Why was 7/C so disliked?

[Guy Gardener]

One story I read got them together in a way that makes sense, but goes into some dark territory.

The episode where the Hirogen turned the ship into a killing ground and made the crew think they were other people, unable to remember their real identities, included a Nazi scenario. Seven was a freedom fighter and Chakotay was an American who came to liberate the town.

The story has the premise that Chakotay and Seven's alter-egos had sex, and Seven became pregnant as a result. She did not discover this until some time after that situation had been dealt with and the Hirogen were gone.

To say it was a shock to both of them would be mild, as it was strictly speaking non-consensual (neither of them in their proper, consenting minds). But Chakotay decided that he wanted to give this situation a chance, and so they became close... eventually becoming a family.

The Hirogen had had the ship for a month.

Naomi had been in her room the whole time, which means that some of the crew, some of the time are confined to quarters to cool down rather being constantly played to exhaustion on the holodeck.

On DS9 Sisko and Cassiday went to the Doctor once a month for a contraceptive shot. As long as one of them had an active dose inside them they were both safe. The Doctor on Voyager would have been on top of that, especially if no one was in their right minds and not using temporally appropriate contraceptives for 15th century Klingons or 20th century yanks abroad.

"I guess" that the Hirogen got bored easy and phased out simulations after 3 or 4 days, since we saw them about to move on to The Battle of Wolf 357, because they were dog tired of France.

It's conceivable that Chakotay and Seven might have hooked up, even though her character was a lesbian, but here's who I really think sent half the crew to the maternity ward: Neelix.

Post Battle Orgy.

"Because later that night, Kahless and Lukara jumped on each other like a pair of crazed voles. Grrr."

 

[Dee1891]

It's conceivable that Chakotay and Seven might have hooked up, even though her character was a lesbian, but here's who I really think sent half the crew to the maternity ward: Neelix.

Had it ever occurred to you that Seven might be bisexual?

Jeri Ryan and Michelle Hurd have great chemistry on "Picard". But my main problem with the Raffi/Seven relationship is that it was rushed. It was more than rushed. It had popped up out of the blue at the end of "Picard" Season One. It was fortunate that the two actresses have great screen chemistry. I had the same problem with Seven's romance with Chakotay. I've always found the two characters' interactions with each other very interested since early Season Four of "Voyager". But the showrunners should have allowed any romance between Seven and Chakotay to develop . . . long before it actually did near the end of the series' run.

 

[Timewalker]

The Hirogen had had the ship for a month.

Naomi had been in her room the whole time, which means that some of the crew, some of the time are confined to quarters to cool down rather being constantly played to exhaustion on the holodeck.

On DS9 Sisko and Cassiday went to the Doctor once a month for a contraceptive shot. As long as one of them had an active dose inside them they were both safe. The Doctor on Voyager would have been on top of that, especially if no one was in their right minds and not using temporally appropriate contraceptives for 15th century Klingons or 20th century yanks abroad.

You realize that fanfic authors frequently take stories into AU territory, right? That's where these stories need to go to make this relationship work, because it sure doesn't work in on-TV canon.

If the Doctor was "on top" of contraceptives, why was B'Elanna's alter-ego pregnant?

It's conceivable that Chakotay and Seven might have hooked up, even though her character was a lesbian, but here's who I really think sent half the crew to the maternity ward: Neelix.

It's never stated on Voyager that Seven is lesbian, and made pretty clear by her holodeck fantasy about Chakotay that she is attracted to men.

So there's no reason at all that she can't be bi. There's a whole subgenre of Voyager fanfic that pairs Seven with Janeway, B'Elanna, Sam Wildman, or some other woman.

 

[Oddish]

Nearly any pairing will work under AU conditions, as long as you manipulate the circumstances accordingly.

 

[Guy Gardener]

You realize that fanfic authors frequently take stories into AU territory, right? That's where these stories need to go to make this relationship work, because it sure doesn't work in on-TV canon.

If the Doctor was "on top" of contraceptives, why was B'Elanna's alter-ego pregnant?


It's never stated on Voyager that Seven is lesbian, and made pretty clear by her holodeck fantasy about Chakotay that she is attracted to men.

So there's no reason at all that she can't be bi. There's a whole subgenre of Voyager fanfic that pairs Seven with Janeway, B'Elanna, Sam Wildman, or some other woman.

I didn't mean that Seven was gay. Janeways's character was a woman in a suit in the 1940s, which is a thing that lesbians did in that era protesting the patriarchy. Seven's character was Janway's character's obvious partner. Besides, they were French.

In the script B'Elanna identifies her bump as being completely holographic, even if IRL it was a real bump we were supposed to pretend was gas in every other episode cleverly disguised by her new Engineering smock.

 

[Oddish]

In the script B'Elanna identifies her bump as being completely holographic, even if IRL it was a real bump we were supposed to pretend was gas in every other episode cleverly disguised by her new Engineering smock.

Unlike DS9, which just moved Baby Kirayoshi into the character whose actress was pregnant for real. Yet another time DS9 scored and Voyager struck out.

 

[spinagogue]

No reason I see for it either. Chakotay was both a gentleman and badass. Makes sense to me.

 

[Smellincoffee]

Unlike DS9, which just moved Baby Kirayoshi into the character whose actress was pregnant for real. Yet another time DS9 scored and Voyager struck out.

Leading to the greatest in-joke in Trek scripting, ever....Kira telling Bashir this was his fault, when Siddig did in fact have a child with Nana Visitor.

In addition to the other reasons which have been cited (the rushed nature, the inappropriateness given Seven's ongoing Borg recovery), I'd like to add that Chakotay has the charisma of a potato.

 

[Oddish]

I'd like to add that Chakotay has the charisma of a potato.

Except when he and Janeway were in the same room.

 

[Oddish]

Here's a question about the Seven/Chakotay pairing, and I'm actually interested in the possible answer...

Is there anything in canon that defends or explains their suitability as a couple?
- Personality traits they share?
- Experiences that bound them together?
- Activities they both enjoyed?
- Chemistry between the actors?
- Anything else? Anything at all?

 

[Phaser Two]

I actually thought they were cute together. It's yet another instance of my . . . resistance (hey, isn't there a Borg emoji?) to frequently (ardently? Loudly?) expressed Voyager opinions.

 

[Oddish]

I actually thought they were cute together. It's yet another instance of my . . . resistance (hey, isn't there a Borg emoji?) to frequently (ardently? Loudly?) expressed Voyager opinions.

If you liked them, I totally don't judge. We ship who we ship. I'm just curious as to what you and other C/7 shippers saw in the pairing.

 

[Phaser Two]

Not a shipper of the two . . . if anything while the show was running I thought they should pair her with Harry. But as played on screen by Ryan and Beltran (a great-looking, smooth presence), I thought it came off well and they had chemistry. I thought Jeri played it as having a bit of an authority-figure attraction to an older man, which makes some degree of sense since Seven barely remembered her father.

 

[valkyrie013]

Always thought the Captain and Chakotay were an item, they were shipped a number of times in episodes.
the 7/C thing was just last minute.. but they did just show the 2nd date i believe.

7 lost, what? 15 years of her life to the borg? most of the developmental ages.. She's going to have some idiosyncrasies, and trying out new things. including discovering love. Remember an early episode where Perpetual Ensign Kim expressed interest in her, and she just said okay, strip.. Viewing it as a chore. So she has come a long ways

Hopefully by that time, you like whomever you like, whatever preference is your business, and all are accepting since its none of there business.

 

[Oddish]

Always thought the Captain and Chakotay were an item, they were shipped a number of times in episodes.

Most notably "Resolutions", an episode that spawned an unknown number of fanmade J/C musical videos on YouTube. I still ship those two.

Remember an early episode where Perpetual Ensign Kim expressed interest in her, and she just said okay, strip.. Viewing it as a chore. So she has come a long ways

Yeah... Kim was smart to walk away from that one. It would have been awkward at best and exploitation at worst.

 

[ReddishAlert]

I actually found it nice. They were both highly passionate people who believed in a lot of self control and personal responsibility. Plus, to me, their interactions in Scorpion and early on in Seven’s story had great tense chemistry.

Plus, Chakotay even had the experience with the small hive of rogue Borg. And his whole thing is that he can fit into Starfleet entirely but never feels like he fits in. He feels anger and isolation (as he tells his true love Janeway in the story in the cabin). In that way, he’s exactly like Seven. They can excel in Starfleet through control and skill but don’t feel like they are truly part of it.

I even liked the actors in scenes together. It’s low key but sincere seeming.

I will admit that they didn’t do a great lead up to it in that it just kind of came up without prepping the audience. Also, the unrequited love or whatever you call it between Chakotay and Janeway should have been addressed in some way in light of the relationship. But other than that I was fine with it :-)

 

[ReddishAlert]

Yeah... Kim was smart to walk away from that one. It would have been awkward at best and exploitation at worst

Imagine how awkward he would feel now that she’s a Commander. And, obviously, Kim is still an ensign

 

[Oddish]

Imagine how awkward he would feel now that she’s a Commander. And, obviously, Kim is still an ensign

Doubtful... there are two schools of thought I find feasible.
1. That of "Endgame", Star Trek Online, and "The Autobiography of Kathryn Janeway". Harry was promoted immediately after Voyager returned home, and ascended rapidly through the ranks after, culminating in his own command.
2. That of Garrett Wang himself. Harry's career was ruined by his long ensignhood, so he left Starfleet and opened up a bar and Grill on the outskirts of Starfleet Academy called "Admiral Kim's". Those of Ensign rank and below got a discount.

So, either Harry was about the same rank as Seven by this point in time, or he was pouring drinks for her in San Francisco (and probably charging her full price).

 

[Guy Gardener]

Here's a question about the Seven/Chakotay pairing, and I'm actually interested in the possible answer...

Is there anything in canon that defends or explains their suitability as a couple?
- Personality traits they share?
- Experiences that bound them together?
- Activities they both enjoyed?
- Chemistry between the actors?
- Anything else? Anything at all?

You know how crackwhores will do literally anything for more crack?

Chakotay's religion.

He builds miniature temporary collectives, and spirit walks with friends, as prayer.

 

[The Emissary]

I think everyone covered the reasons.

For me - it just felt like it had zero build up to it. I can barely recall any time that Chakotay and Seven shared scenes and directly communicated only with each other. I'm pretty sure she interacted more with Janeway, the Doctor, Torres, and Kim more than she did with Chakotay throughout the series.

Also, it just felt very phoned in.