My point is probably no one's career was negatively affected by this. "Hmm, this person was an ensign for 7 years, then received 2 promotions. Oh, they were on Voyager, fine."
Why does Harry Kim never get promoted?
- Thread starter B. L.
- Start date
My point is probably no one's career was negatively affected by this. "Hmm, this person was an ensign for 7 years, then received 2 promotions. Oh, they were on Voyager, fine."
Career?
Tom knew that because he cocked up in the pilot years ago, and did not completely come though on his promise to help capture Chakotay... that he has to finish up his time in the New Zealand Penal Colony.
Janeway is a dick.
Tom knew that because he cocked up in the pilot years ago, and did not completely come though on his promise to help capture Chakotay... that he has to finish up his time in the New Zealand Penal Colony.
Janeway is a dick.
You have me on that point, but you can't argue that he single handedly delayed Voyager's launch f***ing around on the Promenade. They literally launched as soon as he finally reported to his station
Funny how she didn't admonish him for being late. She greeted him, told him "at ease before you sprain something", and explained how she preferred to be addressed. Then, she escorted him to his station.
I can give you "he was friends with Tom Paris", but let's remember that Tom was treated reasonably, promotion-wise. That suggests that he was not the career inhibitor for Harry he's sometimes been accused of being.
I sometimes say otherwise, and there's really no way to know for sure, but... that's probably true. The most likely course of events was that Starfleet allowed anyone who wanted to to resign, and those who chose to stay were bumped up a couple of grades. In "The Autobiography of Kathryn Janeway", it's stated that Janeway promoted Harry to lieutenant in her last act as Voyager's captain, and he advanced rapidly afterward. In that work, Star Trek Online, and the alternate future of "Endgame", he pretty much ends up in the same place (as a successful officer with his own command); the other characters' fates vary wildly).
So yes, Harry's career almost certainly survived. Yes, unlike most of Janeway's mistakes (I love you Kathy but you weren't infallible), this one probably did not have far-reaching consequences. Yes, I get all that... but Harry still should have been promoted.
That's an... interesting way to put it. But yeah, she could be sometimes. Of course, given how inconsistently she was written, she was a little of everything.
there was a commodore on Picard.
So, three grades.
In our system, the ranks go:
O-5: Commander
O-6: Captain
O-7: Commodore, recently replaced by Rear Admiral Lower Half
O-8: Rear Admiral, recently replaced by Rear Admiral Upper Half
O-9: Vice Admiral
O-10: Admiral
Why the hell didn’t he have a chair?
Maybe there IS a little box on his chair... that subsequently got sucked into space/transported to a parallel universe/exploded in a total protonic reversal at the speed of light. Janeway just assumed since he lost the chair AND the pip that he just didn't WANT the promotion
Or, maybe Harry was supposed to get promoted the morning Tom did, but somebody switched chairs as a joke so Janeway had to promote Paris instead
As long as we're going there, here are four more scenarios. I know it says five, but the last one is just my take on an iconic scene from "Return of the Jedi".
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/wheres-my-box-a-short-story-with-5-endings.305612/
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/wheres-my-box-a-short-story-with-5-endings.305612/
Well being Lieutenant Commander and third-in-command on the flagship, there isn't that much higher to go (maybe the writers should have started him in a lower rank and/or position) and I can believe that even on big starships, with the chief of security being lieutenant, full Commanders are very rare (just the first officer and maybe one or two others).
Medical rank is parallel.
There are no Ensign Doctors.
Their rank is about being in control of the medical features of any command. IE how much staff does the doctor have to supervise, and what sort of rank does the Doctor have to push around in an emergency.
Beverly was an Admiral after season 1.
A commander will not be in control of Starfleet medical on Earth.
Temporary rank reduction?
Temporary self imposed rank reduction?
Beverly should have been the Captain from season 3 onward, but sexism.
Even so, just compare:
Deanna: Took multiple tries to kill a holographic version of Geordi LaForge. Promoted to commander.
Data: With only one chance, tapped into the Borg network, neutralized a cube that had demolished 39 starships and was about to assimilate Earth; he saved the whole frickin' planet. NOT promoted to commander. Is this BS or what?!
Deanna: Took multiple tries to kill a holographic version of Geordi LaForge. Promoted to commander.
Data: With only one chance, tapped into the Borg network, neutralized a cube that had demolished 39 starships and was about to assimilate Earth; he saved the whole frickin' planet. NOT promoted to commander. Is this BS or what?!
I kind of suspect Troi passed the test because Riker was adminstering the test. If it really is supposed to be a test of character, I think you should either pass it first time or have to wait a long time before redoing the test.
and here you go again with another of your wild theories with no basis in the show.
I think so as well. A captain might not have the opportunity to come up with alternative solutions. They might have to choose the lesser of two evils, and without hesitation. For Troi, it was presented as a puzzle to be solved. Sadly, while I like the character, she should not have passed the test.
Well, I think that for Tom and all officers from the Maquis, the grade was temporary. Maybe wll they be confirmed - or not - by Starfleet HQ once on Earth. If she wanted to make them work for her, she was forced to give something in excange AND give them the feeling to be part of her crew like grades and privileges go with.....
A senior Admiral would be the Surgeon-General of Starfleet, the flag officer in charge of all medical functions for the fleet.
On the other hand, a Commander or (Acting) Captain would likely be the Commanding Officer of the Starfleet Medical Centre San Francisco, informally known as Starfleet Medical (per Endgame).
But if it's a test of character in the same sense as the Kobayashi Maru scenario, then Kirk took it three times, and there's no indication that he had to wait a long time....though in fairness, I don't think there's an indication that he didn't, either.
What I think tips the scales is that Riker does drop a hint, IIRC.
Every personnel decision Janeway made: enlistments, field commissions, promotions, and reductions alike, was subject to review and confirmation by Starfleet. So, not really an excuse for overlooking Harry.
Furthermore, most of what Janeway did in terms of ranks and status, I have no objection to. Chakotay as first, a political gesture of sorts but a reasonable one given his twenty years experience as a Starfleet officer and existing rank of LCDR. Enlisting/commissioning the Maquis was necessary. Reinstating Tom at his old rank, demoting him when he loused up, and promoting him back... all fine. Demoting the Equinox crew, completely understandable given their actions.
Far as I'm concerned, Janeway's only questionable personnel decisions were:
1. Promoting B'Elanna to chief engineer instead of brigging her for assault.
2. Keeping Harry Kim, an excellent officer who didn't beat up any of his colleagues, at ensign for seven years.
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Fair enough. My opinion on the Kobayashi Maru scenario is it's actually testing how you handle failure: if you can accept you failed and sometimes failure happens, you pass; if you can't emotionally deal with failing, you don't belong on the command track. Kirk kind of went for option 3: not accepting that he failed but emotionally dealing with it by totally changing the parameters of the scenario.
Yes I agree about that.
