Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

[Pauln6]

Lol. I go away for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose. Whatever happened to good old fashioned bisexual characters? The only thing wrong with Ivanova/Talia was that due to Andrea Thompson wanting to leave they shoe-horned the whole sexual element into just one episode and weakened its story impact.

I don't mind if 'straight' characters are given gay relationships but I'd rather it was done with subtlety, as a non-judgmental, matter of fact part of life.

I find some of the gay references in Dr Who and Tochwood to be unnecessarily overt and sometimes unnecessarily graphic (but I also speak as someone who gets fed up of them wasting time hugging every week when they only have 40 minutes to tell a story). Less can be more.

I think B5's Ivanova, BSG's Gata, Tosh's lesbian affair in Torchwood, and the mature relationship with Jack/Ianto in Children of Earth were well done. The Silurian gay relationship yo-yos from just right to too much, although i confess I am in love with the characters.

It's a tricky balance that runs the risk of polarising people but I'm sure it's only a matter of time until we get a recurring gay action hero in a US show to rival Jack (Jinx is already quite cool in Warehouse 13). Progress is being made but I really don't think the Star Trek movie franchise is looking to make bold moral statements any time soon if Kirk's use of alien hookers is anything to go by.

To summarise: Chapel - yes. Chapel as a love interest for a man or a woman - what would be the point?

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Lol. I go away for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose. Whatever happened to good old fashioned bisexual characters? The only thing wrong with Ivanova/Talia was that due to Andrea Thompson wanting to leave they shoe-horned the whole sexual element into just one episode and weakened its story impact.

But it's fun to rewatch and look for the subtext

I don't mind if 'straight' characters are given gay relationships but I'd rather it was done with subtlety, as a non-judgmental, matter of fact part of life.

I find some of the gay references in Dr Who and Tochwood to be unnecessarily overt and sometimes unnecessarily graphic (but I also speak as someone who gets fed up of them wasting time hugging every week when they only have 40 minutes to tell a story). Less can be more.

I didn't like Jack in Doctor Who but I loved him in Torchwood and I loved his overtness. It felt more shoehorned in Who.

I think B5's Ivanova, BSG's Gata, Tosh's lesbian affair in Torchwood, and the mature relationship with Jack/Ianto in Children of Earth were well done. The Silurian gay relationship yo-yos from just right to too much, although i confess I am in love with the characters.

Agree with it all except I will take all the hot Silurian over the topness I can get The characters are adorable and cartoonish but also perfect.

To summarise: Chapel - yes. Chapel as a love interest for a man or a woman - what would be the point?

Totally agree. I really don't care if we ever see Chapel, though if they went with a series it might be interesting to have her, if they pretty much revamped her.

 

[borgboy]

I think Chapel and McCoy as a couple could be cute. It would be fun to see McCoy be flustered and shy in a new romance for example. I doubt it would ever be brought back, but a story with Korby and his androids could be interesting. It's a shame we don't have time for all the many stories we'd like to see and just get one movie every two or three years. I think if Uhura and Spock had the comfortable pacing of a tv series I'd probably like them together better. As it is, I was still shocked by them being a couple in the first movie, and did like them better by the second movie, they'd benefit from more time to tell their story.
And yes, I am able to enjoy media on different levels, and can apprecate Spock and Uhura while still shipping Spock and Kirk.
As for all the earlier unpleasantness, I was shocked to see the gay slur earlier. Of course I've heard it before, but it's hateful and doesn't belong here. I like to think Cara007 really didn't mean any harm, but she did know to use "the N word" and not an actual racial slur, so to follow that up with repeated use of a gay slur gives me pause.

 

[BillJ]

Bring Chapel back? Sure, pick a hot actress and let's get some hot lesbian action going. Maybe even a three-way.

I'll be a Uhura/Chapel/Carol Marcus shipper.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Well we're gender bending the main cast in the Future of Trek forum so you can ship K/S/M if you want AND have it be all about girls.

 

[CorporalClegg]

Well we're gender bending the main cast in the Future of Trek forum so you can ship K/S/M if you want AND have it be all about girls.

Yes please.

 

[Cara007]

As always, let's keep the discussion about movies, characters, writing, and the like, and try not to make this about other fans or fan groups.

Also: Cara007, there had to be a way you could have made your points in this post without resorting to the use of derogatory language, even if not used as a direct insult. Please be more careful about that in the future; any further such instances may result in warnings being issued.

Thanks for the warning. I was not too sure of the other F word, I will be careful next time.

borgboy: No I did not mean any harm. The only reason why I did not use the N word was because it has way more of a bad history especially with slavery. I just thought the word was light years more offensive than the other F word.

 

[Use of Time]

Ok what does shipping mean?

[ducks]

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

It comes from the word relationship. It means who you would like in fiction to be in a relationship. So in Voyager fandom you have the J/C shippers who were rooting for Janeway and Chakotay to end up togther and the J/7 shippers who were rooting for Janeway and 7 to end up together. People refer to themselves as shippers sometimes to indicate that is a big part of their fandom interests.

Even though I have two shipping preferences (J/7 and K/S) I don't call myself a shipper because I'm not really into relationships in fiction much, or romance.

 

[BillJ]

Am I the only one thinking this thread is now officially a train wreck?

 

[borgboy]

As always, let's keep the discussion about movies, characters, writing, and the like, and try not to make this about other fans or fan groups.

Also: Cara007, there had to be a way you could have made your points in this post without resorting to the use of derogatory language, even if not used as a direct insult. Please be more careful about that in the future; any further such instances may result in warnings being issued.

Thanks for the warning. I was not too sure of the other F word, I will be careful next time.

borgboy: No I did not mean any harm. The only reason why I did not use the N word was because it has way more of a bad history especially with slavery. I just thought the word was light years more offensive than the other F word.

I'm not going to debate which word is worse. They're both hateful slurs, and regardless of which word is worse, they're both not appropriate to be used, especially in a public forum.
I'll take your word that you didn't mean any harm. Unfortuantely, sometimes people can offend and hurt other people without intent when they don't think about what they're saying. There are times when I have to put up with that kind of hate talk because to challenge it would be putting my safety and well being at risk, but nobody should have to hear that kind of talk here.
On the subject of gender swap, I remember years ago reading an offical Star Trek short story, not unlicenced fan fic, where the Enterprise crew is gender swapped for some bizarre reason, except for Spock, and it was pretty clear that he was attracted to lady Kirk. I wish I knew what that was from, it would be from the 70s or 80s. I'm amazed that got published, but like the slash-tastic novel Killing Time, these things slipped thru now and then.
I ship a lot of characters. Kirk and Spock, Troi and Riker, Picard and Beverly, Calhoun and Shelby. I'm not quite to the point where I think of myself as a Spock/Uhura shipper yet, but I'm warming up to them. If their relationship is handled well in the next movie I might get there.
Funny enough, I just started watching my new TOS blu rays, and I was pleasantly surprised by how flirtacious Uhura is with Spock in The Man Trap. And then Spock gets borderline emotional when the salt vampire attacks Kirk. Something for everybody

 

[Melakon]

On the subject of gender swap, I remember years ago reading an offical Star Trek short story, not unlicenced fan fic, where the Enterprise crew is gender swapped for some bizarre reason, except for Spock, and it was pretty clear that he was attracted to lady Kirk. I wish I knew what that was from, it would be from the 70s or 80s. I'm amazed that got published, but like the slash-tastic novel Killing Time, these things slipped thru now and then.

During that time period, there were two books published by Pocket (or whoever held the license) that were collections of fan fiction, under the titles New Voyages and New Voyages II. I think the editors were Marshak and Culbreath, but I can't connect to Memory Alpha to confirm. Could that be where you read it?

 

[borgboy]

That sounds very likely. I log ago lost the book, I was a kid when I read it, but I'll try to track down a new copy. Thanks!

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Someone posted a gender swap TOS comic (licensed) pic recently.. somewhere in this BBS Girl Kirk was wearing the green wrap around shirt as a short dress, it was rather fetching.

 

[borgboy]

I'd love to see that if anybody can help me figure out where it is in the forums. What's the comic's name? I've just started collecting the IDW comics, but I haven't seen that.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I will look.. I think it was posted in whatever thread generated the idea for the gender swap thread..

edit: can't find it. I will ask the thread.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

It comes from the word relationship. It means who you would like in fiction to be in a relationship. So in Voyager fandom you have the J/C shippers who were rooting for Janeway and Chakotay to end up togther and the J/7 shippers who were rooting for Janeway and 7 to end up together. People refer to themselves as shippers sometimes to indicate that is a big part of their fandom interests.

Even though I have two shipping preferences (J/7 and K/S) I don't call myself a shipper because I'm not really into relationships in fiction much, or romance.

So would Scotty/Enterprise be considered a ship?

 

[borgboy]

I wouldn't have thought of that, but I'm sure somebody somewhere writes Scotty/Enterprise romantic fiction, so sure, whatever.

 

[Pauln6]

Lol. I go away for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose. Whatever happened to good old fashioned bisexual characters? The only thing wrong with Ivanova/Talia was that due to Andrea Thompson wanting to leave they shoe-horned the whole sexual element into just one episode and weakened its story impact.

But it's fun to rewatch and look for the subtext

This is it in a nutshell for me. If you put in stuff that's open to interpretation, the fans will run with it in whatever direction suits them and in some ways that's far more fun! Kirk/Spock speaks for itself - lol.

If Rand were to feature more heavily, all I'd want is the odd furtive glance or intake of breath. The fans would know what it was about. No need to waste dialogue or plot time on it, just a wink. If Trek goes gay, that would be enough for me as well.

Phase II did a nice gay plot point and it actually wasn't bad but there was a bedroom scene that went on waaaay too long. The best bit was one of the opening lines:

"Guess who?"
"Mr Sulu?"
"You wish."

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Oh My.

(I guess that was rather obvious.. )