a Navigator/Engineer hybrid that covers COMMS as a collateral function, and IMO that makes more sense than external comms and primary internal comms being the responsibility of the Tactical Officer). However, we know from Aquiel (TNG) that dedicated communications officers do exist and Ensigns and above could be assigned a variety of staff including -- Cryptological Tech (CT), Electronics Technician (ET), Intelligence Specialist (IS, shared with SECO/SecChf), Information Systems Tech (IT) or Mass Comms Specialist (MC) -- and that's for non-Bridge Officers*

Roles either evolve or die out, depending on what the needs of the times are. I do not see why anyone who is the captain of a Galaxy-class starship would need one. Seems to me that there would be an administrative assistant role in place of a yeoman, and those administrative assistants have their own office that they work out off, rather than reporting to the captain on the bridge.

The Captain of a Galaxy-class starship could be managing anything from 800 crew (2-3x that of the Connie) long-term to 15,000 crew and passengers for at least short periods, I have no issue with them needing administrative support for such a role, although changing the title from yeoman (which in-universe was also something of the "captain's servant" in TOS, reflecting norms up to at least the mid-20th Century) would be understandable IMO.


* This is why USS Discovery having four "operations officers" on the bridge seems odd to me. Splitting off the spore-drive specific elements from Navigation (either part of Ops or CONN) makes some sense, but having a communications officer, a tactical officer and an operations officer on what was officially a science vessel doesn't make sense to me. SDOps/DASH-Ops, Ops/Comms and Tactical would be more than sufficient IMO.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

"Armory officer" was just the 22nd-century version of "security chief," it seemed to me.

In a way. It was certainly synomous with the often related title of Tactical Officer. However, at enlisted level these are usually two or more separate ratings that might not even be in the same community (security is typically Command/Deck, Bridge/CIC Tactical Officers/?Operators would also be C/D, but Armory Technicians can be either C/D or Engineering)

In the first two seasons, they didn't really have a "ships security team" per se, so inline with RW practice in the USN until recently other personnel (mainly Gunner's Mates) performed that function. In the third and fourth season, even with the arrival of a dedicated security team in the MACOs, Reed as de facto Second Officer/First Lieutenant still retained overall supervision of the function.

 

[gakelly]

They probably got rid of the yeomen position once they decided it was completely inappropriate to have a woman on the staff simply to get hit on by the captain.

 

[Christopher]

They probably got rid of the yeomen position once they decided it was completely inappropriate to have a woman on the staff simply to get hit on by the captain.

Both "The Cage" and "The Corbomite Maneuver" established that a female yeoman was unusual enough to be worthy of comment. So the original intent was that most yeomen were male. That changed because they couldn't hold onto a female lead to play the captain's yeoman, so they ended up having a succession of female yeomen in contrast to the original intent.

We did see three male yeomen in canon -- a patient of McCoy's in "How Sharper than a Serpent's Tooth" and the assassins Burke and Samno in The Undiscovered Country. Plus we can presume the existence of a fourth -- Pike's yeoman who was killed on Rigel VII before "The Cage." Since Pike was uneasy that his new yeoman was female, his previous one was probably male (or non-binary, though that never would've occurred to Gene Roddenberry in 1964).

Also, Kirk didn't hit on yeomen as a rule. That was the gist of his character arc with Janice Rand -- that they both wanted him to pursue her romantically, but he refused to because he was duty-bound not to. (Remember "Miri" and "You never look at my legs.") He only expressed desire for her when not in his right mind, as when split into good and evil halves or suffering from a disinhibition virus.

 

[Orphalesion]

Well, that depends on the definition of the role of Yeoman. Even the USN can use them in wider roles than they usually do (because they also have other ratings for that):

The duties performed by YNs include preparing, typing and routing correspondence and reports, and organizing and maintaining files. They receive office visits and handle telephone communications.
YNs operate personal computers, word processors, duplication, audio-recording and other office machines. They perform office personnel administration, maintain records and official publications, and perform administrative functions for legal proceedings.
Yeoman serve as office managers and perform other various clerical and administrative duties.

Therotically, YNs can perform any equivalent duties to the Aviation Maintainence Administrationman (AZ) or the broadly equivalent RN rating of Writer Logistician (one of only three "admin" roles in the RN, the other two being Supply Chain Logistician [mostly Army Quartermaster/Navy Logistics Specialist/CG Storekeeper] and Catering Services Logistician [Culinary Specialist], with various "ship's serviceman" jobs sharing between the last two):

The smooth running of a ship is about much more than on-point kit. Our people’s welfare needs to run smoothly, too. As an HR Administrator (Writer), you’re in charge of Human Resources (HR), handling legal matters, financial admin, and looking after the welfare of your crewmates. Whether you’re advising your Captain about promotions or organising your crewmates’ pay, it’s up to you to make things happen. It’s a unique job in a unique environment, and a great opportunity to discover what makes us tick – and how we keep ticking, all over the world.
.

The way the Enterprise-D is portrayed it seems like most or even al that you list here is done automatically by the ship's computer.
I doubt there's a person on the Enterprise-D who's work consists of "preparing, typing and routing correspondence", for example. Or that there's much of a supply chain when you can instantly replicate anything. And if there's anything left for catering it might fall under Guinan's sphere of influence.

 

[Timo]

Hipshots:

- The personnel Archer had aboard need not be representative of UESF thinking in general. Archer sailed out well ahead of schedule, and had to go scrape together a team from people who never ever dreamed of attending (like Sato and Phlox) while possibly leaving behind folks scheduled to appear (the would-be XO might still have been on assignment elsewhere, say). Archer didn't think he'd need much in the way of combat crew. Perhaps he never embarked a Tactical Officer even though other ships had those, and thus had to make do with his Armory Officer?
- Arguing that technology would make yeomen redundant is a bit futile because it apparently does not apply to the TOS era. The 2260s feature amazing technology already, yet Kirk still needs a bunch of secretaries, and somebody to fold his clothes and heat up his coffee. It appears the role exists despite and regardless of technology. If it does so out of tradition, we can again skip ENT and Archer's incomplete crew as a case study - but we can then argue that the tradition would eventually die out, at an unknown timepoint after we last see yeomen in ST6:TUC (and arguably a Captain's Yeoman in ST5:TFF).
- There's a distinction there, BTW: Pike and Kirk may have been unfamiliar with the concept of a Captain's Yeowoman, but their ships might have featured any arbitrary balance of men, women and assorted others in the other yeoman roles, such as those of Burke and Samno.
- Those other yeomen might still exist in abundance in the TNG era and go quite unnoticed: Picard's troupe basically never spoke with or to the lower-downs, save for LaForge on occasion. It's only a Captain's Yeoman that seems to be missing from the E-D, the E-E and the Voyager. The latter again left port without a full complement, though (Janeway later laments they didn't embark a counselor, say), and the Captain's Yeoman might well have been one of those things deemed unneeded for the brief Maquis hunt mission. Or then she or he was a "Caretaker" casualty, and Janeway felt it improper to draft one of the survivors in this role when the ship was missing a chief engineer!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Orphalesion]

- Arguing that technology would make yeomen redundant is a bit futile because it apparently does not apply to the TOS era. The 2260s feature amazing technology already, yet Kirk still needs a bunch of secretaries, and somebody to fold his clothes and heat up his coffee. It appears the role exists despite and regardless of technology. If it does so out of tradition, we can again skip ENT and Archer's incomplete crew as a case study - but we can then argue that the tradition would eventually die out, at an unknown timepoint after we last see yeomen in ST6:TUC (and arguably a Captain's Yeoman in ST5:TFF).

Not at all, the TOS era is a completely different animal from the TNG era both in and out of universe. Not only did the first season highlight and mention how much technology has improved, but it was also created in the mindset of the 1980s rather than the 1960s, when people were already more familiar with computers and databases and such.
TOS was very much still closer to portraying a Navy ship, and probably had Yeomen as part of that.

 

[Timo]

...But nevertheless had 23rd century tech aboard, not 20th century tech. So the yeomen were there for reasons other than necessity - much like they are on Navy ships, and have been for a while.

Really, TNG tech doesn't show any explicit improvement over TOS tech other than the compacting of the communicators into badges. Everything else is the same: phasers, transporters, shields and PADDs, wall comms and holodecks work the same way, achieving the very same things. We don't get as much as a comparative remark from a character, on how current ships would be faster or current phasers more cutting or current transporters more versatile. And we see no difference in action.

(Oh, yes, the holodecks are better. In every episode. Just like the televisions this Christmas are better. And this affects the plots not one iota.)

Timo Saloniemi