Why Doctor Who is a MESS

[VDCNI]

Isn't it odd that it's always the white straight men who never see racism, sexism or homophobia.

I wonder why that could be, it's a mystery to me.

 

[jaime]

And yet, to give one example, when people do tests where they send the exact same resume out for a job just changing the name on it, people with western names are far more likely to be called for an interview over people with Asian, African or Arabic names. (In that order.)

I've worked in Payroll departments in companies both big and small and can tell you that women (and non-white men) absolutely get paid less for doing exactly the same job as white men.

It's easy to claim these these things don't exist when they don't effect you directly.

Then you guys need to sort your laws out and how they are applied. At the very least make the buggers work for their discriminatory practices.
Over here we have ended up chasing our tails comparing pay for warehouse workers to pay for checkout staff to have something to fight about. Everything else is up there with rich folk who fight like rats in a bag and keep their earnings a secret anyway. Oh...and some old farts who carefully move things around to keep the top jobs the way they like them, but that’s just shadow boxing. Executive boards etc may be old white men, but it’s pretty safe to say not just any old white man will do.

The BBC pay scandals are just entertaining fluff for the papers. It’s already an alien world to most folk anyway. It’s very hard to see anyone on a six figure salary as particularly oppressed...particularly those big six figures almost seven.

 

[starsuperion]

Racism is dead you say?

Umm....no... That's not what I said. Did you not read what I wrote correctly?? I said its not rampant. It still exists, but no where near the media, politicians, or activist professors try to portray

How are the demographics of the prison system looking? How about those for victims of police shootings? How many black senators are left in the Republican party? No issues with white supremacists?

The prison system issues are down to poverty, drugs, and the destruction of the family environment, thru policies that foster those to seek a life of crime out of desperation. Both left and right are responsible for such things. Jim crow. The KKK, the dixicrats and their policy of segregation. The left and the democrats are responsible for those things. Which are now erroneously pushed off on the party who historically fought against them.

Sexism too?

Never said that. Harvey Weinstein, Jeffrey Epstein, all clinton donors are proof sexism is alive and well.

Very respectful gentleman you have as POTUS? Doesn't treat women like meat or anything?

Not my POTUS. I'm a libertarian. So....your assumption of me is flawed. I'll use him as a meme once and awhile. But that doesnt mean I voted for him. People are more complex and complicated then the media would have you believe. Not everyone is a socialist, just like not everyone is a deplorable.

 

[Spot261]

Umm....no... That's not what I said. Did you not read what I wrote correctly?? I said its not rampant. It still exists, but no where near the media, politicians, or activist professors try to portray

But my position is that racism is indeed rampant and that you have been apparently quite fortunate in your experiences, as evidenced by numerous aspects of society mentioned. I'm glad to hear your experiences haven't reflected those of so many others.

The prison system issues are down to poverty, drugs, and the destruction of the family environment, thru policies that foster those to seek a life of crime out of desperation. Both left and right are responsible for such things. Jim crow. The KKK, the dixicrats and their policy of segregation. The left and the democrats are responsible for those things. Which are now erroneously pushed off on the party who historically fought against them.

Poverty and crime which disproportionately impacts black people. The racial bias in murder rates is actually higher than it was in the mid 20th century.

Not my POTUS. I'm a libertarian. So....your assumption of me is flawed. I'll use him as a meme once and awhile. But that doesnt mean I voted for him. People are more complex and complicated then the media would have you believe. Not everyone is a socialist, just like bot everyone is a deplorable.

Trump very much campaigned on a libertarian platform, or at least a platform which reflects what is commonly termed libertarianism in common parlance these days.

Never said that. Harvey Weinstein, Jeffrey Epstein, all clinton donors are proof sexism is alive and well.

Indeed.

 

[StCoop]

Oh look, Neil Gaiman is actually making another TV series after all; just not the one the sad MDWGA losers were claiming.

https://deadline.com/2019/08/showtime-gormenghast-fremantle-1202667034/

 

[XCV330]

Umm....no... That's not what I said. Did you not read what I wrote correctly?? I said its not rampant. It still exists, but no where near the media, politicians, or activist professors try to portray

As an Amazonian carpenter ant, I have some keen insights into the difficulties and travails affecting the lives of arctic snow foxes. But it is not nearly as cold as people think.

 

[jaime]

There are some very strange, frothy, people in this world.

 

[Professor Zoom]

Sexism and racism have been present since the days of the Romans, Egypt, the Indus Valley and beyond. Its human nature, and will most likely never be fully eliminated. What is the solution? Governmental policies that halt such activity and encourage equalization of treatment. Outcome and effort should determine the success, not Arbitrary means. As far as the US being rampant with sexism and racism....are you sure you live in the US? Because I do, and I dont see it, except in the warped minds of media, and psycho individuals who try to incite as much. For us "normies" I've never had an issue and have a large diverse group of friends, who joke around about such things, but our POV is all of that stuff is behind us, and mostly the perview of the old who,can't get past their own biases based on past events. Like I said, we look at ourselves as being in the future, where such nonsense is a thing of the past. Politicians and media want you to believe its an issue, so they can capitlize on your fear, anger, and vulnerability. A healthy practice is to,ignore media, and politicians who peddle such propaganda, and go out and enjoy people. Live amongst your friends, in,diverse congregations, and see that life here is,not as bad as they portray.

You should ask your black and brown friends if they have experienced racism.
Also: ask your female friends if they have experienced sexism.

Their answers might surprise you.

 

[Jayson1]

Clearly racism and sexism is still around but that isn't the only issue. It is about how we comunicate. The internet has brainwashed everone to treat each other like assholes. Ever political debate and even stuff that should't be plays the same. Someone calls someone a snowflake,that person is called out for white privledge thus they aren't suppose to know shit. Someone tries to calm things down but it doesn't work because people are now in a fighting mood. This same cycle will just repeat itself over and over until people take a good look at themselves which people don't like to do and because the gaslighting by the rich will never end. Thus we get Trump then civil war where everyone looses and then somebody like China takes over. Jason

 

[Marc]

I think Pertwee was West Country.

Was going to say something about leeks because for some reason I thought Pertwee was Welsh (he was born in Chelsea according to Wiki) but maybe I'm getting confused because Tim Treloar who's been doing the 3rd doctor for BF is Welsh.

 

[starsuperion]

Clearly racism and sexism is still around but that isn't the only issue. It is about how we comunicate. The internet has brainwashed everone to treat each other like assholes. Ever political debate and even stuff that should't be plays the same. Someone calls someone a snowflake,that person is called out for white privledge thus they aren't suppose to know shit. Someone tries to calm things down but it doesn't work because people are now in a fighting mood. This same cycle will just repeat itself over and over until people take a good look at themselves which people don't like to do and because the gaslighting by the rich will never end. Thus we get Trump then civil war where everyone looses and then somebody like China takes over. Jason

That and the moral of this debate here is if you aren't liberal, and feel bad about your own race, or gender, or sexual preference (CIS Hetero) even tho you've done literally nothing except exist and try to make a life for yourself, then you are ignorant and part of the problem. Accept your white priveledge, and be ashamed of who you are and how,you think, they tell you. Because wether your libertarian, moderate, or Republican, you are always wrong. Seriously. Doesn't matter what other stripe you are. Its not the "right" stripe some people will accept. I don't buy that. I also don't believe anyone harbors some kind of unconscious bias. That's a clever excuse to accuse you of something that you've never done, said or felt. Its like the precognition police, from that Tom Cruise movie. Insane, and offensive.

"Let that be your battlefield" from TOS Star Trek soundly applies here to this debate and the ideology that reason cannot subside..

 

[Spot261]

That and the moral of this debate here is if you aren't liberal, and feel bad about your own race, or gender, or sexual preference (CIS Hetero) even tho you've done literally nothing except exist and try to make a life for yourself, then you are ignorant and part of the problem. Accept your white priveledge, and be ashamed of who you are and how,you think, they tell you. Because wether your libertarian, moderate, or Republican, you are always wrong. Seriously. Doesn't matter what other stripe you are. Its not the "right" stripe some people will accept. I don't buy that. I also don't believe anyone harbors some kind of unconscious bias. That's a clever excuse to accuse you of something that you've never done, said or felt. Its like the precognition police, from that Tom Cruise movie. Insane, and offensive.

"Let that be your battlefield" from TOS Star Trek soundly applies here to this debate and the ideology that reason cannot subside..

Believe as you wish, the world keeps failing to match up.

 

[Neroon]

This is diverging far off the topic at hand, regardless of the intent in the recent discussion. Please ... let's get back to discussing Doctor Who, debating whether it's a "mess" or not

 

[StCoop]

Well for those keeping score; Neil Gaiman is making a show that isn't 'Doctor Who' and Michael Sheen is making two TV series neither of which is 'Doctor Who', so I guess the series will remain a "mess" for a while longer.

 

[jaime]

Well for those keeping score; Neil Gaiman is making a show that isn't 'Doctor Who' and Michael Sheen is making two TV series neither of which is 'Doctor Who', so I guess the series will remain a "mess" for a while longer.

I suspect that was fluff anyway.

If I were to pick one thing that would help next year (aside from, you know making it relevant to kids again...it’s pilot episode alone was only relevant to kids if they were already at Tracy Beaker level and above of melodrama. The illustrated mum level....in fact wouldn’t Michelle Collins be good?) it would be a visual overhaul. Costumes and Tardis sets.

The real disconnect is in the writing, but maybe a change in visuals will spark some writers and they will remember what they are supposed to be working on.

 

[Doctor Bombay]

That and the moral of this debate here is if you aren't liberal, and feel bad about your own race, or gender, or sexual preference (CIS Hetero) even tho you've done literally nothing except exist and try to make a life for yourself, then you are ignorant and part of the problem. Accept your white priveledge, and be ashamed of who you are and how,you think, they tell you. Because wether your libertarian, moderate, or Republican, you are always wrong. Seriously. Doesn't matter what other stripe you are. Its not the "right" stripe some people will accept. I don't buy that. I also don't believe anyone harbors some kind of unconscious bias. That's a clever excuse to accuse you of something that you've never done, said or felt. Its like the precognition police, from that Tom Cruise movie. Insane, and offensive.

"Let that be your battlefield" from TOS Star Trek soundly applies here to this debate and the ideology that reason cannot subside..

Probably about to start some shit here, but hey... if I don't do it, someone else probably far less qualified will. I am a white CIS heterosexual. I enjoy being one. Couldn't picture being any other way. Not downgrading anyone who isn't, but if you aren't and you're catching flak for it... not my problem.

Now.... that being said, I don't want to see anyone discriminated against because of their ethnicity, sexuality, politics, or religion, but I'm not going so far as to emasculate or degrade myself in some sort of recompensation like I've seen some do here and there. I am who I am and don't apologize for it. Anyone who doesn't like me or is hostile to me for what I am is invited to kiss my ass.

 

[Maurice]

Probably about to start some shit here, but hey... if I don't do it, someone else probably far less qualified will. I am a white CIS heterosexual. I enjoy being one. Couldn't picture being any other way. Not downgrading anyone who isn't, but if you aren't and you're catching flak for it... not my problem.

Now.... that being said, I don't want to see anyone discriminated against because of their ethnicity, sexuality, politics, or religion, but I'm not going so far as to emasculate or degrade myself in some sort of recompensation like I've seen some do here and there. I am who I am and don't apologize for it.

Qualified to what, praytell?

Frankly, "not my problem" is a conveniently heard out. If you hear racist or homophobic speech do you challenge it or at least cast a baleful eye at the speaker, or do you just let it stand? A decision not to act is still a decision and has an effect. It's not equivalent to saying such things, but it reinforces the idea that people can say such things.

Frankly, it's tiresome to see people in the majority act as if they're being persecuted when most have not clue one what that's really like.

Anyone who doesn't like me or is hostile to me for what I am is invited to kiss my ass.

And invitation declined. Your donkey is not worth the trouble.

 

[ralfy]

Virtue signalling plus dumbing down ultimately never works. What is taking place for SW, ST, and other franchises will affect this, too.

 

[jaime]

Jeebus.

Look, I ain’t a fan of the crazies in either direction, but I thought we were talking about the issues in current who, of which only the smallest part is modern political shenanigans (and those of us who remember the Cartmel era may remember better attempts at doing that...whether it’s most of The Happiness Patrol, the racial purity of Remembrance, the class division and importance of faith in Fenric, the importance of not giving in to base instincts of Survival, the importance of change and acceptance in Ghost Light or what have you. It’s amazing how ‘white kids firebombed it’ does so much in a sentence.) and while yes, the crazies fight on t’internet to shame people for skin colour one way or another....sod em. All of em. Left or right.

So...Chris Chibnall. Bit shit init. Discuss.

 

[Guy Gardener]

WTF!!!???

I was on Yazz's wikipedia page, and she is 19 years old.

Which means that Ryan is also 19.

(The characters not the actors)

I had been thinking that they are imbeciles (Well Ryan is an imbecile and Yaz doesn't act like anyone from the Bill, so I'm commenting on the short fall.) who are almost 30, becuase she is a cop. Now I find out that she is a probationary officer. Which means that she's still in training and her uniform is only a tiny bit more official than Amy's kissogram outfit.

Mandip Kaur Gill is 31 (currently).

Tosin Cole is 27 (currently).

Why take adults, and make them pretend they left high school 3 months ago?

Sigh.