When did the perception of Insurrection change?

[Greg Cox]

Granted, part of the problem with that INSURRECTION screening was merely scheduling. I simply couldn't coordinate things with the usual gang of Trekkies, but the fact that everybody was too busy to get together on opening night probably says something. As opposed to those halcyon days when the opening of a new Trek movie was an Event that nobody wanted to miss!

Or maybe we were all just getting too middle-aged?

 

[Therin of Andor]

Granted, part of the problem with that INSURRECTION screening was merely scheduling. I simply couldn't coordinate things with the usual gang of Trekkies, but the fact that everybody was too busy to get together on opening night probably says something. As opposed to those halcyon days when the opening of a new Trek movie was an Event that nobody wanted to miss!

Or maybe we were all just getting too middle-aged?

I can relate to this.

Our club (before my time) attended a huge costumed gala premiere for TMP in Sydney. Fans still talk about it today. A similar event was held for ST II and I helped organise the gala events for ST III and IV. ST V was a much scaled-down event; Paramount barely cared. I saw a preview for ST VI in Paramount's theatrette but was overseas for the Sydney premiere night, but it was "small potatoes". "Generations"' fan event was held in a suburban multiplex, "First Contact" a bit closer to the gala events of old, but "Insurrection" was merely a collection of interested friends (and no one in costume). An enjoyable night, but I was bemused to notice a few friends refusing to buy "Insurrection" on DVD when it came out; I hadn't realised they had found it so offensive on opening night. "Nemesis" was a workmate and me, in a local suburban cinema on opening night, and very few other attendees.

What has been wonderful about the JJ films has been Paramount taking on giant red carpet gala openings - the Sydney Opera House world premiere in 2009, and an amazing recreation of the brig, corridors and observation deck for "Into Darkness" - injecting sufficient enthusiasm and marketing $$$$ to get publicity.

 

[DonIago]

If it might help...I find INS to be sub-par, but TFF remains the only one I don't even have on DVD.

 

[Smellmet]

I rank Insurrection and Generations around equal 10th or 11th out of the 12, I still really enjoy both though (I saw Generations 4 times on the big screen so it can't be that bad!) There is a big gap from those two to number 12 and in my opinion the worst in the series by a long way though - and thats the Final frontier

 

[BillJ]

I'm not sure anyone was ever terribly excited by INSURRECTION. I remember that it was the first Trek movie I ever saw all by myself--because I couldn't find anyone who wanted to see it with me.

Insurrection is the only Trek film I didn't see in the theater since I was old enough to start going on my own (The Voyage Home).

Nothing that I saw or read about the film made me want to go see it.

 

[Shikarnov]

I'm a little late to the thread, but I think Insurrection's main problem wasn't the general idea, but the way some details played out (like Action-Hero-Picard stocking the yacht with a small arsenal and preparing to fly down alone -- and later opting to destroy the collector instead of sending Worf), the characterizations (since when is the Enterprise crew so unprofessional and inexperienced to express amusement over another culture's customs during a diplomatic function? ), poor attempts at humor (singing to Data in the shuttlecraft) and most horrifically, the joystick.

That's my two cents.

 

[Gojira]

If it might help...I find INS to be sub-par, but TFF remains the only one I don't even have on DVD.

For the longest time I did not own TFF on DVD bvut I eventually bought it. It has some good moments in there and I do enjoy the movie. When I saw it in the theater evryone was laughing and having a good time. Today, much of the humor is cringe worthy. I wish they would do a directors cut and edit most of it out.

 

[DonIago]

Well, I liked the singing and I find the general idea extremely problematic.

 

[DonIago]

If it might help...I find INS to be sub-par, but TFF remains the only one I don't even have on DVD.

For the longest time I did not own TFF on DVD bvut I eventually bought it. It has some good moments in there and I do enjoy the movie. When I saw it in the theater evryone was laughing and having a good time. Today, much of the humor is cringe worthy. I wish they would do a directors cut and edit most of it out.

It isn't without its moments, I've just felt absolutely no desire to buy it so that I might rewatch them.

I'd be more likely to pick it up as part of a larger set...but until there's a Blu Ray set that includes the DE of TMP that's not going to be happening either.

 

[BillJ]

...I find the general idea extremely problematic.

An alien pretending to be God seeking escape from a prison.

You find that extremely problematic?

I never found the idea problematic. What I found problematic was trying to tell that type of story surrounded by humor.

 

[DonIago]

Ah, sorry. I was referring to INS, not TFF.

 

[BillJ]

Ah, sorry. I was referring to INS, not TFF.

You said singing and my mind automatically went to The Final Frontier! My mistake.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Of course opinion over the film has changed. This has happened without almost all of them. TMP was considered a boring creative failure - now many people consider it a cerebral masterpiece. On release, TSFS was considered a better film than TWOK. Even TUC is bashed more now. Opinions change over repeat viewings. Also, many of the people commenting today aren't the same fans as back then. The players change as people get older and die. So, yes, everything changes.

On the other hand, the music is wonderful. The best of Jerry Goldsmith's TNG movie scores.

I like all 10 original Trek films. IMO, not a bad film in the lot. I'm apparently the only person on Earth who feels this way. Good for me, since I was never let down. :-)

 

[Greg Cox]

On the other hand, the music is wonderful. The best of Jerry Goldsmith's TNG movie scores.

I'll concede that I've listened to INSURRECTION's soundtrack album way more often than I've ever watched the movie.

Although I still give FIRST CONTACT's music the edge. Along with the soundtracks to KHAN and the 2009 movie, it's my go-to music to write STAR TREK by . . . .

 

[DonIago]

Interesting that you say that Greg, since I've been waffling on whether to buy the new soundtrack release since, aside from the opening music, I don't recall much of INS's soundtrack particularly making an impression on me.

I mean, I liked the singing, but I doubt that's included...or is it?

 

[Therin of Andor]

I've been waffling on whether to buy the new soundtrack release... I liked the singing, but I doubt that's included...or is it?

http://theseconddisc.com/2013/07/15/another-expanded-star-trek-score-immortalized-on-cd/

Star Trek: Insurrection – Expanded Collector’s Edition Soundtrack (originally released as GNP Crescendo GNPD 8059, 1998 – reissued GNP Crescendo 8082, 2013)

1. Ba’ku Village
2. Out of Orbit/Take Us In *
3. Come Out
4. In Custody
5. Warp Capability/The Planet/Children’s Story *
6. The Holodeck *
7. How Old Are You Now/New Sight *
8. Lost Ship/Prepare the Ship *
9. As Long As We Can *
10. Not Functioning/Send Your Ships *
11. Growing Up/Wild Flowers/Photon Torpedo *
12. The Drones Attack
13. The Riker Maneuver
14. Stay with Me *
15. The Same Race
16. The Collector *
17. No Threat
18. Tractor Beam *
19. The Healing Process (Revised) *
20. The Healing Process (Original Version)
21. End Credits
22. Ba’ku Village (Alternate Ending) *
23. The Holodeck (Alternate Opening) *
24. Growing Up (Alternate) *
25. Tractor Beam (Alternate) *

* denotes previously unreleased track

 

[DonIago]

Hm. That kind of looks like a no to my question. Unfortunate but not unexpected.

 

[sonak]

Of course opinion over the film has changed. This has happened without almost all of them. TMP was considered a boring creative failure - now many people consider it a cerebral masterpiece. On release, TSFS was considered a better film than TWOK. Even TUC is bashed more now. Opinions change over repeat viewings. Also, many of the people commenting today aren't the same fans as back then. The players change as people get older and die. So, yes, everything changes.

On the other hand, the music is wonderful. The best of Jerry Goldsmith's TNG movie scores.

I like all 10 original Trek films. IMO, not a bad film in the lot. I'm apparently the only person on Earth who feels this way. Good for me, since I was never let down. :-)

outside of this BBS, I don't think there's been a big fandom shift on TMP to the extent that many consider it to be a "cerebral masterpiece."

it's still ranked pretty low in popularity among Trek films.


probably because it's derivative and glacially slow...

 

[Peach Wookiee]

^TMP is one I don't watch if I need to stay awake.

 

[sonak]

^TMP is one I don't watch if I need to stay awake.

it was the only Trek film that I just couldn't get through on one sitting. I had to stop it and re-start it a few times to finish.


And just in case someone brings it up, this is not about lack of action, because I really like TVH, and that has very little action in it.