Would Voyager have been better

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by suarezguy, Aug 30, 2020.

  1. suarezguy

    suarezguy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If the second crew, or a third crew, added to the ship crew had been Cardassians (Evek's ship and crew) or Romulans?

    Or would that have really been too different a series to really compare?
     
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  2. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    No, because the higher-ups at UPN dictated that there should be no conflict among the crew. So they could have had Romulans, Cardassians, or even Gorn, and everyone would have gotten along just fine.
     
  3. STEPhon IT

    STEPhon IT Commodore Commodore

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    I wouldn't want to see a Star Trek series where's elements of mutiny every week, that would get old real fast. There are other ways to create conflict and not in the path to overrule the Captain, but if the Captain was fresh off of a science ship and Voyager was her first commission she would still have all these high end ethics of Starfleet. What if those ethics get challenged and she's stuck at the farthest end of the galaxy, as she has little to no experience in battle or strategic fighting? This would be a learning curve for the Captain. That would be a Captain I would want to root for every week and eventually become one of the greatest Captain's ever on TV. It's too bad the producers didn't want to do the hard work and decided to make Janeway the greatest Captain ever without earning it.
     
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  4. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'd have liked to have seen more crews added as the ship traversed the quadrant, recovering people from other Alpha and Beta Quadrant races (as what happened with the Equinox crew), so they could've picked up the survivors of a Romulan science ship, or welcomed onboard the crew of a Bajoran Militia patrol ship, etc. End up with a mixture of friends and foes (and neutrals) onboard to help inject some more diversity into the mix.
     
  5. Orphalesion

    Orphalesion Commodore Commodore

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    ^ This.
    The problem with Voyager wasn't the tools they had at their dispose, it was the mandate that it had to be TNG-lite that didn't allow them to take advantage of all the tools they had.
    If they had been given freedom to add more conflict, the Marquis would have been more than enough to create a plethora of plots and storylines.
     
  6. DarKush

    DarKush Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think having the Cardassians opposed to the Maquis, or mixed in with the Maquis would've been nice. A lot of potential for drama there and we could see some really nice divergent points of view and some nice arcs as the characters learn to trust and value each other and become a united crew. I would've loved to have seen the episode when they learned about the Dominion War. It perhaps could've been a way to do a DS9 crossover.
     
  7. SiddFinch1

    SiddFinch1 Captain Captain

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    A whole mixed crew of Cardies or Romulans may have been tough. Keeping Seska or a Cardie observer and/or adding a Romulan survivor of the Caretaker would be interesting
     
  8. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Here's a wild pitch for a new take on Voyager: the 9/10 characters that make up the main cast are all the crew that are onboard an alien ship, and all of them are from different species/governments (a mix of friendly, hostile, and neutral). Each of them wake up on an unknown ship deep in the Delta Quadrant, where they learn that each of them is needed by an entity known as the Caretaker in order to save an innocent species, with the promise that they will be returned home, but of course once they complete their task, the aggressive Kazon attacks the ship and the Caretaker is mortally wounded and can't send them back. With the entity dead, the diverse group must begin their voyage home, on a vessel they don't know, crossing a quadrant they have very little information on, and find a way to all work together in order to achieve their shared goal.
     
  9. Orac Zen

    Orac Zen Mischief Manager Super Moderator

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    Exactly. All the complaining about the "lack of conflict" can be laid solely at UPN's door. If Voyager's creators had had the lack of network restrictions enjoyed by the DS9 showrunners (or those of the much-vaunted nBSG), it would have been a very different show. Whether or not it would have been "better" is a moot point. It didn't happen. Such is life.
     
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  10. Oddish

    Oddish Fleet Captain Captain

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    Cardassians would have taken over the ship and chucked Janeway out the airlock. Then, they would have accidentally blown up the Caretaker array, given the Kazon replicator technology in turn for their allegiance, crushed the Ocampa, genocided the Vidiians when they stole someone's lungs, and built up a brutal empire. In about 25 years, they would have figured out how to use Ocampa mind powers to make their ships go really fast, and would have invaded the Federation.

    The Romulans would have simply beamed aboard the Caretaker array, zapped everyone home, and left the Ocampa to the Kazon.
     
  11. Makarov

    Makarov Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    To me there seemed to be plenty of conflict among the crew so I'm sure they could have done it. Just going on s1 and s2 there's like 3 or 4 episodes where Tuvok isnt getting along with the crew or Chakotay clashing with him. Then Chakotay deals with the insubordinate Maquis crew member by punching him in the face. Tuvok and Neelix certainly didnt get along.

    One episode had Neelix and Tom covered in Spaghetti after beating eachother up. There is conflict in the crew. It's just the wrapped-up-within-the-episode variety of conflict which is kind of an enjoyable break from other shows these days in my opinion.
     
  12. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Commodore Commodore

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    I would have liked a bit more "Firefly crew and Enterprise crew on the same ship" for some tension but there's a penumbra between, "Mutiny and Everyone loves everyone."

    Oddly, I felt the character who most needed change wasn't Chakotay's group but Neelix.

    I liked the Neelix in the pilot in that HE was the untrustworthy rogue they had aboard.
     
  13. WarpTenLizard

    WarpTenLizard Commander Red Shirt

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    There's a whole AU fanfic about this. Of.........mixed quality and tone.
     
  14. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Lack of kumbaya doesn't automatically translate to mutiny. Think more multiple groups of people who have to work together, but don't want to be around each other, don't wish to associate.

    I've been employed places where the workers couldn't stand each other.

    So on Voyager not mutiny, not open fighting, but the friction would obvious.

    Starfleet, Maquis, Cardassian, Romulan.

    Make it such that no combination of the groups is large enough to run the ship effectively with one group missing. Which is the only reason they joined together in the first place.

    Briefing room scenes would have a representative of each group in attendance. While Janeway would solely command the ship in combat, non-combat decisions would be a consensus.

    They would all have their own unique type of dress, only Starfleet wears Starfleet uniforms.
     
  15. at Quark's

    at Quark's Commodore Commodore

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    The Maquis didn't have fundamentally different values from Starfleet, they just disagreed on a particular issue. Also, Starfleet was more at war with the Maquis than the Maquis were with Starfleet (i.e. it was Starfleet that needed to weed the Maquis out because otherwise their treaty with the Cardassians would be in danger, whereas the Maquis at least initially said they had no quarrel with Starfleet).

    Looked at it that way, it makes sense that the Maquis and the Starfleet crews quickly settled their differences. There simply was nothing substantial to fight over in the DQ, except possibly for the resentment that perhaps had been building in the last 3 years or so.

    The Cardassians would be a whole different level of conflict given that their morals and values are so profoundly different. Imagining a sizeable Cardassian complement having to share Voyager with the remnants of the original crew .... frankly I'm not sure the Federation crew would have survived without at least ditching some of their Federation values.I mean, look how much trouble one Seska caused. Now, how about 45 of them (probably not all as brilliant and dangerous as her, but still) ?
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
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  16. Oddish

    Oddish Fleet Captain Captain

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    That's actually true, and it explains why the two crews came together relatively quickly and easily. The source of their conflict was 70,000 light years away... and as of Season 4, gone period.
     
  17. WarpTenLizard

    WarpTenLizard Commander Red Shirt

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    A mixed crew or fleet of ships from various organizations from the Alpha Quadrant having to get home, with the Starfleet protagonists just trying to keep them all from killing each other, would be brilliant! But probably more than the writers wanted to bite off at the time, and maybe too similar to DS9.

    Even so, keeping Seska on Voyager after being outed as a Cardassian, and maybe finding some excuse to get Romulans or Dominion species onboard, would have been great.
     
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  18. Oddish

    Oddish Fleet Captain Captain

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    It would be interesting to see how various races would react to the journey.
    I see the Klingons happily sharing replicator technology with the Kazon, and forming an alliance of warriors. The Hirogen might come aboard as well. They would do business with the Vidiians, since Klingon DNA seems to be phage resistant. By the time new technology makes trans transgalactic travel feasible, there might be a flourishing second Klingon Empire in the Delta Quadrant.

    The Ferengi would exploit the crap out of the Kazon, selling them water at exorbitant prices. Eventually, the Kazon would overrun them and gain replicator technology for themselves.

    The Cardassians would probably overrun the Ocampa, because they like bullying weaker species like the Bajorans. As for how they would deal with the Kazon, look no further than Seska.
     
  19. at Quark's

    at Quark's Commodore Commodore

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    I doubt it. If the Kazon lack anything, it's a sense of honour. The only thing that I've seen in that direction, is the young Kazon having to prove they are no longer a boy by killing someone in battle, and even then it doesn't seem to matter too much if the 'opponent' is defenseless. That's not to say all Klingons are so honourable, even within their own value system, but at least the 'better' ones are.

    Even the Borg would add the Klingon to their collective (by mouth of Locutus), but reject the Kazon (Seven of Nine).
     
  20. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Immediate improvement.