Wonder Woman and Batman's current continuity
- Thread starter EJA
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Yes Diana has been in some altered reality and just started interacting with the other heroes. In the latest issue of "Superman" he just met her and she was inspired by his example to be a better hero. Superman though thinks he knows Diana but there was no time for them to talk. So this is just part of JMS's plot.
Unless I'm missing something, Final Crisis had nothing to do with the recent changes to Wonder Woman.
Either way, it seems as if most of the world has been made to forget Wonder Woman, except for a unique group.
Max Lord, who in the lead-up to Infinite Crisis was revealed to be working behind the scenes to ensure the supremacy of the "regular" man, took control of Superman through his mind-controlling powers. To stop him, the JLA fought him, but he ended up severely beating Batman. This was too much for Wonder Woman, who took off after him, finding Max. Wonder Woman used her Lasso of Truth on Max, who admitted the only way to stop his use of Superman was to kill him, which Wonder Woman did.
At the end of Blackest Night, Max was one of the resurrected characters and in Brightest Day it was revealed his task, in exchange for returned life, was to prevent Magog from causing the events in Kingdom Come from occurring. One of Max's first acts was to evade the heroes, who, upon his resurrection, was named Public Enemy #1. A combined force of heroes was assembled, but Booster Gold was the one who stumbled onto what Max was doing, which happened to be using the old New York Justice League embassy to launch a psychic attack which wiped his existence from everyone on Earth's mind. Max savagely beat Booster, who signaled for help, only to be answered by his old Justice League compatriots, Ice, Fire, and Captain Atom. The four heroes were at "Ground Zero" of Max's psychic attack, which made them immune to it, rendering them the only four people on Earth, aside from Max himself who knew Max Lord even existed.
Eventually, they recruited the new Blue Beetle and another Rocket Red, but they have been on the run. Max arranged for Magog to square off against Captain Atom with a rigged weapon, which exploded, killing Magog and returning life to Max. Max used his powers to frame Captain Atom for the incident, knowing the energy overload would launch him into the time stream, making it seems as if he killed Magog and ran. Captain Atom ended up in the future where he learned that things were bad due to Max killing Wonder Woman.
Returning to the present, Captain Atom fills in his League, when they find out that only Fire, Ice, Booster, and Captain Atom remember Wonder Woman. Blue Beetle and Rocket Red have no clue who she is. At the same time, Max is finding out that he is the only one on his side who remembers her, despite the fact that she is a key component in his plan. He laughs when he recognizes the irony in this situation, as he realizes she somehow was able to erase herself from people's memories, just as he was able to do.
So, currently, it seems that only the four Justice League alums and Max remember her.
Either way, it seems as if most of the world has been made to forget Wonder Woman, except for a unique group.
Max Lord, who in the lead-up to Infinite Crisis was revealed to be working behind the scenes to ensure the supremacy of the "regular" man, took control of Superman through his mind-controlling powers. To stop him, the JLA fought him, but he ended up severely beating Batman. This was too much for Wonder Woman, who took off after him, finding Max. Wonder Woman used her Lasso of Truth on Max, who admitted the only way to stop his use of Superman was to kill him, which Wonder Woman did.
At the end of Blackest Night, Max was one of the resurrected characters and in Brightest Day it was revealed his task, in exchange for returned life, was to prevent Magog from causing the events in Kingdom Come from occurring. One of Max's first acts was to evade the heroes, who, upon his resurrection, was named Public Enemy #1. A combined force of heroes was assembled, but Booster Gold was the one who stumbled onto what Max was doing, which happened to be using the old New York Justice League embassy to launch a psychic attack which wiped his existence from everyone on Earth's mind. Max savagely beat Booster, who signaled for help, only to be answered by his old Justice League compatriots, Ice, Fire, and Captain Atom. The four heroes were at "Ground Zero" of Max's psychic attack, which made them immune to it, rendering them the only four people on Earth, aside from Max himself who knew Max Lord even existed.
Eventually, they recruited the new Blue Beetle and another Rocket Red, but they have been on the run. Max arranged for Magog to square off against Captain Atom with a rigged weapon, which exploded, killing Magog and returning life to Max. Max used his powers to frame Captain Atom for the incident, knowing the energy overload would launch him into the time stream, making it seems as if he killed Magog and ran. Captain Atom ended up in the future where he learned that things were bad due to Max killing Wonder Woman.
Returning to the present, Captain Atom fills in his League, when they find out that only Fire, Ice, Booster, and Captain Atom remember Wonder Woman. Blue Beetle and Rocket Red have no clue who she is. At the same time, Max is finding out that he is the only one on his side who remembers her, despite the fact that she is a key component in his plan. He laughs when he recognizes the irony in this situation, as he realizes she somehow was able to erase herself from people's memories, just as he was able to do.
So, currently, it seems that only the four Justice League alums and Max remember her.
I really have to thank you for the synopsis. I haven't followed any big crossover since "52" and after reading the recent "Power Girl" I was kind of wondering what the heck was going on!
Final Crisis had nothing to do with Diana's current alternate reality. As I stated this is part of JMS's "All New, All Different Wonder Woman". Well they remembered Diana for one issue until Max wiped her from their memories again...I'm guessing now that also Bruce Wayne knows about Diana's altered state after exposure to the White Lantern Ring since it opened his mind up to Max's existence, although admittedly that is a presumption on my part. Bruce hasn't exactly had time to deal with either of these things yet.
No problem. Justice League: Generation Lost has been surprisingly great, considering I'm not a huge fan of Judd Winnick's writing. With a few glaring exceptions (Ice's new origin), it's been one of my favorite titles recently.
Max had nothing to do with the world forgetting about Wonder Woman, he was as surprised no one remembered as anyone. Bruce did indicate he knew about Max following his brief exposure to the White Ring, but nothing, as of yet has been done with that.
I'm glad it sounds as though they're still acknowledging all the old WW stories.
I can't help wondering what's become of her old friends like Steve Trevor and Etta Candy, and Julie and Vanessa Kapetelis? Have their memories of Diana been erased too?
Is the first meeting between Batman and Superman now completely different to how it was in the original post-COIE 'verse?
I can't help wondering what's become of her old friends like Steve Trevor and Etta Candy, and Julie and Vanessa Kapetelis? Have their memories of Diana been erased too?
Is the first meeting between Batman and Superman now completely different to how it was in the original post-COIE 'verse?
I never said that Max had anything to do with the world not knowing who Diana was. I said that Max wiped the memories of the four JLIers who did remember. Power Girl forgets herself too and doesn't remember why she was even at their base in the issue.
Actually...it depends on who you read in regards to the Magpie case. It has been mentioned in recent issues of Superman/Batman which is kind of back in continuity now (some arcs are some aren't). I don't think it's been retconned completely. Nothing has really done with their first meeting in a long time.
Actually...it depends on who you read in regards to the Magpie case. It has been mentioned in recent issues of Superman/Batman which is kind of back in continuity now (some arcs are some aren't). I don't think it's been retconned completely. Nothing has really done with their first meeting in a long time.
I wouldn't say, exactly, that it's been tossed. Rather, they've added meetings between Clark and Bruce before they Superman and Batman. I think their first meeting now is about a year after Bruce's parents were gunned down. (It was a Loeb/Sale story in an issue of Superman/Batman.)
While it's cute to think that Bruce and Clark were both little boys at the same time, I've come around to the idea that DC needs to decouple their origins and let Bruce be a decade older than Clark. The Robins and their tenures age Bruce up to about fifty, but Clark and Lois aren't fifty and they would be if Bruce and Clark are the same age. I understand the appeal of keeping Batman and Superman perpetually thirty-five, but it doesn't make any realistic sense any longer.
I think DC has it that Bruce was 25 years old when he debuted as Batman as per "Batman: Year One" and that he's around 39 or something like that. Same as Clark. They are supposed to be about a year apart in age.
According to the current DC Timeline we're at Year Thirteen...so do the math. 25 plus 13 is 38. Why is hard to believe that Clark and Bruce are that old?
It's a Superman/Batman annual, isn't it? Bruce and Clark have to go on a cruise together, and they learned each other's secret identities. And they have to sleep in the same bed, too.
Because it just doesn't work like that - it doesn't matter how the numbers add up, Bruce and Clark aren't suppose to be nearly 40. There's no point trying to make sense of it, it just doesn't work. You can't get all of this stuff to fit together.
For example, First Thunder establishes that Billy Baston becomes Captain Marvel during Year one - he's about 10, so he pre-dates Dick Grayson - but he's currently about 17. Now someone is going to say "Magic" but absolurely nothing is said in the comics that being Captain Marvel retards his aging.
It's not consistent and there is no way to make it consistent. Things come in and out of the backstories as needed - for example, Chase has the characters go to watch a film based on the life of Hal Jordan and his identity is common knowledge. It works for that story, it's never mentioned anywhere again (and also the internal time-scale of that issue puts Year 1 as happening at a different time from your year one).
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I'm not trying to make sense of it I'm going with the math based on DC's latest version of their timeline which I think came out after "Infinite Crisis". Just before the Lost Year fiasco.
@Allyn Gibson...yeah the first Superman/Batman annual written by Joe Casey I think established that Bruce and Clark met on a cruise. Although I don't think that was meant to be considered canon. In that story they take on Ultraman, Owlman, and Superwoman. Casey intended this to be an imaginary tale not canon. Which is why it's cleverly titled "Stop me if you've heard this one..."
@Allyn Gibson...yeah the first Superman/Batman annual written by Joe Casey I think established that Bruce and Clark met on a cruise. Although I don't think that was meant to be considered canon. In that story they take on Ultraman, Owlman, and Superwoman. Casey intended this to be an imaginary tale not canon. Which is why it's cleverly titled "Stop me if you've heard this one..."
I don't have a problem believing that Clark is that old. However, I believe that Bruce has to be older by five to ten years. The Robins make it so.
If Bruce was twenty-five when he became Batman, then he was twenty-seven when he took on Dick Grayson as Robin. Traditionally, Dick was eight, though I would accept an argument for ten to thirteen. (Batman: Year Three makes the latter number more likely, because of the relative ages of Dick and Tim in that story.)
Dick was Robin until his early college years, so between seven and twelve years. This would make Bruce between thirty-four and thirty-nine when Dick becomes Nightwing.
Jason was Robin for a year at most. Bruce would be between thirty-five and forty when Jason dies.
Tim is thirteen when he becomes Robin. He doesn't become Robin immediately after Jason's death, but at a minimum (because of a gap between Dick and Jason and a gap between Jason and Tim), it's likely two years after Dick's retirement as Robin. Bruce would be between thirty-six and forty-one.
Tim's age is a indeterminate, but he's likely eighteen given his role in Wayne Enterprises. (Also, Stephanie's college career makes eighteen for Tim likely.) Bruce would be between forty-one and forty-six.
So, thirty-nine isn't wildly off the mark, but you have to assume that Dick was into his teens when he became Robin. (A recent Streets of Gotham issue pegged Bruce at thirty-four, though, and that's impossible.) The thing that muddles the age issue is Damian's conception and when it happened. If Son of the Demon (or, rather, Grant Morrison's conception of it) happens after Dick goes to college (as would have been the continuity as it was understood at the time), then Dick would now be at a minimum thirty (minimum nineteen, plus nine months Damian gestation, plus Damian's ten years), which would make Bruce between forty-four and forty-nine.
In other words, Bruce's age is one of those things not to think about.
Yeah all their ages are really sketchy things...
That's good. I like that story with Magpie. Another one of their earlier adventures together had Batman and Supes battling vampires in a small town somewhere in Louisiana, I think; that was a cool story, hope it's still canon.
But what about Steve and Candy, Julie and Vanessa?
They exist in regular DCU continuity but I don't think they've been seen in the JMS pocket universe, weird thingy. Steve was married to Etta Candy. Julie and Diana had troubles with their friendship but had reconciled before Diana's reality altered.
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