Spoilers Wonder Woman - Grading & Discussion

[Kai "the spy"]

Meh. It's a pretty standard Studio trick. If I recall correctly, Warner Brothers tried to do something similar by attempting to put Batman versus Superman in the same weekend as Civil War. Sometimes it's just a matter of two Studios facing each other down over a date and see who blinks first.

Actually, Disney had claimed the first May weekend, which is the most lucrative release date of the year, for years with Marvel movies, and did so well in advance. The first May weekend of 2016 was set for the release of a Marvel movie as far back as 2013 (and they set another unnamed Marvel movie for May 5, 2017, which turned out to be GotG2, at the same time), back then people expected it to be Doctor Strange or Black Panther.

WB obviously was (and probably still is) still pissed about Marvel claiming that release date every year, so announcing BvS for the same weekend was a strategic move to challenge Disney's claim for the best release date of the year every year. If it had been Doctor Strange or Black Panther, they would have stuck with that plan and Marvel would have changed the release date. But Disney didn't want to do so, and instead of a movie starring a new hero, they went with the 3rd Captain America, coming on the heels of the very successful Winter Soldier, and soon after to be announced to be co-starring Iron Man (after IM3 broke the billion dollar mark) and several other MCU characters, and introducing Spider-Man into the MCU.

So, basically, Disney defended their claim on the most lucrative release date of the year by one-upping BvS on several fronts. And since the MCU was so well established, they could risk one bad first weekend, while WB had their whole DC movie franchise set on BvS. Ultimately, WB had everything to lose, and that's why they ultimately changed the release date.

But Disney has a pattern of trying to spoil the success of competing franchises like that. When BvS was announced for Good Friday of 2016, suddenly that was the weekend Netflix would release the 2nd season of Daredevil. When Avatar 2 was set to be release in December 2017, Disney pushed Star Wars from its original summer release date to December. WB's marketing for JL and other DC projects was fought by whenever they'd make an announcement or release new material, Disney/Marvel would follow with something of their own in a matter of days (to the point that Kevin Smith even spoke about it in his podcasts), and this weekend will not only see the release of JL in theatres, but also of The Punisher on Netflix.

You can debate how effective they are, but at this point, it's pretty clear, Disney is a big bully, and not just doing "standart studio tricks".

 

[Kai "the spy"]

Mind you, I'm not talking about the creative people at Marvel or Lucasfilm who have it out for the competition. Quite the opposite, as people like James Gunn and Kevin Feige have recently shown. But they don't decide when one of their productions is released. There's a distinction between the people that make the movies (and TV shows) and the suits that are all about business dominance, the Disney corporate suits.

 

[Skywalker]

You can debate how effective they are, but at this point, it's pretty clear, Disney is a big bully, and not just doing "standart studio tricks".

How is that bullying? Disney isn't obligated to let Warner Bros. or Fox--their competitors--succeed. And it's not like WB or Fox are some small independent distributors being beaten up on by big, bad Disney.

 

[Hound of UIster]

A corporation taking advantage of its market dominance to hurt competitors is frowned upon in certainly more regulated parts of the world like the European Union. Perhaps it is time for the European Commission to take a look at Disney like it did with Google.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Gal Gadot clarifies the removal of Brett Ratner situation, saying that it was already said and done before she even had the chance to saying anything and before the Page Six article came out (around the 3:45 mark):

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[Dream]

Wonder Woman Director Patty Jenkins and Gal Gadot Talk Shared Dream

http://deadline.com/2017/12/wonder-...enkins-warner-bros-interview-news-1202225743/

The first day Patty Jenkins and Gal Gadot met, they slipped into a sushi restaurant and didn’t stop talking for four hours. “Both of us were so passionate about so many topics,” says Gadot. “Family life, World War II, the Holocaust, humans, race, politics. We were upset and we were happy and we were thrilled.”

That conversation is still ongoing. Months after their film, Wonder Woman, became the summer’s biggest hit, the pair continue to fizz with chemistry, so much that they speak in sync—they don’t just agree, they overlap, both voices filling the room at once like two harmonious guitars.

“We realized very quickly that we wanted to do the same thing,” says Jenkins. They dreamed of making a classic, Richard Donner-style superhero movie—“a tentpole of yesteryear”—that was exciting and romantic and funny and, above all, inspirational. Jenkins hadn’t...

Nice interview. Patty and Gal seem to hit it off very quickly.

 

[Captrek]

Is Diana a hypocrite?

When Charlie tells her he's a sniper and his victims never knew what hit them, she says he fights without honor and even calls him a murderer.

But how is it any more honorable to use her superpowers to kill German soldiers? A bullet-proof super-powered demigodess is something they could never see coming, and can't possibly anticipate or defend against.

How is Charlie any less honorable than Diana in the respective ways they fight?

 

[Trekker4747]

It's more "honorable" to face the person you intend to kill, to see them and "connect" with them in some manner rather than killing from the shadows and distance never having to acknowledge the being whose life you're about to end.

 

[Gov Kodos]

It's just bad writing. Though, knights felt the same way about archers. It's not especially insightful, at best its the moaning of a social class outmoded by technology. For the price of a few shillings, some peasant could take out what cost great wealth in armor, horse, training, yada, yada... oh, yeah, and honor. Welcome to Agincourt.

 

[Tosk]

Movie Diana is a bit of a turd anyway. Killing combatants that are helpless against her (but it's okay because they're evil!) and telling the dude with PTSD to just get over it (but it's okay because they win the day in the end!) to walking away from man's world because the war was a major bummer (but it's okay because TPTB changed their minds about it!).

 

[Anwar]

That, and the writers were too cowardly to put her in real danger. She can't be harmed by any of the German Soldiers, and when she fights Ares she suddenly pulls out all these nebulous powers that for whatever reason she never used on Doomsday or Steppenwolf.

 

[Set Harth]

It's possible all that would just make Doomsday stronger.

 

[Gaith]

But how is it any more honorable to use her superpowers to kill German soldiers? A bullet-proof super-powered demigodess is something they could never see coming, and can't possibly anticipate or defend against.

Maybe, but remember, those damn Great War Krauts were perpetrating the Holocaust, so it makes sense to demonize them.

Hold up, wha -

It's more "honorable" to face the person you intend to kill, to see them and "connect" with them in some manner rather than killing from the shadows and distance never having to acknowledge the being whose life you're about to end.

Which is why we got those powerful scenes of Diana mourning the loss of those she'd killed, and dreading the mere thought of having to do so again.

Oh, wait, there were no su-

 

[Tosk]

It's possible all that would just make Doomsday stronger.

And Steppenwolf...?

 

[The Realist]

So, is this now the Wonder Woman backlash thread?

 

[Ovation]

So, is this now the Wonder Woman backlash thread?

Open long enough, don't all threads eventually become "backlash threads"?

 

[dahj]

So, is this now the Wonder Woman backlash thread?

Most of those people have been lashing at it way before it was even released, so I don't think that counts as backlash, it's just the usual...

 

[Anwar]

It's possible all that would just make Doomsday stronger.

Doomsday can't adapt to everything, if something atomizes him...he's gone.

And she wasn't doing so hot against Steppenwolf, when all her nebulous powers from the fight with Ares would've helped.

 

[Dream]

There is no backlash.

Just a vocal minority feeling the need to nitpick the movie.

People complain that WW shouldn't beat up human enemies, when Captain American does that exact same thing in his movies with zero complaints. Cap was doing something very similar beating up terrorists to save hostages in The Winter Solider. No silly outrage when he sent people flying off ships with his kicks, but I guess it is ok because he is a... guy?

Also those WW1 scenes were never about WW being in danger, but about her discovering her limits as a fighter. It was about her being heroic and inspiring which DCEU Superman has completely failed to be.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

There is no backlash.

Just a vocal minority feeling the need to nitpick the movie.

Probably as its the best female superhero adaptation--movie or TV--ever produced, and some know other female superhero films will be compared to WW...and probably fall short...or off of a quality cliff.

People complain that WW shouldn't beat up human enemies, when Captain American does that exact same thing in his movies with zero complaints. Cap was doing something very similar beating up terrorists to save hostages in The Winter Solider. No silly outrage when he sent people flying off ships with his kicks, but I guess it is ok because he is a... guy?

That's right. In all of Cap's MCU appearances, he's killing antagonists left and right, and without a moment of hesitation or afterthought about killing non-powered humans. His purpose is true, so he--like Wonder Woman--cannot be held to some standard of holding back against an enemy that most certainly will not (WW1 enemies for WW, Hydra, Nazis,and others for Cap).