What would have made the first season of Babylon 5 better?

[Booji]

A lot of s1 was mediocre cause of the cheesy cornball factor. TKO, Born to the Purple, Infection, Soul Hunter, Grail.... ugh.... and if you include The Gathering.... woah nelly. What a load of crap. Fortunately, there were eps like B Squared & Signs and Portents to show the potential of the series.

 

[JoeD80]

Season One is guilty of doing a little too much world building. The setups that it did were needed as the series progressed. Perhaps if the arcs were dived into a bit earlier, and the world building was done while the story unfolded, as opposed to being introduced before hand.

jms had a funny description in the script books about the world-building: He said season one was "throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks." The arc wasn't going to be dived into earlier though, because the five seasons were supposed to be split along the five constructs "Introduction", "Rising Action", "Complication", "Climax", "Denouement". Season one was always meant to be an introduction.

Too many "Sinclair meets the mustache-twirling military guy and has to prove he belongs in command of B5 to" episodes.

Zero? There was a story where an investigator wanted to remove him because he was bitter about not getting to command B5 but that's not the same thing as Sinclair having to prove that he belongs in command.

A lot of s1 was mediocre cause of the cheesy cornball factor. TKO, Born to the Purple, Infection, Soul Hunter, Grail.... ugh.... and if you include The Gathering.... woah nelly. What a load of crap. Fortunately, there were eps like B Squared & Signs and Portents to show the potential of the series.

I don't follow what you mean by "cheesy cornball factor." This seems to be more a personal taste issue here, and some of those episodes you mention I quite enjoy.

 

[buzzknox]

Not having D'Lenn marry Sinclair until they were certain Sinclair was coming back. And yes, the dialogue in the episode about religious ceremonies was that D'Lenn and Sinclair participated in a Minbari marriage ceremony, with the inference being they were the happy couple.

 

[Booji]

I don't follow what you mean by "cheesy cornball factor." This seems to be more a personal taste issue here, and some of those episodes you mention I quite enjoy.

The writing and acting for those eps range from somewhat to extremely cheesy. Those eps can be enjoyable (bar scene in Born for instance), but they lack a professional quality seen in other s1 eps like WWE, B Squared, etc. Even for a low budget tv show, they seemed really low budget. The eps had good ideas, the end product just doesn't show it. Infection could have been sweet, especially since it was meant to forshadow, um, Shadow tech, but ended up being cringe worthy due to some horrible acting, poor fx, and some cheesy writing.

 

[Jan]

Not having D'Lenn marry Sinclair until they were certain Sinclair was coming back. And yes, the dialogue in the episode about religious ceremonies was that D'Lenn and Sinclair participated in a Minbari marriage ceremony, with the inference being they were the happy couple.

That was a red herring. The ceremony was a rebirth ceremony which supposedly *could* also be used as a marriage ceremony. More importantly, the words that Delenn said about Valen warning them of(paraphrasing) victory disguised as defeat was Sinclair as Valen predicting how the Earth/Minbari war would end. The Minbari would reunite with the other half of their souls but it would mean surrendering to Earth.

BTW, to the comment upthread about not liking some of the early episodes, it's notable that "Infection", "Midnight on the Firing Line" and "Soul Hunter" were all written before shooting started so those are probably the ones not portraying the characters quite right since nobody had seen the actors' take on them.

Jan

 

[mandragora]

There was no mention of Valen in the "Parliament" episode that aired, or was put on DVD. It was only in the script. And given the infamous original outline, it's absolutely clear that it was meant as a wedding ceremony.

And I agree with Harvey. I forgot to mention that point earlier. In season one there were horribly clichéd "villains of the week". Trakis, Zento, Ben Zayn, Pierce come to mind. Clichéd "villains of the week" were a problem in B5 even later, but it was never as bad as in season one.

 

[DS9Continuing]

2. Some people complained about the way that Cmmdr. Sinclair was portrayed (or the "stiff" acting associated with the character...) - I actually liked the character of Sinclair and wish that we would have seen more of him.

This is something that's always annoyed me. It happens with both Sinclair and Sisko - people complain that the acting was too bland and stiff. They seem unable to comprehend the possibility that that was the character they were portraying.

Sinclair was an ordinary joe. A grunt. Nothing more than a flight squad commander - one of a mass of bodies thrown against the wall in the war against the Minbari. He's not supposed to be a glittering, swashbuckling, dominating hero from the first, or else where is there for him to develop to? He has to be ordinary at the beginning for the events of the show to have any effect on him.

Not to mention the fact that he's a post-traumatic stress sufferer with questions about his own blanked-out history and a death wish. He's not trusted by his own superiors, and wouldn't have even been in command of B5 if the Minbari hadn't insisted on it. All of that makes a quiet, internalised performance not only appropriate but necessary.

But maybe there's a way of having the first season be the introduction of the show's story while having its own mini-arc to draw the audience in before the main story arc is kicked into gear by the end of the season.

You mean like the mystery of the missing 24 hours dominating the first season before the Shadow and Clark arcs kicked in at season's end?

Lost Season 1 which gave time to get to know the plane-crash survivors while planting hints of what is to come and giving us a bit of a conflict with some of the island's inhabitants.

We get the know the characters of B5, while planting hints of what's to come, and giving us a bit of conflict between G'Kar and Londo, Ivanova and the Psi Corps, Sinclair and his bosses...

The same goes for your other examples. Everything that you suggest as a possible example based on other shows, did happen in B5. I'm not sure where you're seeing that it didn't.

Not having D'Lenn marry Sinclair until they were certain Sinclair was coming back. And yes, the dialogue in the episode about religious ceremonies was that D'Lenn and Sinclair participated in a Minbari marriage ceremony, with the inference being they were the happy couple.

It was only one of the possible interpretations. In the very same sentence, it's stated that the ceremony can also function as a "rebirth ceremony," of the type also seen in "Ceremonies of Light and Dark." The "wedding" explanation was a red herring and forshadowing at the same time, but not an actual description of what was going on at the time.

Edit: Jan beat me to that.

Also, learn to spell the character's name.

 

[JoeD80]

Not having D'Lenn marry Sinclair until they were certain Sinclair was coming back. And yes, the dialogue in the episode about religious ceremonies was that D'Lenn and Sinclair participated in a Minbari marriage ceremony, with the inference being they were the happy couple.

I don't think Sinclair saw it that way, since he proposes to Catherine later in the season.

 

[RandyS]

2. Some people complained about the way that Cmmdr. Sinclair was portrayed (or the "stiff" acting associated with the character...) - I actually liked the character of Sinclair and wish that we would have seen more of him.

I liked Sinclair, too.

So did I, although I agree with those who say Sheridan was the better Captain. Sinclair was a different person, but still good in his own way.

As to the OP's question, nothing was wrong with B5's first year. In fact, the whole show was fine the way it was.

Well, except for Byron of course.

 

[Admiral Rem]

If I can digress for one second... My one complaint about the series (besides the "Byron arc" and what it did to Leeta Alexander) would be that we never saw (IMHO) better closure between Sinclair and Garibaldi, and Sinclair and Ivannova. Although there was the message that SInclair left Garibaldi and the brief goodbye to Ivannova in Season 3, I wish that they would have had a chance to revisit this in season 5. Even if it was a flashback episode, I would have liked for Sinclair and Garibaldi to have a better goodbye. It would have been difficult in terms of where Garibaldi's arc led him throughout season 5. But it could have been great to see on some level (maybe even the Neil Gaimen episode when past "dead" people came back and visited some of the crew. Was there any animosity between the actors? I just never got why a better send off happened.


Anyway,

Season 1 was not bad and I am grateful for what we ultimately got.

 

[Harvey]

Doyle is on record as to not being friends with O'Hare. I don't recall any particular animosity, but the two did not get on the same way Doyle did with Boxleitner. I'm sure somebody will be able to pull up the anecdote about the dinner between the two actors where O'Hare didn't say a word.

 

[OmahaStar]

Doyle is on record as to not being friends with O'Hare.

By ain't that the truth. Jerry threatened to quit the series if he had to be on the set at the same time as O'Hare, when they brought him back for the War Without End two-parter. Now, I've never met Michael O'Hare, but I've met Jerry Doyle quite a few times, and every time, he has nothing but hatred for O'Hare, even after all these years.

Morgan Sheppard (the first Soul Hunter, the Narn G'Sten) talked about the tension on the set between the two even as early as his first episode, the second episode filmed.

 

[Harvey]

I didn't realize the two didn't want to be on set with each other (or, at least, Doyle didn't want to be on set with him) after the first season. Actually, it's a real testament to the two actors, for they managed to create a real history of friendship on screen when the two actors really hated each other. Reminds me of Frank Black and Bob Bletcher on Millennium in that regard.

 

[Jan]

By ain't that the truth. Jerry threatened to quit the series if he had to be on the set at the same time as O'Hare, when they brought him back for the War Without End two-parter. Now, I've never met Michael O'Hare, but I've met Jerry Doyle quite a few times, and every time, he has nothing but hatred for O'Hare, even after all these years.

I'd never heard that Jerry threw a fit when MO'H returned in the third season but it's no secret he didn't like O'Hare. It's a pity, too, because I thought they played off of each other on camera really well.

As for Jerry...feh...consider the source. He's highly entertaining but very much the complete jerk a lot of the time.

Jan

 

[Neroon]

Not having D'Lenn marry Sinclair until they were certain Sinclair was coming back. And yes, the dialogue in the episode about religious ceremonies was that D'Lenn and Sinclair participated in a Minbari marriage ceremony, with the inference being they were the happy couple.

I don't think Sinclair saw it that way, since he proposes to Catherine later in the season.

That's pretty much the way I saw it. Regardless of whether jms originally intended the Minbari ceremony as a subtly veiled marriage ceremony between Sinclair and Delenn, I tend to think Sinclair's later proposal to Catherine mutes that. Otherwise, it becomes more predictable. I like having the supposed "marriage" as a red herring, because it keeps you guessing.

 

[OmahaStar]

By ain't that the truth. Jerry threatened to quit the series if he had to be on the set at the same time as O'Hare, when they brought him back for the War Without End two-parter. Now, I've never met Michael O'Hare, but I've met Jerry Doyle quite a few times, and every time, he has nothing but hatred for O'Hare, even after all these years.

I'd never heard that Jerry threw a fit when MO'H returned in the third season but it's no secret he didn't like O'Hare. It's a pity, too, because I thought they played off of each other on camera really well.

As for Jerry...feh...consider the source. He's highly entertaining but very much the complete jerk a lot of the time.

Jan

They have these things called conventions nowadays ... You can go and listen to actors talk about their favorite things - themselves. :P

I don't remember which con Jerry talked about the threatening to quit, whether D*C or SF, but I remember him saying it and thinking "Ok, that explains Susan going instead of Garibaldi. Oh, and Jerry's a douche."

 

[JoeD80]

Doyle is on record as to not being friends with O'Hare.

By ain't that the truth. Jerry threatened to quit the series if he had to be on the set at the same time as O'Hare, when they brought him back for the War Without End two-parter.

I had heard this story, and I can see some legitimacy to it, because you'll notice that there isn't a single scene of Garibaldi & Sinclair in War Without End except for one very particular scene from Babylon Squared with Garibaldi fighting off the enemies and Sinclair being pulled away which I'm sure was supposed to actually occur. Instead we just get a flashback and Sinclair saying "I won't let it happen!" as if it was a future to avoid instead of something that was going to occur. Notice it's the only time-flash that doesn't actually become true! However, I think that's how the script was written originally, so there wouldn't have really been anything for Jerry to complain about.

Now, I've never met Michael O'Hare, but I've met Jerry Doyle quite a few times, and every time, he has nothing but hatred for O'Hare, even after all these years.

I've read many chats with O'Hare and he has only said nice things about Jerry:

[Jerry and Bruce] are both good guys.

Jerry Doyle is definitely the jokester on the set.

[Q: Any funny stories?] There was a time when I was supposed to lead everybody and walked out very officiously, and said to the crew "follow me." At which point, they all turned on camera and walked in the opposite direction. That was engineered by Jerry Doyle, by the way, who set me up.

It's a pity, too, because I thought they played off of each other on camera really well.

It's a really interesting thing. You never know who will have chemistry on camera. I thought Michael and Jerry really felt natural together on-screen. It didn't have the same natural flow with Bruce.

 

[Phily B]

I thought the music was very intrusive, and the psi-cop episode was really really cheesy - I think I nearly quit about there. I agree that Garibaldi/Sinclair had good on screen chemsitry though, I liked Sinclair but there was something that he lacked with a lot of others. He was really really stiff sometimes.

 

[Loupjo]

Most first seasons don't go on record as being the best season. It takes time sometimes for a show to find its footing.
My main problem with B5 Season 1 is that there was too much filler material. Episodes that were just there because they needed an episode. These often tend to be a bit generic.

However whenever I rewatch B5 I actually enjoy most episodes nowadays. There's only one or two throughout the show that I don't really enjoy watching. I quite like S1 now. I prefer arc related material but good stand alone episodes are not always a bad thing. And I definitely prefer Sinclair to Sheridan. Sheridan grew on me but I liked that character of Sinclair a lot. I also think O'Hare is a fine actor. Well in this role anyway. I haven't seen him in anything else. He did a fine job as Sinclair. It really would have been interesting to see 5 seasons of B5 with Sinclair.

 

[Loupjo]

Had no idea about Doyle/O'Hare. Have never really read anything about B5 actors. On screen they indeed had chemistry. It was really believable that Sinclair and Garibaldi were close friends. I never got that vibe with Sheridan and Garibaldi but then I think that also was intended. They didn't know each other and it took time for the characters to develop a friendship and then when they were friends the whole s4 arc occured.